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[Various] Futuremark's Time Spy DirectX 12 "Benchmark" Compromised. Less Compute/Parallelism than Doom/Aots. Also... - Page 15

post #141 of 253
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Edited by Doothe - 7/19/16 at 3:43pm
post #142 of 253
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eroticus View Post

A closer look at asynchronous compute in 3DMark
http://www.futuremark.com/pressreleases/a-closer-look-at-asynchronous-compute-in-3dmark-time-spy

Basically they jump between explaining how they are sending compute loads and how its only fair to not push the hardware because they want to represent actual games.

Too bad actual games have been doing the opposite of what they did and actually use IHV paths turning the benchmark in a non representative benchmark.
post #143 of 253
Elixer from anandtech's forum "AMD goes from 2 (w/Async) contexts to 1(wo/Async), Nvidia goes from 4(w/Async) to 2(wo/Async).

Is that what 3dMark is doing, or is this what the drivers are doing?"


FM_Jarvis replied "That is, as far as we can tell, that is what drivers or D3D is doing. "not ours, probably drivers, but we can't be 100% sure" was what the programmers said.

Ask NVIDIA? "

amd radeon fury async on

4tzDuJf.png

amd radeon fury async off

wsXUMul.png

nvidia gtx 1080 async on

tmJqiEw.png

nvidia gtx 1080 async off

Y8bcUvJ.png
post #144 of 253
Why does Nvidia come clear on this one once and for all so everyone rests its case.?

Look at how pathetic this guy sound when asked about async compute, thats a no comment, thats an extended no comment.

2:16:01
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post #145 of 253
It's funny that ASync is a Optional Feature for DX12. I wonder why? Maybe it has to do with Nvidia not having full support for it even with Pascal 2 years after DX12 has come out because these cards take more then 2 years to make?
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post #146 of 253
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZealotKi11er View Post

It's funny that ASync is a Optional Feature for DX12. I wonder why? Maybe it has to do with Nvidia not having full support for it even with Pascal 2 years after DX12 has come out because these cards take more then 2 years to make?

Well, think of it from the API holders position. A tiny market within a tiny market (Win10 and limited to AMD hardware) or they create different feature levels and put the onus on the developers to support the feature on the GPUs that allow it.

So I'd say it's 100% fair to say that DX12 doesn't require Async because not all GPUs support it.

I just want to add that it has nothing to do with developers wanting to limit AMD hardware. It's just about supporting as much hardware as possible as a baseline. thumb.gif
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post #147 of 253
post #148 of 253
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remij View Post

Well, think of it from the API holders position. A tiny market within a tiny market (Win10 and limited to AMD hardware) or they create different feature levels and put the onus on the developers to support the feature on the GPUs that allow it.

So I'd say it's 100% fair to say that DX12 doesn't require Async because not all GPUs support it.

I just want to add that it has nothing to do with developers wanting to limit AMD hardware. It's just about supporting as much hardware as possible as a baseline. thumb.gif

ASync + AMD + DX12 is really a small % of gamers but it's because of Consoles that this is a big deal.
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post #149 of 253
I just read through it, very detailled ! And kinda confirm what i was saying. The work laod is submitted the same way ( vendor agnostic ) then the way the drive / hardware treat it is not of there issue as long as the sync take place.

For example : you want to encode a video in H264, you submit a specific work load like encode_h264(this chunk of data).
On a cpu it take 8 loop to produce the result, and another one just 2 because the hardware is actually having a way to detect if this is a h264 encode chunk, if yes, send that to the pipeline for it.

The workload submission for everyone, treated differently under the hood.


Another example ?
- You have a car and you submit the work load : change all tires.

the submission is the same.
If you own a Lada, you will most likely do it yourself, one by one and take 25mins on a good day.
If your name is hamilton, this will take you less than 6 seconds smile.gif but took 6 guys and hours of training before.

Submission is exactly the same, the way it is treated is differrent, it is then agnostics and not optimized for a specific workload.

( Optimizing for a specific workload would be :
- change all the tires with 6 crew on a Formula 1

own a lada, you cannot execute the workload smile.gif
post #150 of 253
Seems to me that this is all just a failure of DX12 itself to adhere to one standard regardless of vendor. Features like Async should just be part of the API whether or not certain hardware can take advantage of it. It shouldn't be left to vendors or developers to pick and choose which feature set they want to implement, it should all be standard. Now of course I know very little about API's and how they work so maybe this comes off as sounding stupid to the guys that really understand this stuff but it seems to me (an admitted layman) that DX12's implementation is far more fractured and sloppy than DX11's was, which is a shame considering I thought the point of it was to be low level and simple to utilize. It just doesn't make sense to offer all kinds of differing features that may or may not ever be supported and just leave it up to everyone else to pick and choose which ones they will utilize a la carte.

TL;DR - There should just be one unified feature set of DX12 that includes everything and either hardware will be compatible or it won't. It makes much more sense why Nvidia didn't even bother to include certain features on a hardware level now since they knew they could simply muscle everybody to code for them first anyway though...
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