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[Gamespot] Project Scorpio Is 4.5X as Powerful as Xbox One, Phil Spencer Says - Page 4

post #31 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dienz View Post

My laptop is 4.5 times as powerful as the Xbox One and has all the marketing flops. Flops for days. Even my bag has more than 6 floppy parts on it. =\

Phil Spencer is an idiot.

Microsoft is using the lack of knowledge of the average gamer to its advantage in their marketing parlance. "6 teraflops of GPU power" sounds like a lot on paper but it honestly doesn't mean anything...

Consider that an Intel Celeron G1830 and an R9 295X2 produces 11.5 TFLOPS for under a grand (Jan 2015) and still isn't very capable for 4K gaming. Do they honestly expect their box to output 3840x2160 at 60 frames per second? Not likely. But it's over a year away and with plenty of tech development until then, I guess we'll see.

You do realize that the Xbox Scropio is as powerful as a GTX 1070 if not slightly more powerful, and that a G1830 would greatly bottleneck a 295x2 while consuming enough power to melt any console when combined with that cards, while still having a terrible experience thanks to CrossFire in 90% of all current games? And even then TFLOPS can't be used to measure performance between different architectures, not reliably, just like the 980Ti have 5.5 TFLOPS and the R9 295X2 have 12 TFLOPS, which would suggest more than double the performance of a 980Ti but then you see the 295x2 doing just 18% better in benchmarks at BEST.

Also if the Xbox Scorpio does have a Zen CPU, I believe if priced around 550% it's got a nice value going for it, 8 cut down Zen Cores and a 1070 equivalent card on a console (RX 480X Custom Made for M$), even at 599$ that'd be great.

It will of course phase out and become outdated in a few years as everything in the tech world, but that is to be expected, even your 295x2 is already oudated.
Edited by Dargonplay - 6/16/16 at 5:04pm
post #32 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

You do realize that the Xbox Scropio is as powerful as a GTX 1070 if not slightly more powerful, and that a G1830 would greatly bottleneck a 295x2 while consuming enough power to melt any console when combined with that cards, while still having a terrible experience thanks to CrossFire in 90% of all current games? And even then TFLOPS can't be used to measure performance between different architectures, not reliably, just like the 980Ti have 5.5 TFLOPS and the R9 295X2 have 12 TFLOPS, which would suggest more than double the performance of a 980Ti but then you see the 295x2 doing just 18% better in benchmarks at BEST.

Also if the Xbox Scorpio does have a Zen CPU, I believe if priced around 550% it's got a nice value going for it, 8 cut down Zen Cores and a 1070 equivalent card on a console (RX 480X Custom Made for M$), even at 599$ that'd be great.

It will of course phase out and become outdated in a few years as everything in the tech world, but that is to be expected, even your 295x2 is already oudated.

You're aware that no official specifications or internal components have been released and what has been leaked is a guess at best right now...right?

People are only guessing at what "could" be and what we'll actually get is probably going to be lackluster.

Also, my tflops examples are just to show how arbitrary a number it is and that people shouldn't base performance on it.
Edited by Dienz - 6/16/16 at 5:13pm
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post #33 of 247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

You do realize that the Xbox Scropio is as powerful as a GTX 1070 if not slightly more powerful

In late 2017, the 1070 will be relative in performance to the top card as the HD 7850 was to the Titan back in 2013 when the Xbox One was released... It might be slightly better in comparison to its predecessor but expect there to be a 35-50% performance gap between the upcoming consoles and the top GPU around release.
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post #34 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dienz View Post

You're aware that no official specifications or internal components have been released and what has been leaked is a guess at best right now...right?

People are only guessing at what "could" be and what we'll actually get is probably going to be lackluster.

The only thing we don't know is what the CPU will be, it is assumed it'll be Zen but we don't know that, what we do know is that the GPU will be faster than the RX 480 with 5 TFLOPS, 1 TFLOP faster, since AMD have only one architecture at the moment (Polaris) then that's the only thing they will be able to use on these consoles, as to which you can infer that the Xbox Scorpio does have a custom made Polaris with bigger, more complete CUs, a later to be released RX 480X most likely.

Since the RX 480 is believed to sport 980 performance, assuming this is right, then a RX 480X with 1 extra TFLOPS should give around 18% performance above the RX 480, putting it just 5% below a GTX 1070.

We know for a fact that the Xbox Scorpio, if what Microsoft is saying is true, which should be true, have an almost 20% more powerful GPU than what we'll get with the RX 480.

All in all that Xbox should have no issues playing games at 4K 60 FPS, considering the fact that consoles are so close to metal, so while having the performance of a Titan X they will be able to muster way more performance than what we can achieve with the same hardware on PC DX11 and even DirectX 12 because of the inherent way programmers exploit closed and close to metal hardware consoles.
Edited by Dargonplay - 6/16/16 at 5:21pm
post #35 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

The only thing we don't know is what the CPU will be, it is assumed it'll be Zen but we don't know that, what we do know is that the GPU will be faster than the RX 480 with 5 TFLOPS, 1 TFLOP faster, since AMD have only one architecture at the moment (Polaris) then that's the only thing they will be able to use on these consoles, as to which you can infer that the Xbox Scorpio does have a custom made Polaris with bigger, more complete CUs, a later to be released RX 480X most likely.

Since the RX 480 is believed to sport 980 performance, assuming this is right, then a RX 480X with 1 extra TFLOPS should give around 18% performance above the RX 480, putting it just 5% below a GTX 1070.

We know for a fact that the Xbox Scorpio, if what Microsoft is saying is true, which should be true, have an almost 20% more powerful GPU than what we'll get with the RX 480.

All in all that Xbox should have no issues playing games at 4K 60 FPS, considering the fact that consoles are so close to metal, so while having the performance of a Titan X they will be able to muster way more performance than what we can achieve with the same hardware on PC DX11 and even DirectX 12 because of the inherent way programmers exploit closed and close to metal hardware consoles.

Well if you're right then it'll be an awesome machine and I hope MS delivers. Maybe I'll pick one up.. and maybe the PS4 Neo will be worthwhile as well. I guess we'll see. thumb.gif
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post #36 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dienz View Post

Well if you're right then it'll be an awesome machine and I hope MS delivers. Maybe I'll pick one up.. and maybe the PS4 Neo will be worthwhile as well. I guess we'll see. thumb.gif

The PS4 NEO is 50% slower than a Xbox Scorpio, just like I said people to get a PS4 before over the Xbox One I shall say they should get an Xbox Scorpio over the PS4 NEO unless the PS4 exclusives are really that important!
post #37 of 247
I think 4K resolution will be the norm but only 30FPS on AAA titles.

It doesn't work linearly but If the XB1 can reliably do 60FPS at 1600x900p (1.44MP) then 4.5X that is 6.48MP.

4K is 8.3MP to drive so about 25% more pixels to push than the 4.5x would allow. Add in other inefficiencies and the drop to 30FPS is inevitable

I'd wager people wouldn't be able to notice 1800p if devs wanted the framerate
    
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post #38 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Syan48306 View Post

Who actually has a 4K TV? 4K PC mointors? That I can understand but 4K TV?

Personally, I'm interested in how this Xbox behaves on regular 1080 monitors. biggrin.gif

I have a 4k tv.....
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post #39 of 247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

In late 2017, the 1070 will be relative in performance to the top card as the HD 7850 was to the Titan back in 2013 when the Xbox One was released... It might be slightly better in comparison to its predecessor but expect there to be a 35-50% performance gap between the upcoming consoles and the top GPU around release.

It should be quite a bit better than that; the 1070 is a cut down 314mm^2 GPU, the 7850 is a cut down 212mm^2 CPU, so GP102/Vega would have to be ~750+mm^2 to make the same difference. I agree with your point, though, the Scorpio isn't going to be in the same league as top-end cards at the time of its release. Once high-end GPUs broke 400mm^2 and 150W, it became completely impractical to put one in a console.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SyncMaster753 View Post

I think 4K resolution will be the norm but only 30FPS on AAA titles.

It doesn't work linearly but If the XB1 can reliably do 60FPS at 1600x900p (1.44MP) then 4.5X that is 6.48MP.

4K is 8.3MP to drive so about 25% more pixels to push than the 4.5x would allow. Add in other inefficiencies and the drop to 30FPS is inevitable

I'd wager people wouldn't be able to notice 1800p if devs wanted the framerate

I suspect that a lot of console games are going to adopt a method like Halo 5: try to maintain a given framerate, and dynamically drop the resolution if needed to do that. That seems to be the best way of ensuring framerates without greatly sacrificing eyecandy, at least that I've seen.
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post #40 of 247
Quote:
Phil Spencer Says

This guy says a lot of things. For instance, he wanted to irradicate Ultra-Wide, SweetFX, Multi Monitor, Mods, Access to .EXE's (UWP), CrossFire, SLI, Exclusive Full Screen, Screen Capture, FPS overlays, FreeSync and G-Sync. In other words, he wanted to get rid of PC gaming. How is this guy still allowed to walk freely? He should have been locked up on "grounds of insanity" long ago! Remove him from this current position immediatly. He's a complete fool.
Edited by BradleyW - 6/16/16 at 6:04pm
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