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post #251 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by JackCY View Post

Missing something yes, that it's still behind NV in performance/power ratio. Good card/chip but it's that 1 step and a lot of $ in R&D behind, it's on par with Maxwell but not with Paxwell in perf/power. They need to bring the voltage down to 1.0V to be able to bring the power draw down and match nGreedia.
AMD made nice progress in this 1 step over Fury unfortunately Fury wasn't that big of a leap in perf/power and overall the $ invested into R&D is I bet much lower than what NV is pumping in to get these newer cards.

I agree with a lot of that...... I feel like AMD should have reduced the voltage and kept their clocks. Everyone I see is knocking voltage down to 1030-1050 and getting 1300mhz.... I suppose they left it a tad higher to avoid the "overclocker's dream" debacle of Fury. They figured if they left a little voltage on the table, people could overclock it a bit. In reality, they'd have been better to left the voltage increasing to the user since they are offering control of it up freely through wattman anyways.

My brother's card (Sapphire reference 8GB RX480) out of the box scores 14,300 @ 1266/2000, then at 1300 @ 1030mv with 2200mhz memory it is scoring 14,650 gfx in firetrike That's a $240 BOSS!!!

Here is my highest score with overclocked 390x @ 1200/1750 (high OC for 390's) GFX of 14,800+:
http://www.3dmark.com/fs/7975613

Not a suicide run, but a daily gameable set of clocks.

This morning he sent me a screen shot of his card at 1360 (I think, gotta check)/2250 @ 1060mv busting 15k GFX!!! This is all with a card with half the ROP's and half the memory bus, and 512 less shaders than the 390x. AMD did a damn good job with polaris if you ask me. Does it clock to 2ghz? No...... Does it stay under 150w stock at all times? Not quite..... But they didn't exactly put a billion dollars of R&D in this thing either.

And in those tests he ran on his card, power draw was like 180w with OC, and anybody overclocking knows power goes out the window anyways.... My 390x overclocked was licking 300w most of the time (which was still better than my 290's that would bounce around 320w with high core clock speeds!!!)

Point being, this card is stronger than launch reviews state..... The real capability of the card is being shown in the hands of the end users right now, especially after the 16.7.1 driver. Think about the fact that at launch a 290x got around 9,900 GFX score in firestrike....... now look at people scoring over 13,000 out of the box with 390's (using the same Hawaii core and slightly higher clocks, BUT WITH MUCH MUCH MORE MATURE DRIVERS).

Then ask yourself, where will RX 480 be after a year of driver maturation?

I know it isn't the 980 killer some hoped (hyped) it would be, but it is the exact card AMD said it would be, and they friggin delivered the goods on price/perf!!!! thumb.gif
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post #252 of 4666
180W for just the GPU (~250W for the whole card) is pretty outrageous for a 14nm GPU and especially for one this small frown.gif
post #253 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent Smith1984 View Post

I agree with a lot of that...... I feel like AMD should have reduced the voltage and kept their clocks. Everyone I see is knocking voltage down to 1030-1050 and getting 1300mhz.... I suppose they left it a tad higher to avoid the "overclocker's dream" debacle of Fury. They figured if they left a little voltage on the table, people could overclock it a bit. In reality, they'd have been better to left the voltage increasing to the user since they are offering control of it up freely through wattman anyways.

My brother's card (Sapphire reference 8GB RX480) out of the box scores 14,300 @ 1266/2000, then at 1300 @ 1030mv with 2200mhz memory it is scoring 14,650 gfx in firetrike That's a $240 BOSS!!!

Here is my highest score with overclocked 390x @ 1200/1750 (high OC for 390's) GFX of 14,800+:
http://www.3dmark.com/fs/7975613

Not a suicide run, but a daily gameable set of clocks.

This morning he sent me a screen shot of his card at 1360 (I think, gotta check)/2250 @ 1060mv busting 15k GFX!!! This is all with a card with half the ROP's and half the memory bus, and 512 less shaders than the 390x. AMD did a damn good job with polaris if you ask me. Does it clock to 2ghz? No...... Does it stay under 150w stock at all times? Not quite..... But they didn't exactly put a billion dollars of R&D in this thing either.

And in those tests he ran on his card, power draw was like 180w with OC, and anybody overclocking knows power goes out the window anyways.... My 390x overclocked was licking 300w most of the time (which was still better than my 290's that would bounce around 320w with high core clock speeds!!!)

Point being, this card is stronger than launch reviews state..... The real capability of the card is being shown in the hands of the end users right now, especially after the 16.7.1 driver. Think about the fact that at launch a 290x got around 9,900 GFX score in firestrike....... now look at people scoring over 13,000 out of the box with 390's (using the same Hawaii core and slightly higher clocks, BUT WITH MUCH MUCH MORE MATURE DRIVERS).

Then ask yourself, where will RX 480 be after a year of driver maturation?

I know it isn't the 980 killer some hoped (hyped) it would be, but it is the exact card AMD said it would be, and they friggin delivered the goods on price/perf!!!! thumb.gif

It's a shame the launch of this card has been so shaky, it really has some awesome potential. It kind of feels like it was rushed.

I'd love to see some gaming performance with these overclocks and undervolts, the Fire Strike scores I have been seeing are quite impressive.
post #254 of 4666
it certainly wasn't rushed, they were showing off samples back in december...
post #255 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Stilt View Post

180W for just the GPU (~250W for the whole card) is pretty outrageous for a 14nm GPU and especially for one this small frown.gif

Obviously I take your knowledge of GPU's very seriously so I have to ask, when the power draw is reporting 155-180w max in GPU-Z under load, what indication is there that the card itself is using 250w of power?
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post #256 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent Smith1984 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Stilt View Post

180W for just the GPU (~250W for the whole card) is pretty outrageous for a 14nm GPU and especially for one this small frown.gif

Obviously I take your knowledge of GPU's very seriously so I have to ask, when the power draw is reporting 155-180w max in GPU-Z under load, what indication is there that the card itself is using 250w of power?
GPU-Z report the GPU only power consumption, not the whole card.
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post #257 of 4666
i think he was trying to ask you how you actually arrived at 250watts.
post #258 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent Smith1984 View Post

Obviously I take your knowledge of GPU's very seriously so I have to ask, when the power draw is reporting 155-180w max in GPU-Z under load, what indication is there that the card itself is using 250w of power?

GPU-Z doesn't support telemetry reporting from the VRM controller at the moment. Therefore the power value it displays is the one obtained from the driver (calculated by power management). Take VRM losses into account (~ 80% efficiency at those current levels) and add the power consumed by the VDDCI plane and the memory (and their VRM losses) to that figure. You end up into the ~245W region.

Once GPU-Z is able to access the VRM controller, it can display the measured input and output powers measured with DCR. The input power will include the VRM losses too, however it will still lack VDDCI and memory consumption as they are regulated by separate VRMs.

Even at stock the delta between the GPU power draw displayed by GPU-Z and the actual power draw of the whole card is up to 45W.
Edited by The Stilt - 7/12/16 at 12:56pm
post #259 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mac View Post

it certainly wasn't rushed, they were showing off samples back in december...

Why I say I feel it was rushed is because people have been getting more performance by lowering the voltage and increasing the power limit which is quite peculiar, it's almost as if the reference cards have been given an excessive amount of voltage out of the factory.

This could be a yield issue to make sure the cards run without any stability problems. But we don't really know how many of them are stable at lower voltages so it's hard to say for certain.

There was also the PCI-E power draw issue which was promptly corrected with a new driver. With these two things in combination we would have seen lower power consumption numbers in reviews and possibly higher levels of performance.

There are also 8GB models masquerading as 4GB cards, this might just be to do with the stock levels of the 4GB models, so to stock more of them they used the 4GB bios on the 8GB cards.

AMD have released CPUs and GPUs with unlockable cores in the past, this time it's unlockable memory with the RX 480, what a bargain!

I suppose it's the same as any new hardware launch, problems are worked out and things improve.
post #260 of 4666
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Stilt View Post

GPU-Z doesn't support telemetry reporting from the VRM controller at the moment. Therefore the power value it displays is the one obtained from the driver (calculated by power management). Take VRM losses into account (~ 80% efficiency at those current levels) and add the power consumed by the VDDCI plane and the memory (and their VRM losses) to that figure. You end up into the ~245W region.

Once GPU-Z is able to access the VRM controller, it can display the measured input and output powers measured with DCR. The input power will include the VRM losses too, however it will still lack VDDCI and memory consumption as they are regulated by separate VRMs.

Even at stock the delta between the GPU power draw displayed by GPU-Z and the actual power draw of the whole card is up to 45W.

I knew I'd get a technical, yet still understandable answer out of you thumb.gif

I have seen a few articles about the card and they measured the cards power usage (don't recall how) and they did show the card using between 145-195w depending on the load. However, that is with the card throttling here and there. Once you crank that slider to 50% and get full power and full clocks, I can see how the thing might use more juice than it should. Still much better than Hawaii though.... but no, it's nowhere in realm of Pascal efficiency.
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