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[VideoCardz] AMD Radeon RX 480 to cost 199 USD - Page 49  

post #481 of 1250
Did the 3d mark leak show it being faster than 980 and 390x?
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post #482 of 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by guttheslayer View Post

Did the 3d mark leak show it being faster than 980 and 390x?

I think it did
    
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post #483 of 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

This event was a cringefest once again!

I will never waste my time with such a self-shaming presentation. Why are the AMd events always so unprofessional? Does nobody speak english at an american company?

Everyone seems happy for the RX480 @200$+. I say this is not enough. New games will be made for 980 Ti / 1070 performance class. Next year Vega and the rumored GP102 will raise the bar even higher. In my opinion a card like the RX480 will be an upgrade into a deadend, except the player is reducting details dramatically or plays older games only.

Besides this, AMD seems to have cheated in the Ashes Benchmark.

games will be made with high end in mind yes, but high end regardless isn't the market demographic, its the minority. there's a reason why. simply take the top 5dgpus from both AMD and Nvidia(according to steam)

Nvidia: 970/960/750 ti/660/650
AMD: R9 200(representing the 270-290X)/HD 7900/HD 8800(lol oem)/HD 7700/HD7800 (r9 300 not registered correctly on steam)

what do they all have in common, they are all not x80+ cards or fury+ cards and all as of hte moment have a value between 100-300$ for the most part
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post #484 of 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faksnima View Post

Kyle's piece reeked of the jaded bitterness of a scorned lover.

Kyle isn't wrong those, this product is alot slower than people anticipated, and as a result AMD has to charge relatively little money for their product. And all one has to do is look at the pricing in the chart BOM in the chart below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dudewitbow View Post

Memory is still a relatively sizeable chunk of manufacturing cost. given an old 2011 chart on costs
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

for the 580, the memory on it took 13% of the total graphics card cost, this was the 1.5GB model so the 3gb would be twice that(26%, which is a lot relative to the cost)

albeit buying memory chips has decreased in price, the amount being used on a board has increase offsetting the price decrease. If applied today, it still probably cost a decent amount to put memory chips on a board.

The cost of this chip is around 80 dollars for a full chip and 70-60 dollars for a cut down chip. Wafer prices are about 60-80% higher than 40nm. Considering Polaris 10 is in the same thermal, die and performance range as a 6870, the rest of the costs should be similar. I Suspect 8gb of 2ghz ddr5 is more expensive than 1gb of ddr5 back in the day. Add in missing parts like production and packaging which add another 15 to 20 dollars on top of the cost and basically you have a very small margin on this chip.

e.g 116+(30 additional wafer cost) + 15 dollars for packaging and manufacturing, which are not included above and margins for board partners and margins for retailers and distributers.

So if AMD if it costs AMD 80 dollars to make this, it they are selling it for around 120 to board partners.

120 for GPU
+ 66 board parts.
+15 for packaging and assembly.
= 201
201*1.1 for board partner margin= 221
221*1.1 for retailer margin = 243

with the rest covering logisting and shipping.

A 33% margin on top end SKU is no good. This is because margins get worse down the food chain.

And the margins for their next cut down gets even worse.

To sell the part for 200 dollars, AMD can only charge 80 dollars for a part that costs them 65 to make.

80 for GPU
+ 66 for board parts
+ 15 or packaging and assembly
= 161
161*1.1 board partner margin = 177
177*1.1 retailer margin = 195
with the rest covering logistics and shipping.

80-65/80 = 19% gross margin.

This is bad because at these margins, it's hard for AMD to make money. AMD had margins higher than these numbers and they lose money still. For the long run, we need AMD to make money and no way would any company willingly accept these type of margins unless the market conditions forced them too.

What you have to realize, is this is only the gross margin which means alot of bills still have to be paid. Volume * gross profit per unit = gross profit. This still needs to cover the rest of AMD's expenses to determine if their is profit in the end.

Thus, after subtracting operating expenses, marketing, overhead and R and D, this will turn out to be a loss in the end. This is why AMD still loses money with roughly on average 30%-35% gross profit margin.

Consoles, can make a profit on these type of margins because there is no IP which is amoritized over time(the cumulative R and D spent). This is because the R and D is spent by Sony and MS. AMD has to cover the development costs on their won discrete chips, which is hundreds of millions of dollars.

This is hardly a success if your a stock holder because it simply doesn't leave much room for profit. Selling stuff close to cost only makes sense if there is no, asset to depreciate or no IP to amortize. This is not one of those situations.

This low price is a reactionary measure likely to 1070 pricing and a potential competitor in 1060.

If the 1060 is $200 dollars(which Nvidia may do, just to hurt AMD like the 970 series) includes a game, and is able to drop the pricing of AMD product just 20 dollars. AMD is now taking a loss. This is why low margins are bad.

This low price is a house of cards. Any further price drops, basically means AMD eats the loss on their entire R and D expenditure, which is hundreds of millions of dollars.

All things considering, AMD would rather have a faster product they could charge more for. If AMD could have charged 300 and 250-230 for their product, it would have made a world of difference in terms of profitability.

Marketing is working right now because it looks like AMD wanted to do this, but behind close doors, AMD is probably wondering about the future profitability of the unit.
post #485 of 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klocek001 View Post

AMD is giving you 970/980 performance for $200, nvidia is giving you 980Ti performance for $380. Way I see it amd is a step behind until October. But this means GP106 has competition, maybe it won't be as overpriced as GTX 960 was.

A TitanX ($1000) performance for $380. Wow, but, 256 bit.
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post #486 of 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111 View Post

Kyle isn't wrong those, this product is alot slower than people anticipated, and as a result AMD has to charge relatively little money for their product.

After I saw the 150W TDP for the RX480, I started to believe the story of Kyle. When a low-end chip is consuming similar as much heat as a way stronger one of the competition, something is wrong in the design. To reach the performance of the 1070, AMD would have to raise the heat / consumption even further. I can not see where the ueber-awesome energy consumption claims come from.
post #487 of 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

After I saw the 150W TDP for the RX480, I started to believe the story of Kyle. When a low-end chip is consuming similar as much heat as a way stronger one of the competition, something is wrong in the design. To reach the performance of the 1070, AMD would have to raise the heat / consumption even further. I can not see where the ueber-awesome energy consumption claims come from.


part of the reason possibly is that pascal probably doesn't have a hardware scheduler(the thing separating AMD AsyncCompute to Nvidia) since pascal is for the most part similar to Maxwell. The last time there was a physical sceduler was on Fermi, and you already know how fermi's power consumption is.
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post #488 of 1250
I see it will go head to head with the gtx 1060 for performance
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post #489 of 1250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

After I saw the 150W TDP for the RX480, I started to believe the story of Kyle. When a low-end chip is consuming similar as much heat as a way stronger one of the competition, something is wrong in the design. To reach the performance of the 1070, AMD would have to raise the heat / consumption even further. I can not see where the ueber-awesome energy consumption claims come from.

The 1070 uses 220 watts though.
post #490 of 1250
Kinda feel like nothing really changed architecturally for performance... pretty much just a shrunken 290 with slightly better clocks... oh well, i guess we'll see more in a month.
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