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[Newsweek] Microsoft’s ‘malware-like’ Windows 10 automatic upgrades cost anti-poaching nonprofit thousands, group says - Page 14

post #131 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by jagdtigger View Post

The main problem here is that this problem never even should existed in the first place... Blaming the users for falling for underhanded tactics is just BS... jealoussmiley.gif

The underhanded tactics were only ever an issue because they didn't have their network on lockdown. Which it should have been if they were under strict data rationing because their network connection is charged by the megabyte.

Would it be great if MS didnt push Windows 10 with automatic updates, sure. Should the NPO have had better network practices, sure. There is not a victim/aggressor here, there are just dumb policies on both sides. The largest part of the blame falls on the network operator though, as they are responsible for data on their network, full stop.

I legitimately wonder if the situation was staged and written off as publicity spending. I mean, News Week even dropped an overt ad for their crowdfunding project.
Edited by KarathKasun - 6/9/16 at 6:03am
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post #132 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarathKasun View Post

So trivializing rape is better than a bad analogy? That speaks volumes.
I wasn't talking about the PC aspect of the analogy.
    
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post #133 of 161
The whole "they shoulda known better" completely misses the point, though. There are things that a sysadmin can reasonably be expected to stay on top of, but this is veering into a very strange territory. If your mission-critical server suddenly sprouts legs and walks away in the middle of a busy day at work, sure, you might say the sysadmins are at fault; after all, it's their responsibility to know the systems they work with, and really, what on earth did they think those hydraulic parts in the case were for? But it's still stupid waffle - nobody, sysadmin or not, could reasonably expect their machines to walk, definitely not on their own. The standards of what one can be reasonably expected to know are a lot more stringent for sysadmins and IT people than your average user, but I still don't see how an operating system replacing itself with another version without any intervention is a such thing.

It might be inappropriate, for a muscle car enthusiast, to complain about poor fuel efficiency because he didn't know the difference between two keyholes. It would still be perfectly reasonable for an ordinary driver to be angry, though; no ordinary driver should be reasonably be expected to know that the choice of keyhole affects the performance (I mean really, it's a bloody keyhole). But for a muscle car enthusiast, sure - if the different keyholes by some fancy mechanism offer completely different driving characteristics, a motoring enthusiast driving a such car should probably know the difference. But we're not talking about driving characteristics here. This is a situation where, upon sticking the key to the other hole, the driver's seat is ejected to the moon. I mean, yea, he's a motor enthusiast so he probably should have taken a moment to find out why there's two different key holes, and hey, seriously, what did you think all that funny machinery under the seat was for? But it's completely out of this world to go on about how he really doesn't know crap about cars, he didn't do his job right, boo, stupid car person, do your research mane, haha noob lol, ur in moon now is ur fault enjoh new lyf. I don't think one can be reasonably expected to foresee an ejector seat and space-launch capacity to be fitted into a car, much less this functionality suddenly being activated upon doing something that usually results in your engine starting.

And I'm not exaggerating here either; it seems to escape people how absurd this Win10 upgrade scheme is. It's like I'm in a weird fantasy universe which just went through the a ludicrous, half-arsed retcon. It's not even about whether or not this is acceptable or morally justifiable or whatever - it's just absurd. Even my Android phone, which presumably keeps track of all my communication, movement, interactions, sleeping patterns and taste in fine legwear doesn't have the gall to upgrade itself unless I explicitly ask it to. Acceptable or not, no sane person, sysadmin or not, could reasonably expect an operating system to do this without any intervention on their behalf.
post #134 of 161
Android not self updating is somewhat iffy. Older version of the Google Store (before play store notably) auto updated everything by default. Your carrier can push OS updates on stock firmware too, without your consent (and it counts against your data cap in many cases). That's one of the reasons I have CFW on my SSGS4.
Edited by KarathKasun - 6/9/16 at 7:54am
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post #135 of 161
If you have updates set to manual, and manually install the update that installs GWX, will it automatically download the full windows 10 installer without user consent?
post #136 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarathKasun View Post

Android not self updating is somewhat iffy. Older version of the Google Store (before play store notably) auto updated everything by default. Your carrier can push OS updates on stock firmware too, without your consent (and it counts against your data cap in many cases). That's one of the reasons I have CFW on my SSGS4.
Nope, we have several phones from carriers in the family. If there is an update it will notify you to install it. If you dont allow it it wont update. And BTW you had(and still have) the ability to switch off the auto update in the store and it stayed like that and honored your decision, unlike GWX... rolleyes.gif,

@xxpenguinxx
Yes.
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post #137 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by jagdtigger View Post

Nope, we have several phones from carriers in the family. If there is an update it will notify you to install it. If you dont allow it it wont update. And BTW you had(and still have) the ability to switch off the auto update in the store and it stayed like that and honored your decision, unlike GWX... rolleyes.gif,

@xxpenguinxx
Yes.

The last round of updates had no "cancel update" option. Had to power down the phone to get the popup to go away. rolleyes.gif

As for the app store setting, you can do the same thing to Windows 7/8. I have not had a single PC change its mind about what policy I set for updates. If you have a system with GWX already applied/running, you can wipe the GWX folder and break permissions on it (set principal "everyone" to deny access), GWX will not load after that, and the W10 installation files will not download.
Edited by KarathKasun - 6/9/16 at 8:22am
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post #138 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarathKasun View Post

The last round of updates had no "cancel update" option. Had to power down the phone to get the popup to go away. rolleyes.gif

As for the app store setting, you can do the same thing to Windows 7/8. I have not had a single PC change its mind about what policy I set for updates. If you have a system with GWX already applied/running, you can wipe the GWX folder and break permissions on it (set principal "everyone" to deny access), GWX will not load after that, and the W10 installation files will not download.
Never seen a popup on adroid that is not disappeared after i pressed the back button... rolleyes.gif

As for GWX most people arent that tech sawy you have to acknowledge that. For these people the "only" option is to keep closing that annoying popup. Now MS changed that without warning thus tricking people into the upgrade.

Now regarding the topic at hand i have to say MS is the one at fault here. First off GWX should be an optional update(even if you select accept recommended updates as important ones) and should have an option from the beginning to say "no i dont want win10", and it shouldn't download anything without the users explicit permission.
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post #139 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeerPowered View Post

100% the fault of the NPO for not using their own SCCM/WSUS Server when they knew about Data Caps.


You don't have to disable Automatic updates. You can control which updates your computers receive, which download and which deploy.

I'm still trying to figure out how you know who what why and where their admins are, how they did or did not set their computers or how you are so damn confident you even know how to stop the Windows 10, after it appeared so many times inside unsuspecting updates or under security updates.

You are really smart on post event, yet you repeat the same BS others have been writing, without even knowing.
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post #140 of 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeerPowered View Post

Put to bed? You know nothing about how Windows Update works it seems.

A NPO that had known data caps should have setup its own SCCM and WSUS server. YOU CAN CONTROL UPDATES. You can choose which updates to deploy, which to download and which to Discard.

Ignorance is not an excuse.

The NPO is 100% to blame not Microsoft.

100% this

/thread.
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