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[Sapphire/WCCF] Sapphire adds Radeon 490 to Support Ticket Product Selection / 490 is dual-GPU - Page 10

post #91 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilles3000 View Post

It can't be much more than $500, otherwise it would make no sense at all to buy this card for anyone.

Well that is if its a dual GPU card at all, which I'm still not entirely convinced about.

You are right, if it is just two 480s slapped together, $500 to $600-$650 would make sense, given the 480 position. What is of interest as well is that if it is a dual GPU card, it would have to be two 480s if not Vega based. As AMD/RTG stated the 480 was a full chip I believe, almost positive they said this. That they didn't cut anything back on the GPU for 480 production....

So, what the Hell is it? Early Vega card making early moves for engineering tests......or a dual GPU 480?

A single GPU Vega card seems more believable over a dual GPU Polaris......if AMD did indeed state what I think they stated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatmario View Post

I dont think its dual gpu card, probably have 2800sp on single gpu

I believe AMD said they are shipping the full Polaris chip with the 480, and it isn't cut back. Again, someone please correct me if I am wrong on that.

EDIT:

The 480 is the full Polaris 10 chip.
Quote:
meaning that the forthcoming Radeon RX 480 video card is using a fully enabled chip.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/10424/a-bit-more-on-amds-polaris-gpus-36-16-cus

While the naming convention in the source of OT lends it to being Polaris, I just don't see them doing it, because it really doesn't make sense. You can't release the 480 as the full Polaris 10, with Vega just around the corner, and somehow shoehorn a dual Polaris 10 card in there. Dual Vega, sure, but someone at AMD is drunk if they think a dual Polaris is going to work out well.

Unless they a really drunk and release a $500 dual 480..........

Who the Hell knows!
    
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post #92 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clocknut View Post

If 490 is only dual Polaris 10, looks like my fear is true, Nvidia took AMD by surprise by their high clocked Pascal. Even the GPU efficiency proved that.
Heh. It's simply because NV has invested ... load of $$$ into making Paxwell.

AMD has made progress in efficiency, already has a working solution with HBM and the needed tech and supply, freed itself from TSMC, continuously develops free APIs and low level APIs, ...
NV has reduced the work of it's cores per cycle to get higher clocks, I'm sure they can keep on speed racing and raising that speed until 10PHz. It's simply a different approach and one that only works until the HW hits a physical limit. With all that insane money invested they did make some nice efficiency progress which shows but it was not always so, did they do something else? Any development that all can use and take advantage of? Nope. All proprietary stuff including overpriced Gsync cards, they don't even support the VESA Freesync. It's all proprietary, only for NV, trying to keep as much of the market locked into their NV ecosystem just like stupid Apple. Do they make nice GPUs? Sure. Do they support the community as a whole? No way.

---

Forget dual 480s folks.
post #93 of 104
Quote:
AMD has made progress in efficiency,
oh yeah, it matched 28nm Maxwell

Quote:
freed itself from TSMC
and went to the crappy GloFo
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post #94 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChevChelios View Post

oh yeah, it matched 28nm Maxwell
and went to the crappy GloFo

Compared to Nvidia, I think AMD will always trail behind in power efficiency. The GCN architecture is just not designed for it.
post #95 of 104
They can come close like 5-10% with HBM and/or dx12. but they won't beat nvidia's efficiency as long as they have GCN as base. plus they have more hardware too so that requires additional transistors and power. that hardware is mostly unused and thus wasting power when not utilized properly.
post #96 of 104
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by czerro View Post

AMD has released several dual-gpu cards, and crossfire still seems to be a profile-per-game prospect and kinda dependent on the developer of the game as well.

The good news is, dx12 games and vulkan titles are going to start releasing, so there should be much less workload for getting crossfire (and sli for that matter) to work across titles.

I would snag a cheap dual-gpu card though to play around with it, despite it will be a mixed bag performance prospect like every cf/sli setup.

To be realistic though, by the time DX12/Vulkan become the de facto standards, we will be a couple more hardware generations from where we are now.

It's definitely exciting though and will be an interesting card if it's price right below 500usd.

Remember the frame pacing problem with Crossfire though years back? Bad frame times caused major stuttering and hitching. Then eventually the media investigated the issue, which is around the time where FCAT became popular. So it wasn't until the media explained to the public why this issue exists with Crossfire, that later on AMD finally acknowledged the problem and implemented a fix.

So there has been Crossfire related issues where AMD was forced to provide a fix. So the way I see it this time around is AMD releases a dual-GPU card pushing for better price/performance than a 1080. Of course all the media will benchmark the card. Any game where Crossfire doesn't work, or has poor scaling and optimization, surely will be pointed out by the media. Then of course AMD will be forced to provide a fix.

Most recent example of AMD being forced to provide a fix: https://www.techpowerup.com/223981/amd-releases-pci-express-power-draw-fix-we-tested-confirmed-works
Edited by BiG StroOnZ - 7/9/16 at 10:29pm
post #97 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by PostalTwinkie View Post

You are right, if it is just two 480s slapped together, $500 to $600-$650 would make sense, given the 480 position.

I think it makes sense. AMD released many slides based on RX480 CF performance. It was decidedly weird. They might have at one point considered flagshipping a dual-gpu RX480 card. They have been releasing dual-gpu's cards for every architecture for several generations now. This is the first card that was decidedly pitched to the public in terms of CF performance. I mean, it's obviously going to get the dual-gpu treatment at some point.

The only thing working against this, is that AMD would probably prefer to move more RX480's for CF setups, rather than sell a custom dual-gpu card. It seems obvious, that this will happen, but I imagine AMD will allow board partners to manufacture custom dual-gpu PCB's after enough of their RX480 stock saturates. Board partners are going to do the same, and wait to introduce something else. I don't think it will be very long though before a dual-gpu card appears if it's possible.

Someone smarter than me would have to really look at the card and see if there are any little details that suggest the elements for a dual-gpu setup on the same PCB already exist. It would seem those details would exist, if my theory is correct and there was a dual-gpu card tossed around for a while as a flagship card. They just decided a CF flagship card would be super messy and offer variable performance. It will definitely exist at some point though.
post #98 of 104
Maybe Microsoft's MGPU layer in dx12 will make it very easy to add multiple GPUs in DX12 without much overhead - a dual GPU product wouldn't be so bad if this what the ecosystem will look like.
post #99 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeDuffy View Post

Maybe Microsoft's MGPU layer in dx12 will make it very easy to add multiple GPUs in DX12 without much overhead - a dual GPU product wouldn't be so bad if this what the ecosystem will look like.

It might be programmatically easily, the physical limitation is still there.
post #100 of 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilles3000 View Post

It can't be much more than $500, otherwise it would make no sense at all to buy this card for anyone.

Well that is if its a dual GPU card at all, which I'm still not entirely convinced about.

I think the only other possibility beyond dual Polaris, would be a weird Vega. MS's Scorpio seems to have some weird numbers that don't sound like Polaris 10. Suggests a custom early fab Vega that might not have been projected. These could be repurposed for desktop GPU purposes? It wouldn't be a proper Vega release though, and I'm not sure AMD would want to try that regardless of it's performance/price. We all know they would get slagged and Vega would be labeled a failure, before a proper Vega release.
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