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[Gamespot] Project Scorpio Is 4.5X as Powerful as Xbox One, Phil Spencer Says - Page 17

post #161 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

In addition to everything @GoLDii3 said...

Still not Haswell IPC. Or even close. You'd get sued for false advertisement, seriously. And you want to OC by 70% on a board with no VRM cooling? lachen.gif

Items still readily available for only one person. Not a sustainable solution for the millions of potential users.

Still did not list shipping costs. They are not all free shipping. Get out your calc. The motherboard alone if $10 shipping.

Still using a ghetto PSU that may kill everything. Looks can be deceiving. Johnny agrees. But it doesn't matter, because it sold. See 2nd point.

Because all consoles come with free shipping right, and please spare me, that CPU is 10-15%away from haswell and is at the very least 300% faster than the Jaguar processors in the PS4, also just 1 or 2 parts weren't free shipping, get over your console which have around 15% of this build's performance, stop creating issues where there are none, buy my R9 290 and be happy.
Edited by Dargonplay - 6/19/16 at 6:43pm
post #162 of 247
I don't think a father buying his son/daughter a present would go for your "ghetto" style pc Dargonplay tongue.gif I would, remembering back to when I was teenager I liked messing around with computer stuff, I think a 2nd's pc and pick up some cheap steam games could be the best money value option.
     
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post #163 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

As the Project Scorpio video states @ 2:40:

8 CPU cores
over 320 GB/s memory bandwidth
6 teraflops of GPU power

Truth be told, the memory bandwidth seems rather limited. I would have expected HBM2 integration at this point...

I disagree. The price of the new xbox with HBM2 would be extremely high. Itll be GDDR5 or GDDR5X, being the most cost effective and supplying plenty of bandwidth.
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post #164 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Morpheus View Post

I don't think a father buying his son/daughter a present would go for your "ghetto" style pc Dargonplay tongue.gif I would, remembering back to when I was teenager I liked messing around with computer stuff, I think a 2nd's pc and pick up some cheap steam games could be the best money value option.

It always was, it still is and it will always be the smartest option with the most value for our money thumb.gif
post #165 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

In addition to everything @GoLDii3 said...

Still not Haswell IPC. Or even close. You'd get sued for false advertisement, seriously. And you want to OC by 70% on a board with no VRM cooling? lachen.gif

Items still readily available for only one person. Not a sustainable solution for the millions of potential users.

Still did not list shipping costs. They are not all free shipping. Get out your calc. The motherboard alone if $10 shipping.

Still using a ghetto PSU that may kill everything. Looks can be deceiving. Johnny agrees. But it doesn't matter, because it sold. See 2nd point.

Because all consoles come with free shipping right, and please spare me, that CPU is 10-15%away from haswell and is at the very least 300% faster than the Jaguar processors in the PS4, also just 1 or 2 parts weren't free shipping, get over your console which have around 15% of this build's performance, stop creating issues where there are none, buy my R9 290 and be happy.

No, I won't spare you. You're straight up lying to try and make a point. That chip would be lucky to hit even 1/3rd of my score in any bench even if my chip were stock. It is 1366. Haswell is 3 generations after that. It's 5-15% per generation, and it's stacking numbers, not just additive.

100 + 10% = 110.

110 + 10% = 121.

121 + 10% = 133.

And every modern Haswell is clocked at 3Ghz+, not 2.66Ghz. An i3 will crush that chip. They are not close.

And Skylake cost the same as Haswell, and DDR4 cost the same as DDR3, so why are we even comparing to Haswell at all?


You can go into BestBuy or Gamestop and get a used PS4. No shipping.

Meanwhile, that motherboard of yours comes from China.


I will nickle and dime you until the end of time because you can't get it through your head that you're actively lying across the board. Costs, supposed "quality" on things you had to go to eBay for, absolute fake performance numbers, thinking anything you linked thus far in this thread would even dream of being within reach of 80% of any bench I care to run.

The list goes on.

And to make it even better, this magical list of your still only applies for one person. What about the next person? You used up all the best deals for this one example, so I have to ask, how much more expensive is the 2nd best rig? When your 290 is sold and gone?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Morpheus View Post

I don't think a father buying his son/daughter a present would go for your "ghetto" style pc Dargonplay tongue.gif I would, remembering back to when I was teenager I liked messing around with computer stuff, I think a 2nd's pc and pick up some cheap steam games could be the best money value option.

It always was, it still is and it will always be the smartest option with the most value for our money thumb.gif

Until it explodes because some idiot told you "na man, that Apevia PSU is fine, get that one and save $20".
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post #166 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

That chip would be lucky to hit even 1/3rd of my score in any bench even if my chip were stock. It is 1366. Haswell is 3 generations after that. It's 5-15% per generation, and it's stacking numbers, not just additive.

That chip uses exactly the same silicon than the i7 equivalent, which can hit 3.5GHz and 4.2GHz comfortably, but tuned for servers and power efficiency with lower clocks without the iGPU so you're wrong, you had a better point back when you criticized the motherboard, but you were wrong too, and funny you called that PSU a ghetto PSU while it is actually better than most, biased to hate smart value conscious builds? Don't hate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Meanwhile, that motherboard of yours comes from China.

Here is a great alternative for the Xenophobic, coming directly from Raleigh, North Carolina, U.S.A! U.S.A! U.S.A!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gateway-TBGM01-1-0-Socket-LGA-1366-Motherboard-Tested-Warranty-H8-/152128475287?hash=item236b905097:g:H6QAAOSwNuxXX4Yz

The Gaming Gateway TBGM01, great motherboard capable of decent overclocking, 3.5GHz should be a no brainer, 4GHz with ease, but all of that doesn't matter to you one bit, what matters is that is coming from the US but most importantly, Free Shipping, so what's next?

And no, I'm not lying, that's your head playing you tricks, you see at the moment I post these builds I and anyone can buy these components and build a PC with them, so how is it lying again? I'm not saying you will be able to build the same thing through a thousand years, I'm saying that at the moment I post it you can get it and build it, for 330$ or less, with 6 TFLOPS of Graphics and a i7 Quad Core making up for a PC with 4 to 4.5 times the RAW power of a console.

I'm not saying there's a mass production of Pre Built 330$ PCs coming with OEMs 290s, I'm saying that if you have two working brain cells right now you can build a 330$ PC outperforming any console.

You're just raging that a Xeon CPU that used to go for 800$ 5 years ago is now only 15$ and can actually crush any skylake i3 any day of the week, not only for gaming but general purposes, and can actually compete with i7 Skylake for gaming, when both are able to deliver over 150 FPS in 1080p (CPU Intensive at low resolution) in games like Overwatch, CoD, Battlefield ETC... creating a GPU Bound situation for even a GTX 1080 especially at 1440p.

Oh, and the 20$ PSU actually cost 130$ new, and it is 85% efficiency with Active PFC, the 4 rails on the PSU is actually a good thing, one for the CPU 6 Pin connector, 1 for the Motherboard 24 Pins, and 2 for a 6+8 Pin graphics card, I love how you think a Multi Rail PSU is somehow inferior to a single rail, wrong again.
Edited by Dargonplay - 6/24/16 at 8:58am
post #167 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

They always block those keys, I don't know where you guys are getting this BS, as soon as there is information about stolen keys steam, developers and publishers will lock down those keys.

Stolen keys aren't like physical goods, they can all be tracked down and dealt with.

In years upon years of buying from G2A I've never had any issue whatsoever.

Okay, sure.

Let's assume that G2A never sells a stolen key again, laughable as that premise is.

Then they're still selling out of region keys, which is still cutting devs off at the knees.

When devs set a price for a game they choose that price based upon what it will take for them to recoup the cost of the game's development and help fund the next one. They know where geographically the bulk of their sales are going to be, and they take into consideration price barriers possibly hindering sales.

So let's say I'm a dev and I've done my homework. I know that 65% of my game sales are going to be in the U.S. and Canada, 20% in Europe, 7% in Russia and the remaining 8% scattered throughout the rest of the world. Given the economic state of the bulk of my sales region I decide to set the game's price at $30.

Launch day comes around and lo, my homework is wrong for some reason. Only 25% of my sales are coming out of the U.S. and Canada and for some reason my game has been a roaring success in Trinidad and Togabo, sweeping up 40% of my total units sold, for a grand sum of $8 a copy instead of $30.

As a developer, especially a small time developer, you're screwed. As a PC gamer you're helping usher in a new era of region locking games down so hard that people in Europe are going to get segmented into incredibly small multiplayer communities and in the U.S. where many (millions) people have crappy ISP's that route through overseas servers during prime time as a means of throttling data usage you just won't be able to log in to multiplayer games during those hours because it looks like you're using a VPN to hide your region.
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post #168 of 247
Westmere doesn't have anywhere near Haswell IPC. Nor do Xeons have any special tuning over their consumer equivalents. Any differences come from binning (which often isn't any different) and what features were enabled/disabled, all of which is done quite late in manufacturing.

Anyway, performance of a budget gaming PC is really neither here nor there. No potential build presented by anyone in this thread is going to be a worse PC than the console it was built to compete against, nor is any proposed build, new, used, or whatever, likely to have a slower CPU than the eight-core Jaguar parts that are in current consoles.

As for LGA-1366 parts in particular, I tend to shy away from recommending new builds based on them at this point. The CPUs are dirt cheap for the performance they provide, but the platform is old and so are all the boards based on it. Finding worthwhile samples that aren't getting close to wearing out is getting harder, and finding replacements for ones that go bad will be problematic before long.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ganf View Post

So let's say I'm a dev and I've done my homework. I know that 65% of my game sales are going to be in the U.S. and Canada, 20% in Europe, 7% in Russia and the remaining 8% scattered throughout the rest of the world. Given the economic state of the bulk of my sales region I decide to set the game's price at $30.

Launch day comes around and lo, my homework is wrong for some reason. Only 25% of my sales are coming out of the U.S. and Canada and for some reason my game has been a roaring success in Trinidad and Togabo, sweeping up 40% of my total units sold, for a grand sum of $8 a copy instead of $30.

As a developer, especially a small time developer, you're screwed. As a PC gamer you're helping usher in a new era of region locking games down so hard that people in Europe are going to get segmented into incredibly small multiplayer communities and in the U.S. where many (millions) people have crappy ISP's that route through overseas servers during prime time as a means of throttling data usage you just won't be able to log in to multiplayer games during those hours because it looks like you're using a VPN to hide your region.

Should probably have priced your game at $15 dollars a licence, everywhere.

Someone buying cheap keys isn't likely to be buying more expensive, even if the cheap ones weren't available. Region locking won't change that, it will just make the titles it affects less desirable overall.

I'm far worse for devs who only publish through these platforms than consumers who purchase out of region keys: I don't play their games at all and they get nothing from me.
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post #169 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

That chip would be lucky to hit even 1/3rd of my score in any bench even if my chip were stock. It is 1366. Haswell is 3 generations after that. It's 5-15% per generation, and it's stacking numbers, not just additive.

That chip uses exactly the same silicon than the i7 equivalent, which can hit 3.5GHz and 4.2GHz comfortably, but tuned for servers and power efficiency with lower clocks without the iGPU so you're wrong, you had a better point back when you criticized the motherboard, but you were wrong too, and funny you called that PSU a ghetto PSU while it is actually better than most, biased to hate smart value conscious builds? Don't hate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

Meanwhile, that motherboard of yours comes from China.

Here is a great alternative for the Xenophobic, coming directly from Raleigh, North Carolina, U.S.A! U.S.A! U.S.A!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gateway-TBGM01-1-0-Socket-LGA-1366-Motherboard-Tested-Warranty-H8-/152128475287?hash=item236b905097:g:H6QAAOSwNuxXX4Yz

The Gaming Gateway TBGM01, great motherboard capable of decent overclocking, 3.5GHz should be a no brainer, 4GHz with ease, but all of that doesn't matter to you one bit, what matters is that is coming from the US but most importantly, Free Shipping, so what's next?

And no, I'm not lying, that's your head playing you tricks, you see at the moment I post these builds I and anyone can buy these components and build a PC with them, so how is it lying again? I'm not saying you will be able to build the same thing through a thousand years, I'm saying that at the moment I post it you can get it and build it, for 330$ or less, with 5 TFLOPS of Graphics and a i7 Quad Core making up for a PC with 4 to 4.5 times the RAW power of a console.

I'm not saying there's a mass production of Pre Built 330$ PCs coming with OEMs 290s, I'm saying that if you have two working brain cells right now you can build a 330$ PC outperforming any console.

You're just raging that a Xeon CPU that used to go for 800$ 5 years ago is now only 15$ and can actually crush any skylake i3 any day of the week, not only for gaming but general purposes, and can actually compete with i7 Skylake for gaming, when both are able to deliver over 150 FPS in 1080p (CPU Intensive at low resolution) in games like Overwatch, CoD, Battlefield ETC... creating a GPU Bound situation for even a GTX 1080 especially at 1440p.

Oh, and the 20$ PSU actually cost 130$ new, and it is 85% efficiency with Active PFC, the 4 rails on the PSU is actually a good thing, one for the CPU 6 Pin connector, 1 for the Motherboard 24 Pins, and 2 for a 6+8 Pin graphics card, I love how you think a Multi Rail PSU is somehow inferior to a single rail, wrong again.

I don't care what silicon it uses, as Blameless said, it's still socket 1366, and thus 1st gen i-series era. Derp. No amount of OCing is going to make it on par with a Skylake i3.

The point about it coming from China was that it's not free shipping. Thus, it is a $100 board, not a $90 one. God you're blind. The fact it had no name brought up concerns about drivers, but I guess you don't care if you have a working SATA controller.

Exactly no one can buy what you linked. Parts you chose have sold already. Your build is in shambles, and even if you make another, exactly one person can build it. So again, what is the 2nd best rig you can make? The 3rd? 4th? How many until it becomes a $450 build? A $500 one? If someone asks for a $700 computer, we can give them a PCPP link and the next 100 people will be able to go buy it.

Then it isn't a solution for the Console gamer that wants to go PC. It's a fantasy you have about garbage.

I'm not raging at all, the FACT is a stock Skylake i3 has 92% more single thread performance than that beat up used and abused Xeon. And will consume a fraction the power.

The Zalman PSU was fine. It got a 9/10 on JohnnyGuru. ... But it sold before I could bring up the link, so lol. No one can buy it now.


Absolutely nothing you build will be able to compete in Performance, Quality, and Cost with a PS4 or xBone. It's just that simple. You're constantly having to rely on 5+ year old parts that have been abused all their lives to make a point, and you're still not cheaper, or even remotely close in quality.
Edited by KyadCK - 6/20/16 at 9:23am
Forge
(17 items)
 
Forge-LT
(7 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel i7-5960X (4.625Ghz) ASUS X99-DELUXE/U3.1 EVGA 1080ti SC2 Hybrid EVGA 1080ti SC2 Hybrid 
RAMHard DriveCoolingOS
64GB Corsair Dominator Platinum (3000Mhz 8x8GB) Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 512GB EK Predator 240 Windows 10 Enterprise x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
2x Acer XR341CK Corsair Vengeance K70 RGB Corsair AX1200 Corsair Graphite 780T 
MouseAudioAudioAudio
Corsair Vengeance M65 RGB Sennheiser HD700 Sound Blaster AE-5 Audio Technica AT4040 
Audio
30ART Mic Tube Amp 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-4720HQ UX501JW-UB71T GTX 960m 16GB 1600 9-9-9-27 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
512GB PCI-e SSD Windows 10 Pro 4k IPS 
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Forge
(17 items)
 
Forge-LT
(7 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
Intel i7-5960X (4.625Ghz) ASUS X99-DELUXE/U3.1 EVGA 1080ti SC2 Hybrid EVGA 1080ti SC2 Hybrid 
RAMHard DriveCoolingOS
64GB Corsair Dominator Platinum (3000Mhz 8x8GB) Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 512GB EK Predator 240 Windows 10 Enterprise x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
2x Acer XR341CK Corsair Vengeance K70 RGB Corsair AX1200 Corsair Graphite 780T 
MouseAudioAudioAudio
Corsair Vengeance M65 RGB Sennheiser HD700 Sound Blaster AE-5 Audio Technica AT4040 
Audio
30ART Mic Tube Amp 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-4720HQ UX501JW-UB71T GTX 960m 16GB 1600 9-9-9-27 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
512GB PCI-e SSD Windows 10 Pro 4k IPS 
  hide details  
Reply
post #170 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by KyadCK View Post

I don't care what silicon it uses, as Blameless said, it's still socket 1366, and thus 1st gen i-series era. Derp. No amount of OCing is going to make it on par with a Skylake i.

You got it backwards, no amount of overclocking will ever make a i3 Skylake on par with that 800$ Xeon (Now 15$) at 3.5GHz, let alone 4GHz, which allows it to compete against the 6700K for gaming, and it would certainly never bottleneck a GTX 1070 or even 1080 even at 1080p, let alone 1440p

And guess what? There are thousands of others PSUs besides the two I posted, at the same price and of the same quality. That processor doesn't have any kind of shortage, and motherboards for X58 are readily available to purchase with "BUY NOW" options, let alone auctions where everything goes even cheaper.

The fact remains, I can build a PC for 350$ (Even less for Auctions purchases) with 6TFLOPS and blow not only the PS4 but also the PS4 NEO by 50% extra performance, you can complain about the X58 platform's age all day, that won't reduce my framerate or resolution one bit.
Edited by Dargonplay - 6/20/16 at 11:23am
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