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I have PCI-E 75w limit question... - Page 2

post #11 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

ASUS GTX 950 2 GB (no power connector) - Average in gaming 74w / Peak 76w

I don't own this one, but i pretty sure it's could reach ~80w in FurMark.

Interesting, I would believe that Asus's attempt to stuff the 950 in <75W wasn't entirely successful but do you have a link to a power usage review for that 6-pin-less 950? I have been unable to find one. frown.gif

The 950 OC models seems to use up to 120+W but all the ones I could find reviews for also have 6-pin connectors.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

What does make you think it didn't ?

Every video card released that needs >75W also needs a 6/8-pin power connector.

300W over 5 1.1A 12V pins does not work, they never added or changed the pins for PCI-E so there is no way to deliver 300W to the PCI-E slot. Imagine the power delivery needed with a 300W load in each slot!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

3.0
F3H to FFh (x16 > x32 ?) = Power limit values above 300w.

What is this from? 300W is totally crazy from a PCI-E slot so I suspect that value does not represent what you think it does.
Edited by Asmodian - 7/3/16 at 5:46pm
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post #12 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post

Interesting, I would believe that Asus's attempt to stuff the 950 in <75W wasn't entirely successful but do you have a link to a power usage review for that 6-pin-less 950? I have been unable to find one. frown.gif

The 950 OC models seems to use up to 120+W but all the ones I could find reviews for also have 6-pin connectors.
Every video card released that needs >75W also needs a 6/8-pin power connector.

300W over 5 1.1A 12V pins does not work, they never added or changed the pins for PCI-E so there is no way to deliver 300W to the PCI-E slot. Imagine the power delivery needed with a 300W load in each slot!
What is this from? 300W is totally crazy from a PCI-E slot so I suspect that value does not represent what you think it does.



This one looks interesting to.
NVIDIA GTX 750 TI



141w peak - 1 loop - PCI-E only.


I found it here

Errata for the
PCI Express® Base Specification
Revision 3.0
https://pcisig.com/sites/default/files/specification_documents/PCIe_Base_r3_0_Errata_2014-10-23_clean.pdf

Errata for the
PCI Express® Base Specification
Revision 2.1
https://pcisig.com/sites/default/files/specification_documents/PCIe_Base_r2201_Errata_18Nov10.pdf
Edited by Eroticus - 7/3/16 at 5:59pm
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post #13 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

Motherboard can handle 4 130w CPUs, 8GPUs, but if single GPU is going to use more than 75w, this can burn it..

To be fair, the CPU has its own dedicated power cable because it draws so much. I'm not sure what the go-to standard on multi-socket boards is, but isn't it one 8-pin connector per socket? Regardless of what it is, it's a lot of power dedicated to the CPUs.

Additionally motherboards can't necessarily handle eight GPUs. If you've got PCIe risers that replace the existing 12V connection with one from, say, a Molex cable, then the card will pull 0A from the motherboard. Example here. It's a bit difficult to tell where the traces are/aren't on a black PCB (why else was green the default color for so long?) but I don't think the 12V pins are actually used here at all. If you plug those eight GPUs directly into the motherboard, then you'll have the issue I mentioned earlier: the 24-pin connector is only rated to draw 6A per wire, and both of them are barely enough for two GPUs, let alone another six.

Quote:
And yep, as i heard 295x doesn't have PCI-E verification.

Which, for such an expensive GPU, really doesn't matter. The systems it goes in can afford the extra power, cooling, etc. that it needs. Meanwhile the 480's MSRP for the expensive version is under a sixth that of the 295X2 (well, before it got reduced). AMD is aiming for affordable VR (i.e. 2013 flagship-tier performance at reasonable prices) which means you'll see a lot of sub-$1000 PCs using these. That means cheap motherboards, crap chipsets, and bad PSUs to hit a target price.
Edited by CynicalUnicorn - 7/3/16 at 6:02pm
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post #14 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

This one looks interesting to.
GTX 750 TI - No Power Connection

The average line is well below 75W...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

I found it here

Errata for the
PCI Express® Base Specification
Revision 3.0
https://pcisig.com/sites/default/files/specification_documents/PCIe_Base_r3_0_Errata_2014-10-23_clean.pdf

Errata for the
PCI Express® Base Specification
Revision 2.1
https://pcisig.com/sites/default/files/specification_documents/PCIe_Base_r2201_Errata_18Nov10.pdf

Yes, but what is the "TPH Requester Capability Register" or the "Slot Capabilities Register" used for? What do the values mean? What does my motherboard have set and when?

I am quite sure you cannot pull 300W from any 3.0 PCI-3 slot, why would even the GTX 1080 have 6/8-pin plugs if that was the case? Other video cards tested usually pull 50W or below.
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post #15 of 29
Thread Starter 
@CynicalUnicorn


What do you think about this one ?

NVIDIA GTX 750 TI



141w peak - 1 loop - PCI-E only.



@Asmodian

For safety and make it work on old PCI-E slots.

The guy that his PCI-E died from AMD Community had AM2+ board that support only PCI-E 2.0
Edited by Eroticus - 7/3/16 at 6:06pm
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post #16 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

@CynicalUnicorn


What do you think about this one ?

NVIDIA GTX 750 TI



141w peak - 1 loop - PCI-E only.

Look at the average line. rolleyes.gif
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post #17 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

@CynicalUnicorn


What do you think about this one ? Magic ?

NVIDIA GTX 750 TI

*snip*

141w peak - 1 loop - PCI-E only.

Niiiice. My system can withstand one of those, so a 480 should do just fine. thumb.gif

Yeah, peaking like that well over some TDP limit is to be expected. I don't think it's dangerous per se as long as it's for short pulses rather than sustained power draw, but I'm honestly not that familiar with the specifics of peak vs sustained power or current ratings.
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post #18 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post

Look at the average line. rolleyes.gif
Average is Average.

Highest supported is 75w so we need the highest jump...




The guy from AMD Community - HIS PCI-E isn't dead anymore, it was DUSTY. biggrin.gif



Do you know more reports ?
Edited by Eroticus - 7/3/16 at 6:13pm
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post #19 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

Average is Average.

Highest supported is 75 so we need the highest spike =P.




The guy from AMD Community - HIS PCI-E isn't dead anymore, it was DUSTY.



Do you know more reports ?

The spec is for the average so we don't need the highest spike, we need the average. tongue.gif

As for reports, I will agree that I doubt one or two of these is going to cause any problems in 99% of people's systems and I am not surprised that report was a false alarm either; they had undervolted the cards which should eliminate any concern.

I am simply arguing that the 480 is the first GPU I have seen that actually pulls too much power from the PCI-E slot, especially egregious because of the 6-pin already plugged in. I would be worried about crossfired overclocked 480s though. frown.gif
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post #20 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post

The spec is for the average so we don't need the highest spike, we need the average. tongue.gif

As for reports, I will agree that I doubt one or two of these is going to cause any problems in 99% of people's systems and I am not surprised that report was a false alarm either; they had undervolted the cards which should eliminate any concern.

I am simply arguing that the 480 is the first GPU I have seen that actually pulls too much power from the PCI-E slot, especially egregious because of the 6-pin already plugged in. I would be worried about crossfired overclocked 480s though. frown.gif


This one is pretty popular - 960 strix had it a little bit worse...


but yea, RX480 joined to the party...
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