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[TechSpot] Star Citizen backer gets his $3000 pledge refunded with help from the LA District Attorney - Page 7

post #61 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by prava View Post

Why do you care? People have the right to do whatever they want with their money. How do you think people feels when we (computer enthusiasts) tell them the amount we spend on our stuff? I can tell you the looks I got when I told my friends that my keybard is worth more than $300.

 

Glad you asked, I specifically care because I was planning on playing the game and "Paying" for the completed game, like I have, for all Chris other Wing Commander games which I have historically Fully purchased at release. I care that a game I plan on buying actually ships. You asked.

 

Also even as you most likely payed for a "working" keyboard. You did not prepay for it and then get shipped one Key at a time over a 3 year period. I'm not at odds with the dollar amount in and of itself...(that would be pretty hypocritical with SLI Titan-X). I'm at odds of not getting what you paid for when promised, knowing there was nothing binding, and then complaining about it when you knew the exact deal you were getting into.

 

We will of course look at this through different lenses. I could care less that anyone agrees with me. As an adult, you should not care that I have a different opinion than your own.  No harm no foul. 

 

Below is not directed at you prava , as none of my initial post was directed at you...

I question eventually how far does one stretch new method of user finance and is there any way a user can realize $3K+ of enjoyment in the game when it does ship? Serious question. 

post #62 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpriest667 View Post

They have never once published their spending or financials, please post the financials if you have them MANY of us are curious.

Eh?

I'll admit I was slightly wrong, The financials are for Foundry 42, the UK Studio.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08703814/filing-history

Go wild, all the information you could want. The top 20 page PDF is their companies house annual report submitted to the government. The figures are incredibly healthy.

Again you said they have never once published their financials. They have. This is exactly what I mean when people slate Star Citizen without knowing the facts. It blows my mind.
Edited by Cyph3r - 7/17/16 at 5:04pm
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post #63 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

Eh?

I'll admit I was slightly wrong, the financials are for Foundry 42, the UK Studio.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/08703814/filing-history

Go wild, all the information you could want. The top 20 page PDF is their companies house annual report submitted to the government. The figures are incredibly healthy.

Again you said they have never once published their financials. They have. This is exactly what I mean when people slate Star Citizen without knowing the facts. It blows my mind.


Which we have discussed at length on another forum. Basically they spent about 16 million for ONE of their 5 studios in one calendar year. You have yet to post CIG's financials only Foundry 42... which is required by law to disclose. They actually had to file twice for an extension because they refused to post them.
Edited by Darkpriest667 - 7/17/16 at 5:08pm
 
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post #64 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpriest667 View Post

Which we have discussed at length on another forum. Basically they spent about 16 million for ONE of their 5 studios in one calendar year.

That's not inherently an issue. It'd be naive to believe that the UK studio is as financially healthy as it is, but their other studios are on the brink of bankruptcy.

I'm sure CIG have a couple of well paid accountants to handle their cash better than some internet warriors.

As I said in my previous post a while ago, I'm by no means a Star Citizen fanatic, I've put £35 into the base game and SQ42. Personally I believe there's a fair chance it's not going to achieve what its set out to do, but at the same time I can't say for sure either way. No one can. This constant hammering on Star Citizen over "facts" no-one actually knows is incredibly boring.

If you like Star Citizen and you want to do your bit to help it become a reality. Donate by purchasing one of their pledges.

If you don't like it, don't donate. Watch it fail (or succeed, who knows).

It's rather simple.

Getting upset over how CIG is using it's development donations (which is, without question, being used for development), or trying to instigate some witch-hunt based on that is frankly a waste of time.

On the plus side every bit of negative media spikes the amount of money CIG receives, so meh, go wild I guess.
Edited by Cyph3r - 7/17/16 at 5:12pm
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post #65 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

That's not inherently an issue. It'd be naive to believe that the UK studio is as financially healthy as it is, but their other studios are on the brink of bankruptcy.

I'm sure CIG have a couple of well paid accountants to handle their cash better than some internet warriors.

As I said in my previous post a while ago, I'm by no means a Star Citizen fanatic, I've put £35 into the base game and SQ42. Personally I believe there's a fair chance it's not going to achieve what its set out to do, but at the same time I can't say for sure either way. No one can. This constant hammering on Star Citizen over "facts" no-one actually knows is incredibly boring.

If you like Star Citizen and you want to do your bit to help it become a reality. Donate by purchasing one of their pledges.

If you don't like it, don't donate. Watch it fail (or succeed, who knows).

It's rather simple.

Getting upset over how CIG is using it's development donations (which is, without question, being used for development), or trying to instigate some witch-hunt based on that is frankly a waste of time.

On the plus side every bit of negative media spikes the amount of money CIG receives, so meh, go wild I guess.

Maybe we've miscommunicated. I gave them 200 4 years ago, which is more than I've ever given a game ever. I am just saying they have grossly mismanaged their money and this is more of a ponzi scheme than an actual development. 4 years and they aren't even to the actual alpha stage of the game. It's not happening.
 
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post #66 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

Cloud Imperium publish their annual spending, last year was something like 12.5mil.

Is that part of the subscriber material? I haven't seen any spending reports, but maybe I just need to do more actual reading instead of just watching ATV.

12 million on a production crew this size is very good, and if it's true that would be very relieving to hear.
At that rate they really could take a decade to work on the PU.
I say that not to be funny, but this game above almost anything else hinges on the development of new technology. There is no way to get faster results, and in some ways I don't want faster results. Part of the appeal of Star Citizen is that they're doing things that have never been done before, and even though they have the right talent, there's a limited number of people in the world who can tackle these sorts of problems, and unfortunately they're still susceptible to the same 24 hour days as the rest of us.
post #67 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpriest667 View Post

Maybe we've miscommunicated. I gave them 200 4 years ago, which is more than I've ever given a game ever. I am just saying they have grossly mismanaged their money and this is more of a ponzi scheme than an actual development. 4 years and they aren't even to the actual alpha stage of the game. It's not happening.

Tbf I've never put money into an game before it's been released either. Even though I've only put in £35.

You can't say that they've mismanaged their money though, you don't have access to all their financial information, the only information we have access to is their UK companies house, which is very healthy.

And they do run numerous studios, with a lot of employees working around the clock. Yes they're taking a long time, but they're definitely working on it. So I doubt that this is some some of elaborate scam, because if it is Mr. Roberts is dumber than we think as he's given a huge chunk of money to hundreds of people in decent salaries.

I'm a 3D artist for games and I have a good chuckle looking back on some of the time frames Roberts came out with in the early days. I'm no programmer so I don't have a grasp of the time frames of that side of things, but just creating the 3D models for these ships is a horrifyingly huge task.
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post #68 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

I have a good chuckle looking back on some of the time frames Roberts came out with in the early days.

The big disconnect between what we see now and what we all heard and read in 2012 is that Chris expected "maybe" three million dollars from crowdfunding, and had private investors to cover the rest of a $25 million development budget.

If you start with a plan for $25 million and end up with over four times more, from crowdfunding alone, the idea of sticking to the original plan would be almost as wasteful as what the naysayers "imagine" is going on. Why waste four years of your life developing something so limited in scope when you've already been given the money to do something far better?
This is the wild west of game development, no-one could have possibly anticipated what was going to happen, and no-one could possibly have been fully prepared for it.
Squadron 42 is the the most critical immediate goal, it's the middle ground between fanciful dreams and shipping a product, hopefully they can deliver relatively soon.
post #69 of 88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

Errr not even close. Cloud Imperium publish their annual spending, last year was something like 12.5mil. Considering they run 3/4 studios with ~300 employees and have received 120mil in funding, they're very much in the black and incredibly comfortable. Infact they're on a rather large hiring spree at the moment.

I find it amusing everyone who slates Star Citizen without knowing the facts. If you don't like Star Citizen/are not interested in it - why post incorrect information/assumptions?

Feel free to post those reports, because as the others have even said.....they haven't been disclosed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

That's not inherently an issue. It'd be naive to believe that the UK studio is as financially healthy as it is, but their other studios are on the brink of bankruptcy.

I'm sure CIG have a couple of well paid accountants to handle their cash better than some internet warriors.

You are right, I will just go back to not being an Accountant, and just an observant businessman. I will leave the hard math to my wife, who is an Accountant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post


As I said in my previous post a while ago, I'm by no means a Star Citizen fanatic, I've put £35 into the base game and SQ42. Personally I believe there's a fair chance it's not going to achieve what its set out to do, but at the same time I can't say for sure either way. No one can. This constant hammering on Star Citizen over "facts" no-one actually knows is incredibly boring.

rolleyes.gif

Keep chasing the carrot. But, again, that is just my totally non-Accountant opinion, and is only based on years of business experience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

If you like Star Citizen and you want to do your bit to help it become a reality. Donate by purchasing one of their pledges.

If you don't like it, don't donate. Watch it fail (or succeed, who knows).

It's rather simple.

You are right, it is simple; you aren't 'donating' anything to them, they are literally trying to sell a product. Calling it a donation isn't going to change the fact that they have been completely irresponsible with their funding, and are literally running on money generated by making more promises of content.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyph3r View Post

Getting upset over how CIG is using it's development donations (which is, without question, being used for development), or trying to instigate some witch-hunt based on that is frankly a waste of time.

On the plus side every bit of negative media spikes the amount of money CIG receives, so meh, go wild I guess.

No one is getting upset here, but you. A person makes a very valid point, and you come running waving the finger yelling "But, but, but....donations....and they are good!"
    
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post #70 of 88
This is the new Half Life 3 biggrin.gif!
 
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