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Ongoing Pascal latency problems - Hotfix doesn't work for everyone. - Page 31

post #301 of 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by cookieboyeli View Post

R0ach has "a bit" of a problem with the placebo effect. redface.gif I don't.

I'm simply optimizing for all system performance, some of the stuff in the guide isn't going to help DPC latency at all, but it should still be done.

Updated my post to include the guide. Rereading it a few months later there is actually a few things I now disagree with! biggrin.gif Like Perfmonitor2 being useful. I don't think it is anymore and I've stopped using it. Process Explorer is much better for that task.

Would you agree wit R0ach on saying that DRAM timings affect mouse movement?

Little OFF Topic:

If you happen to have any insight I'd greatly appreciate it if you helped me here!

http://www.overclock.net/t/1606028/devils-canyon-relationship-with-ram-timings-speed-and-voltage#post_25351963

Back on topic, with my 290 I get USBport.sys as my DPC latency source, I heard using motherboard chipset drivers could fix that, I've always avoided them and used Windows default drivers instead because I though Windows drivers had less impact on system DPC latency, the irony.
post #302 of 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cookieboyeli View Post

R0ach has "a bit" of a problem with the placebo effect. redface.gif I don't.

I'm simply optimizing for all system performance, some of the stuff in the guide isn't going to help DPC latency at all, but it should still be done.

Updated my post to include the guide. Rereading it a few months later there is actually a few things I now disagree with! biggrin.gif Like Perfmonitor2 being useful. I don't think it is anymore and I've stopped using it. Process Explorer is much better for that task.

Would you agree wit R0ach on saying that DRAM timings affect mouse movement?

Little OFF Topic:

If you happen to have any insight I'd greatly appreciate it if you helped me here!

http://www.overclock.net/t/1606028/devils-canyon-relationship-with-ram-timings-speed-and-voltage#post_25351963

Back on topic, with my 290 I get USBport.sys as my DPC latency source, I heard using motherboard chipset drivers could fix that, I've always avoided them and used Windows default drivers instead because I though Windows drivers had less impact on system DPC latency, the irony.

It's not that DRAM timings themselves affect mouse movement directly. What they actually do is affect process performance and allow interrupts to resolve faster, thereby lowering the system interrupt latency and as such your mouse movement polling latency and jitter.

So yes, ram timings and speed affect DPC latency. CPU speed affects it a few orders of magnitude more though. The less things you have taking up CPU time, the more time available for any spontaneous interrupts. By overclocking your CPU you essentially "make more time" for your PC to finish an interrupt by a certain real world deadline (like your mouse's polling rate). You're shorten the length of any the interrupts occurring too.

I recommend having nothing run at boot, no Skype, no Steam, none of the bull. Open those when you want to use them, when you want to game close everything you can. Something I did was I bought Rainbbow Six Siege with the Uplay key instead of the steam key so I wouldn't have to have both uplay and steam open in the background.

I haven't had a chance to fully read your post but I'm doing that now. RAM overclocking can be an EXTREME PAIN IN THE ASS! mad.gif
Edited by cookieboyeli - 7/15/16 at 10:59pm
post #303 of 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by cookieboyeli View Post

It's not that DRAM timings themselves affect mouse movement directly. What they actually do is affect process performance and allow interrupts to resolve faster, thereby lowering the system interrupt latency and as such your mouse movement polling latency and jitter.

So yes, ram timings and speed affect DPC latency. CPU speed affects it a few orders of magnitude more though. The less things you have taking up CPU time, the more time available for any spontaneous interrupts. By overclocking your CPU you essentially "make more time" for your PC to finish an interrupt by a certain real world deadline (like your mouse's polling rate). You're shorten the length of any the interrupts occurring too.

I recommend having nothing run at boot, no Skype, no Steam, none of the bull. Open those when you want to use them, when you want to game close everything you can. Something I did was I bought Rainbbow Six Siege with the Uplay key instead of the steam key so I wouldn't have to have both uplay and steam open in the background.

I haven't had a chance to fully read your post but I'm doing that now. RAM overclocking can be an EXTREME PAIN IN THE ASS! mad.gif

Yes, I do exactly that, I don't even have mouse drivers installed, nothing but DirectX libraries, steam, Origin, Battle.net and games, I don't even have basic things like Java, Flash Player, nothing, not even a single Windows update or anti viruses, this was the main reason why I could notice there was something off when I first played Overwatch with my 1070 compared to my 290.

I added your main post to the OP, feel free to edit it with anything you deem useful!
post #304 of 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by cookieboyeli View Post

It's not that DRAM timings themselves affect mouse movement directly. What they actually do is affect process performance and allow interrupts to resolve faster, thereby lowering the system interrupt latency and as such your mouse movement polling latency and jitter.

So yes, ram timings and speed affect DPC latency. CPU speed affects it a few orders of magnitude more though. The less things you have taking up CPU time, the more time available for any spontaneous interrupts. By overclocking your CPU you essentially "make more time" for your PC to finish an interrupt by a certain real world deadline (like your mouse's polling rate). You're shorten the length of any the interrupts occurring too.

I recommend having nothing run at boot, no Skype, no Steam, none of the bull. Open those when you want to use them, when you want to game close everything you can. Something I did was I bought Rainbbow Six Siege with the Uplay key instead of the steam key so I wouldn't have to have both uplay and steam open in the background.

I haven't had a chance to fully read your post but I'm doing that now. RAM overclocking can be an EXTREME PAIN IN THE ASS! mad.gif

Well I will say on the 4900MQ laptop I had, upgrading from 1600 to 2133 ram did make the system feel snappier. But going from 1866 to 2400 on my desktop I can't say I've noticed any perceptible differences.
post #305 of 1679
I started getting some stutters in Witcher 3 recently, and here's why (I have a 780 Lightning) :




I've disabled the Realtek HD audio driver long back since I have an external dac+amp. I removed the Killer interface thingy, so I only have the network driver. I'm playing with pagefile (On, off, auto). But nothing is helping.

On the bright side, I think I have the highest score in this thread (17,281)....I win
post #306 of 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnek View Post

Well I will say on the 4900MQ laptop I had, upgrading from 1600 to 2133 ram did make the system feel snappier. But going from 1866 to 2400 on my desktop I can't say I've noticed any perceptible differences.

DRAM timings >>>>>> All in this regard.

Going from a 2000MHz C7 to a 3600MHz C16 would be a HUGE downgrade, this without counting the dozens of other timings, unless you are working with bandwitch sensitive applications, AKA not the OS or 99% of games out there.
post #307 of 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrr9 View Post

I started getting some stutters in Witcher 3 recently, and here's why (I have a 780 Lightning) :




I've disabled the Realtek HD audio driver long back since I have an external dac+amp. I removed the Killer interface thingy, so I only have the network driver. I'm playing with pagefile (On, off, auto). But nothing is helping.

On the bright side, I think I have the highest score in this thread (17,281)....I win

Use Snappy Driver Uninstaller to update your Driver (excluding audio and gpu, audio should be left as windows default and gpu should be done manually)

You have some seeeeerious issues though. eek.gif I've seen a lot, but this might just truly be THE HIGH SCORE.

What do your other tabs say?

PS: MY 770 Lightning beats your 780 in all areas except memory bandwidth! biggrin.gif

Edited by cookieboyeli - 7/16/16 at 12:00am
post #308 of 1679
DPC latency seems to be a complicated issue. I had a major issue with dpc latency on my old motherboard Asrock Z68 and my EVGA 970. That motherboard was sharing IRQ's with the graphic port, mouse, usb ports, and sound card so what I noticed the ISR count and DPC count between all these devices were going off the charts. Just constantly increasing higher and higher with no end even when it was sitting at idle doing nothing. I used a tool that managed to put the IRQ sharing in a different way, another way thru windows (got it from a thread on GURU3D). But that did not help at all anyways.

Now with my new skylake build all those problems disappeared using the same gpu. That Asrock motherboard and the way it shared IRQ with everything was just crap. I'm not 100% sure if thats why all my interrupts was just polling together and going crazy but for sure I don't see this problem with my Gigabyte Z170. I don't own a 1080/1070 but just sharing a DPC latency experience.
Edited by sammkv - 7/16/16 at 12:13am
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6700K ASUS Z170-E Zotac 1070 AMP Edition  Corsair LPX 2666 16GB 
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Intel 600P 500GB, OCZ Trion 150 250gb, 850 Evo ... H100i Windows 10 Asus 144hz 
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My System
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
6700K ASUS Z170-E Zotac 1070 AMP Edition  Corsair LPX 2666 16GB 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Intel 600P 500GB, OCZ Trion 150 250gb, 850 Evo ... H100i Windows 10 Asus 144hz 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Leopold 660 blue EVGA 750 B2 Thermaltake F31 Logitech G Pro 
Mouse PadAudio
Taito King Size Creative Omni 5.1 usb 
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post #309 of 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dargonplay View Post

DRAM timings >>>>>> All in this regard.

Going from a 2000MHz C7 to a 3600MHz C16 would be a HUGE downgrade, this without counting the dozens of other timings, unless you are working with bandwitch sensitive applications, AKA not the OS or 99% of games out there.

It's not that simple, since true latency is inherently a function of both CAS latency AND clockspeed. This page goes in a bit more detail about this.

Also, even just going from 1600 CL9 to 1866 CL11 sticks made the laptop feel a bit more responsive, and stepping up to 2133 CL11 made it even more pronounced.
post #310 of 1679
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnek View Post

It's not that simple, since true latency is inherently a function of both CAS latency AND clockspeed. This page goes in a bit more detail about this.

Also, even just going from 1600 CL9 to 1866 CL11 sticks made the laptop feel a bit more responsive, and stepping up to 2133 CL11 made it even more pronounced.

I know it isn't so simple, trust me, almost two weeks trying to get third and 2ndary timings as low as possible.

Going from a C7 2000MHz you'd need a 4000MHz C14 RAM to match it, hence why I said 3600MHz C16 is a titanic downgrade... Because it is!

And responsiveness won't come from frequency but timings, and I don't mean plain C7 or C8 but relative timings to frequency, if you feel that change of ram had any positive effects it's probably just placebo, the frequency gain from 1600MHz to 1866MHz is just 16% while the timing performance loss from 9 to 11 is 22%.

Rocking a 2200MHz 9-11-10-1T-230 hell yeah!
Edited by Dargonplay - 7/16/16 at 12:20am
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