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NZXT H440 - Need triple radiator advice - Page 2

post #11 of 57
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Most custom loops are a single loop, often with no radiator between components. Loop water temps do not change much from before to after component block. That said, your 2x 980Ti's gentate several times the heat our 5820k does. Someone currently using H2O like @ciarlatano is more qualified at helping with radiator placement and loop order than I am.

And don't listen to 'use all radiators as intake' garbage talk. Sure, you can make all but the back exhaust intake, but where is all that intake flow supposed to go? Your system will only flow as much are into case and it can flow out of case. This means having 5 or 6 intake fans trying to push air into case and only 1x exhaust, the intakes can only push in the amount of air going out the 1x exhaust. End result is you have 5 or 6 fans that can only move as much air as the 1 exhaust, so your radiators don't have 5 or 6 fans of airflow, they have 1, maybe 2 fans of airflow.

For air to go in, it most be able to come out. tongue.gif

Yeah I agree on airflow. Right now I basically have two intakes on the front providing air for the two 140mm exhaust fans on my top 280mm radiator so they're pretty matched. Then there's the rear exhaust. I might add another fan in push/pull on my 140mm radiator just to add a little more airflow for the rear exhaust to circulate.

Everyone really has my attention piqued now about using something like a Swiftek AIO to do my first open loop. I'm just not sure about radiator coverage though since I have 2 x 980 Ti's that are heavily overclocked and easily pulling 400-450W of power each in the most intense circumstances.

I know someone said to get a different case, but I chose the H440 because I was fond of it's aesthetic design and layout for all of my other components and its size was perfect for what I was replacing. So I'm going to be sticking with this for now, until my next build anyways. I know it's a cramped case, but everything routed and managed neatly as I have it, I can actually facilitate very significant airflow and with both the top and the bottom having room for 360mm radiators each, certainly that would be enough coverage to cool what I have. I'm not expecting to try and exceed 1600MHz or anything on my 980 Ti's. I can maintain 1475 right now wit my exiting CLC's at 53C under load. I just to maintain cooling performance relative to my current quality and make the best use of my case for doing so, taking into account the second 980 Ti that's arrived..
post #12 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

And don't listen to 'use all radiators as intake' garbage talk. Sure, you can make all but the back exhaust intake, but where is all that intake flow supposed to go? Your system will only flow as much are into case and it can flow out of case. This means having 5 or 6 intake fans trying to push air into case and only 1x exhaust, the intakes can only push in the amount of air going out the 1x exhaust. End result is you have 5 or 6 fans that can only move as much air as the 1 exhaust, so your radiators don't have 5 or 6 fans of airflow, they have 1, maybe 2 fans of airflow.

For air to go in, it most be able to come out. tongue.gif

This is not really the correct way of thinking. This is only true if the case is 100% sealed. Very few cases are 100% sealed. The concept is called positive pressure. The air will find its way out. It does not have to exit out of a fan hole. Pushing hot air out of a RAD diminishes the efficiency and effectiveness of that RAD. You might as will remove that RAD from the system.
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post #13 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by apw63 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

And don't listen to 'use all radiators as intake' garbage talk. Sure, you can make all but the back exhaust intake, but where is all that intake flow supposed to go? Your system will only flow as much are into case and it can flow out of case. This means having 5 or 6 intake fans trying to push air into case and only 1x exhaust, the intakes can only push in the amount of air going out the 1x exhaust. End result is you have 5 or 6 fans that can only move as much air as the 1 exhaust, so your radiators don't have 5 or 6 fans of airflow, they have 1, maybe 2 fans of airflow.

For air to go in, it most be able to come out. tongue.gif

This is not really the correct way of thinking. This is only true if the case is 100% sealed. Very few cases are 100% sealed. The concept is called positive pressure. The air will find its way out. It does not have to exit out of a fan hole. Pushing hot air out of a RAD diminishes the efficiency and effectiveness of that RAD. You might as will remove that RAD from the system.

Exactly. I agree with this and the OP should know the other side of the opinion. Ambient air will ALWAYS cool a radiator better than warm air from the case. If only one component is under water then having an exhaust radiator can make sense in some situations because there will be much more warm air swirling around inside the case from the air cooled component and you don't want to push warm radiator air back into air cooled component, but when both components are under water then there is much less warm air swirling around so having radiators as intake will give the best cooling performance with ambient air, and then positive pressure and an exhaust fan will push the warm air out through any vent holes, cracks, crevices, etc.

There is an exception to this when you have overkill radiator space. When you are way on the other side of the fence with way too much radiator space then you will reach diminishing returns and can setup the rads and fans however you want. A lot of people do this so they can customize the setup to their desires and not be constrained by performance. But when your working with minimal or just the right amount of rad space then proper setup becomes important. Another kink in the scheme is every case and hardware setup is different so sometimes different setups have to be tested to find the optimal combination, it is well known that the H440 has some airflow restriction issues, especially in the front, that can cause headaches in getting a good performance setup with rads. There are basic fundamentals to follow when water cooling but there really isn't a "one size fits all" setup.

And before someone links the P/Q curve graph lets keep in mind that test is based off a sealed tube, and we all know a computer case is not a sealed tube.
 
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post #14 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by apw63 View Post

This is not really the correct way of thinking. This is only true if the case is 100% sealed. Very few cases are 100% sealed. The concept is called positive pressure. The air will find its way out. It does not have to exit out of a fan hole. Pushing hot air out of a RAD diminishes the efficiency and effectiveness of that RAD. You might as will remove that RAD from the system.
If you cannot see the logic in my statement you do not understand airflow.

That is the way airflow really works.

You do not have a grasp on reality here. Seriously.

The science of 'airflow' is 'Fluid Dynamics'
A computer case is like a water tank with pipes in and out of the tank being the vents and holes in the computer case. What goes in must come out .. conversely, what comes out must go in.

Small holes flow small amount

Big holes flow big amounts.


The vents are the main openings in the case and flow 99% of the air in and out of case.
The air does not 'find it's way out'.
The airflow into case simply does not flow as much air in.

If you don't understand that, don't bother replying to me because I will ignore your posts.
post #15 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

If you cannot see the logic in my statement you do not understand airflow.

That is the way airflow really works.

You do not have a grasp on reality here. Seriously.

The science of 'airflow' is 'Fluid Dynamics'
A computer case is like a water tank with pipes in and out of the tank being the vents and holes in the computer case. What goes in must come out .. conversely, what comes out must go in.

Small holes flow small amount

Big holes flow big amounts.


The vents are the main openings in the case and flow 99% of the air in and out of case.
The air does not 'find it's way out'.
The airflow into case simply does not flow as much air in.

If you don't understand that, don't bother replying to me because I will ignore your posts.

I fully understand your logic and fluid dynamics, but your concept is flawed. A computer case is 99% of the time not like a water tank. A computer case is not sealed to hold a liquid in. A computer case is like a sieve. Most PC cases are not precision pieces of work. The cases are not designed to be sealed. Air can and will escape from every crack and gap. Try to pull an hold a vacuum on a PC case. You will know what I'm talking about. The laws of fluid dynamics support my point of view. If there is a way out in a positive pressure system the air/fluid will find its way out. Air is compressible water is not, the characteristics air flow vs liquid flow are similar but not 100% the same.

And I could careless if you reply to my post or not. I'm not the one with the misunderstanding.
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post #16 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by apw63 View Post

I fully understand your logic and fluid dynamics, but your concept is flawed. .
No, you do not understand.
If you did you would see how flawed your post is. thumbsdownsmileyanim.gif
post #17 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by apw63 View Post

I fully understand your logic and fluid dynamics, but your concept is flawed. .
No, you do not understand.
If you did you would see how flawed your post is. thumbsdownsmileyanim.gif

So a computer case is a sealed water tank with pipes coming out of it? Besides saying intaking a radiator is "garbage talk" that's essentially what your logic was imo.

There is two differing opinions here and the OP has the benefit of hearing both sides and making the best decision for his needs. GL OP. smile.gif
 
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post #18 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radnad View Post

So a computer case is a sealed water tank with pipes coming out of it? Besides saying intaking a radiator is "garbage talk" that's essentially what your logic was imo.

There is two differing opinions here and the OP has the benefit of hearing both sides and making the best decision for his needs. GL OP. smile.gif
So no you try trooling me into saying something instead of being reasonable. thumbsdownsmileyanim.gif
post #19 of 57
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

So no you try trooling me into saying something instead of being reasonable. thumbsdownsmileyanim.gif

Completely weak
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post #20 of 57
garbage talk? i think someone needs to learn.
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