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[AS] Overwatch Sales Top Seven Million – One of the Most Successful Global Game Launches of All Time - Page 18

post #171 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by kylzer View Post

Why do people think this will become a competitive esports game like dota or cs

It's like saying tf2 is a competitive esports game.
It doesn't need to become, it already is one. Teams, tournaments and viewers.

Also, tf2 was competitive for some time as well.
post #172 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZealotKi11er View Post

Yeah. You got it 100% right. Skill floor in Overwatch is very low. That is the great thing about this game. The ceiling is only up to the players that play it. The more people that play it the higher it is.

That's not how skill ceilings work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kylzer View Post

Why do people think this will become a competitive esports game like dota or cs

It's like saying tf2 is a competitive esports game.

I thought they were?
post #173 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by kylzer View Post

Why do people think this will become a competitive esports game like dota or cs

It's like saying tf2 is a competitive esports game.

Because it is already becoming a competitive esports game?

There's currently a bidding war between Fnatic and Manchester United for a particular Overwatch team.

TF2 was also too early - the idea of esports was too narrow back then. If we had Twitch at the same levels then that we do now, it probably would have been a lot better. Now, it's just seen as old, so even though we have Twitch people just don't care.
post #174 of 312
https://www.reddit.com/r/Overwatch/comments/4o1uiv/overwatch_patch_notes_june_14_2016/

RIP Widow and Mcree. Widow full charged now only does 120 damage for body shots so no more 1 shotting 150hp heroes. Headshot damage remains the same at 300 damage for a charged shot. Mcree i would say got hit a bit harder with the nerf bat. Oh well, good thing i'm a pharah main biggrin.gif
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post #175 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

That's not how skill ceilings work.
I thought they were?

How does it work then? It's same with eveything else. The reason you have so many Pro players in games like Dota 2 is because so many people play it and only the best make it to the top. Less playes less pool of people to make it to the top. A Pro Dota 2 player is more "pro" than a Overwatch or Heros of the Storm because they have not gone through the selection.
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post #176 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZealotKi11er View Post

How does it work then? It's same with eveything else. The reason you have so many Pro players in games like Dota 2 is because so many people play it and only the best make it to the top. Less playes less pool of people to make it to the top. A Pro Dota 2 player is more "pro" than a Overwatch or Heros of the Storm because they have not gone through the selection.

The ceiling is not made by the players but the game, that's how it works.

You could have the best aim in the world and you'd just an average player with anyone but Widow which is already Overpowered and a huge nerf is coming her way, I have never been good at snipping in BF4 and yet I can carry an entire team on Quick Play with Widow.

But to answer your question again, the ceiling is not made by the players but the game, that's how it works.
post #177 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

The ceiling is not made by the players but the game, that's how it works.

You could have the best aim in the world and you'd just an average player with anyone but Widow which is already Overpowered and a huge nerf is coming her way, I have never been good at snipping in BF4 and yet I can carry an entire team on Quick Play with Widow.

But to answer your question again, the ceiling is not made by the players but the game, that's how it works.
Well that is not entirely true. Players in competitive have a habit of breaking the so-called skill ceiling by doing all kinds of weird stuff that the developer never considered.

In this game however i got the feeling that part will be more based on strategy then aiming.
For instance back in the beta Zenyatta's orb didn't go away when out of LoS. Then the players thought of going double Zenyatta double Genji and it sorta broke everything. They broke the skill ceiling, just not the one that required aim but the strategy part.

I am so looking forward how this game will evolve in the coming years. Loads of insane and wacky combination will be found out that will put a match upside down.
I just pray to the sun they don't do hero limits anywhere.
Edited by Assirra - 6/14/16 at 1:18pm
post #178 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assirra View Post

Well that is not entirely true. Players in competitive have a habit of breaking the so-called skill ceiling by doing all kinds of weird stuff that the developer never considered.

In this game however i got the feeling that part will be more based on strategy then aiming.
For instance back in the beta Zenyatta's orb didn't go away when out of LoS. Then the players thought of going double Zenyatta double Genji and it sorta broke everything. They broke the skill ceiling, just not the one that required aim but the strategy part.

I wouldn't call those people "Skill Ceiling Players" if they do something anyone else can do, like using 2 Zenyattas and 2 Genjis, they might have been genius for figuring out new metas, but then everyone can do the same and it takes them no skill to do it.

Also if competitive players break anything on this game doing weird stuff like in TF2 or World of Warcraft I'm certain Blizzard would hastily patch it down.
post #179 of 312
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post #180 of 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mand12 View Post

If the skill ceiling is so low, why aren't you at it?

Just because things aren't exactly the same does not mean the skill ceiling is lower. Is fall damage and ammo management really that important? What skills does *not* having them encourage in the game, that TF2 doesn't allow? What is it about Ultimates that make you think that skill isn't required to generate them or use them? They tried making Torbjorn need to get scrap to build a turret, but it ended up as being crappy gameplay. Is it a higher skill to force yourself through a bad design, or is a higher skill level encouraged by freeing you up to focus on things that actually matter?

People whine about "omg lower skillcap" when they don't even understand what being highly skilled means.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy9000 View Post

Not a single one of those things has anything to do with skill ceiling.

The bait! You can't make Torbjorn use scrap for a sentry when you can't rely on scrap being readily available. You can't use ammo since the game has no ammo and no need for ammo management.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy9000 View Post

The ultimate ability isn't always up, so it doesn't even change the skill needed to play that class. If you can't aim except when the ultimate is up, you aren't going to help your team much.

Personally, I don't find moments in Overwatch to be as satisfying as moments in TF2. Airshots, sniping, medic picks, etc. just don't feel as gratifying. I don't have to work as hard for medic picks, and Mercy's death doesn't erase her ability to pop her ultimate...unlike an ubercharge.

Again, not a single one of your argument addresses skill ceiling. A skill ceiling would mean there is no room for improvement via gameplay.

What you are actually talking about is skill floor, or the minimum skill required to "play" the class. Widowmaker is going to have a higher "floor" than winston, because you will be completely useless until you can hit something with the sniper. Still, just because Winston doesn't have to aim doesn't mean a skilled player won't be insanely more effective than a less skilled player.

Overwatch has overall a lower skill floor than TF2, making it easier for casuals to get in to, but the skill cap is just as high.

It has a lower skill ceiling and floor than TF2. CSGO has a higher skill ceiling than TF2. That doesn't make TF2 a bad game. Overwatch is more casual game. At no point did I say it was a bad game. It's just not as challenging as TF2 to play once you know the maps and how the heroes work. Once again, it's not TF2 and doesn't play like TF2.
Edited by MedRed - 6/14/16 at 4:29pm
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