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AIOs Why they should only be considered a short term product. - Page 11

post #101 of 366
Something everyone forgetting is - setting up a custom loop is a pain in the ass.
post #102 of 366
It's comical how many people think the OP has some ulterior motive to get people to build custom loops, if anything people should/would go to a air rad, because the dudes that cool with sealed AiO's do so (IMHO) because they are to lazy to do custom loops, but still like to tell people they watercool, or because they see all these youtubers who they think they can trust,(because they are reviewers and you like to think you can trust a reviewer) using them every chance they get as if it is in anyways rational to use one, when in reality an air rad outperforms a sealed AiO's, and does so quieter.
post #103 of 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piraal View Post

It's comical how many people think the OP has some ulterior motive to get people to build custom loops, if anything people should/would go to a air rad, because the dudes that cool with sealed AiO's do so (IMHO) because they are to lazy to do custom loops, but still like to tell people they watercool, or because they see all these youtubers who they think they can trust,(because they are reviewers and you like to think you can trust a reviewer) using them every chance they get as if it is in anyways rational to use one, when in reality an air rad outperforms a sealed AiO's, and does so quieter.
I have absolutely nothing against air cooling but I also decided to go AIO with my last build. I'm running waterforce GPUs in sli. Could a air cooled GPU keep up? No bc when I originally purchased two regular xtreme GPUs the increased thickness was starving the top GPU this route that is not an issue. I am also running a h100i V2 in push pull. I have yet to see an air cooled CPU hit the same temps. Not saying it's not possible just saying there are benefits. In my case I had planned a custom loop build but ended up not building not out of laziness like you state but for other reasons. After pricing it out to stay around budget I either could run a custom loop or buy another 980TI so I could actually play in 4K. The $1000 I did not spend on custom loops allowed for higher grade ram, better MB and a 980TI while staying in budget. The performance increase from spending the money there was worth it to me to not run custom loop. I say this to point out that you should not be quick to judge AIO. Sometimes when people don't have tons of money to toss into a computer they fill a very needed gap in the market and for that I support them and their price point. Not everyone does it out of laziness and honestly custom loops are not hard to build at all so I don't get the thought process there.


Always destroying exergy
post #104 of 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by superkyle1721 View Post

I have absolutely nothing against air cooling but I also decided to go AIO with my last build. I'm running waterforce GPUs in sli. Could a air cooled GPU keep up? No bc when I originally purchased two regular xtreme GPUs the increased thickness was starving the top GPU this route that is not an issue. I am also running a h100i V2 in push pull. I have yet to see an air cooled CPU hit the same temps. Not saying it's not possible just saying there are benefits. In my case I had planned a custom loop build but ended up not building not out of laziness like you state but for other reasons. After pricing it out to stay around budget I either could run a custom loop or buy another 980TI so I could actually play in 4K. The $1000 I did not spend on custom loops allowed for higher grade ram, better MB and a 980TI while staying in budget. The performance increase from spending the money there was worth it to me to not run custom loop. I say this to point out that you should not be quick to judge AIO. Sometimes when people don't have tons of money to toss into a computer they fill a very needed gap in the market and for that I support them and their price point. Not everyone does it out of laziness and honestly custom loops are not hard to build at all so I don't get the thought process there.


Always destroying exergy
First of all, your GPU argument is a strawman as I am talking about CPU cooling, I would actually never trust one of those AiO solutions on my GPU simply because of VRM's, but hey maybe that is just me. Second a custom loop doesn't cost $1000, yet alone $1000 on top of whatever other cooling solution to pick. My first loop cost me less then $400, and every loop after that obviously cost much less. The whole "I don't want to spend $1000 on a loop" argument that many, many people have made in this thread is beyond idiotic.
post #105 of 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piraal View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by superkyle1721 View Post

I have absolutely nothing against air cooling but I also decided to go AIO with my last build. I'm running waterforce GPUs in sli. Could a air cooled GPU keep up? No bc when I originally purchased two regular xtreme GPUs the increased thickness was starving the top GPU this route that is not an issue. I am also running a h100i V2 in push pull. I have yet to see an air cooled CPU hit the same temps. Not saying it's not possible just saying there are benefits. In my case I had planned a custom loop build but ended up not building not out of laziness like you state but for other reasons. After pricing it out to stay around budget I either could run a custom loop or buy another 980TI so I could actually play in 4K. The $1000 I did not spend on custom loops allowed for higher grade ram, better MB and a 980TI while staying in budget. The performance increase from spending the money there was worth it to me to not run custom loop. I say this to point out that you should not be quick to judge AIO. Sometimes when people don't have tons of money to toss into a computer they fill a very needed gap in the market and for that I support them and their price point. Not everyone does it out of laziness and honestly custom loops are not hard to build at all so I don't get the thought process there.


Always destroying exergy
First of all, your GPU argument is a strawman as I am talking about CPU cooling, I would actually never trust one of those AiO solutions on my GPU simply because of VRM's, but hey maybe that is just me. Second a custom loop doesn't cost $1000, yet alone $1000 on top of whatever other cooling solution to pick. My first loop cost me less then $400, and every loop after that obviously cost much less. The whole "I don't want to spend $1000 on a loop" argument that many, many people have made in this thread is beyond idiotic.
Strawman or not it is effective and your true knowledge is shown by commenting on VRMs which simple research before opening ones mouth will show that both VRM and memory are being cooled by the block on the waterforce. Cooling is effective enough to allow my GPU to run at 1569 24/7 and never hit above 60C. If you notice I also meant jones my CPU which is running 1.44V at 4.9ghz and during stress test never hit above 64C. I would say they are very effective. I stand by what I said about them having a place in the market. If you do not agree by all means that's your right but telling others a bunch of BS based on non factual statements is not what this forum is for.

Just for the record I compiled a parts list needed to build a loop. Sure you can skimp on some parts but in order to build s custom loop that provides better cooling than an AIO here are the parts one needs. Feel free to tally Ho the total and get back to me.

P360 Kit: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-kit-p360
2x GPU waterblocks: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-fc980-gtx-ti-xg-nickel
2x GPU backplates: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-fc980-gtx-ti-xg-backplate-black
240mm radiator: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-coolstream-pe-240-dual
2x fans: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-vardar-f3-120-1850rpm
PWM splitter: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-cable-y-splitter-2-fan-pwm-10cm
Terminal: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-fc-terminal-dual-parallel-3-slot-plexi OR https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-fc-terminal-dual-serial-3-slot-plexi
4x fittings: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-acf-fitting-10-13mm-nickel
Spare tubing: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/tube-primochill-primoflextm-advanced-lrttm-12-7-9-5mm-crystal-clear-retail-3m
Spare coolant: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-ekoolant-evo-clear-concentrate-100ml


Always destroying exergy
post #106 of 366
What is non factual statement I said?

You said you needed to spend $1000 extra to do a custom loop, that is idiotic when each sealed AiO costs what? lie or misrepresentation I'll let you pick. Also are you actually implying that those AiO's are quiet at the performance marks you listed? lie, or misrepresentation i'll let you pick. Most people here have owned atleast one, so please tell me more about how I am the liar here lol...
post #107 of 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piraal View Post

What is non factual statement I said?

You said you needed to spend $1000 extra to do a custom loop, that is idiotic when each sealed AiO costs what? lie or misrepresentation I'll let you pick. Also are you actually implying that those AiO's are quiet at the performance marks you listed? lie, or misrepresentation i'll let you pick. Most people here have owned atleast one, so please tell me more about how I am the liar here lol...
Look I'm not going to derail the thread to argue with you. I'm not saying custom loops are not better. All I'm saying is they have their place in the market. My point to this was provide you reference that some people do not do it out of laziness and argue that 99.9% of air coolers do not work as well as a CLC. Are CLCs going to be around forever? No they won't as OCLC will take over this market now that it has a proven worth. Above OCLC custom loop is still king. Yes these are facts but my CLC cost me $90 on sale and works great. It allowed my to keep the important components nice and cool. Are they quiet while running full tilt? No but the variability built into the CLCs now days allow it to operate silently when idle which is good enough for the majority of users.


Always destroying exergy
post #108 of 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cakewalk_S View Post

I personally have used all different kinds of CLC (AIO) coolers.. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
from my experience, I've never had a pump fail on me. Even taking them apart numerous times and even modding the pump and adding a 240 rad to them..no issues. I just simply haven't had any issues....
Now, performance wise they're 2nd to none compared to my smaller air cooling. With a lapped cooler and decent fans the AIO cooler would definitely Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
out perform my air cooler anyday. However, I noticed my AIO cooler is louder than my air cooler, fans and pump...So there was a trade off. More noise for way better cooling.

Now as I've gotten older and into much smaller builds, I've gone back to air. Simply for size requirements, noise, and longevity. I've never had a pump fail in the 4+ years I've had AIO coolers but the loom of one going was enough for me to jump ship. I want my rig to last a longgg time, so I didn't want to take any chances.

And btw, there's no bearings on the AIO pumps. They're ceramic shafted impellers that spin between the motor magnets... the actual electric motor component is completely sealed off from the water..
.
That statement pretty well sums up how illogical your post is. biggrin.gif
Thing is a $50 air cooler will perform as well and quieter than a CLC, last much longer, and when it does need a component (fan) replaced is much cheaper to get.
post #109 of 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cakewalk_S View Post

I personally have used all different kinds of CLC (AIO) coolers.. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
from my experience, I've never had a pump fail on me. Even taking them apart numerous times and even modding the pump and adding a 240 rad to them..no issues. I just simply haven't had any issues....
Now, performance wise they're 2nd to none compared to my smaller air cooling. With a lapped cooler and decent fans the AIO cooler would definitely Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
out perform my air cooler anyday. However, I noticed my AIO cooler is louder than my air cooler, fans and pump...So there was a trade off. More noise for way better cooling.

Now as I've gotten older and into much smaller builds, I've gone back to air. Simply for size requirements, noise, and longevity. I've never had a pump fail in the 4+ years I've had AIO coolers but the loom of one going was enough for me to jump ship. I want my rig to last a longgg time, so I didn't want to take any chances.

And btw, there's no bearings on the AIO pumps. They're ceramic shafted impellers that spin between the motor magnets... the actual electric motor component is completely sealed off from the water..
.
That statement pretty well sums up how illogical your post is. biggrin.gif
Thing is a $50 air cooler will perform as well and quieter than a CLC, last much longer, and when it does need a component (fan) replaced is much cheaper to get.


I think you misread my post. I wasn't bashing AIO coolers, nor was I against air coolers, actually quite the contrary. I'm all for air cooling based on the longevity of the life of the fan and no potential leaks...etc...

In my experience I've had better performing AIO coolers than my air coolers, but I know some air coolers are right there in line with AIOs...
post #110 of 366
My Nepton 280L (which was on sale and has quite a strong pump) is my guinea pig; first AIO I've used in a personal build for any length of time

About 10k hours on the pump now with no noticeable degradation in performance. I'll see how it fares after another 20k hours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

Thing is a $50 air cooler will perform as well and quieter than a CLC, last much longer, and when it does need a component (fan) replaced is much cheaper to get.

I have some top-end heatsinks and none of them really rival the 280L I'm using in cooling performance, even when I use the same fans. At low noise levels, there isn't a terribly large difference, but as air flow increases, my heatsinks fall further and further behind.

Same pattern with all of my Intel hex core parts going back to the LGA-1366 days, as well as my AMD FX octo-core parts. Past about 200-250w of CPU heat production, getting heat to the fins becomes the limiting factor more than surface area or air flow, and this AIO is proving to be closer to my custom loops than to my air coolers.
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