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[DSoG] id Software Tech Interview: DX12, Vulkan, Mega-Textures, PBR, Global Illumination & more - Page 2

post #11 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by NightAntilli View Post

Agreed. But nVidia is supporting Vulkan because they have to, not because they want to. If it was for them, they'd stick to DX11, since that allows their hardware to be more competitive against AMD's hardware. They've optimized extensively for DX11 and they know their advantage is under that API.

I think it's only a matter of time before they learn to optimize for DX12 just like they did for DX11. Pascal doesn't have real async compute capabilities, but their driver implementation of context switching does net them SOME performance. Once their hardware is capable (Volta?) They will seize the day and make use of it. Competition is a good thing for all of us.
post #12 of 24
Except for DX12 it's the devs that have to do the optimizing of the game. The drivers have a lesser say than DX11.
post #13 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by NightAntilli View Post

Except for DX12 it's the devs that have to do the optimizing of the game. The drivers have a lesser say than DX11.

You make a valid point, squire.
post #14 of 24
I tried vulkan last night on my 2x 7970s really nice perf max the game out at 1080P and fps don't dip under 85 and peak at 180.
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post #15 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by NightAntilli View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Mudkipz-Resistance-is-futile-mudkip-marshtomp-and-swampert-20458111-627-501.png

Vulkan deserves to be used more... It's such a shame that it's practically being downplayed everywhere because of nVidia's minimal performance improvement in it.
Yes, nvidia is to blame.
Not the fact that Vulkan is esentially the successor of OpenGL which is barely used compared to the widespread DirectX.
post #16 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assirra View Post

Yes, nvidia is to blame.
Not the fact that Vulkan is esentially the successor of OpenGL which is barely used compared to the widespread DirectX.
This time Vulkan has a great advantage, which is that it is working across Windows 7, 8, 8.1, Linux, Steam OS... That's a lot of potential customers compared to DX12. DX12 only has Windows 10, which has been the subject of a lot of controversy with people that refuse to upgrade to it... If DX12 gets used, it will be DX11 features used under the DX12 API, like we saw with Tomb Raider. No benefits at all.

So what's left? DX11 vs Vulkan.
nVidia's favorite vs AMD's favorite...

Unfortunately, nVidia has way too much influence in the industry compared to AMD, so progress goes slower than it could.
post #17 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by NightAntilli View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assirra View Post

Yes, nvidia is to blame.
Not the fact that Vulkan is esentially the successor of OpenGL which is barely used compared to the widespread DirectX.
This time Vulkan has a great advantage, which is that it is working across Windows 7, 8, 8.1, Linux, Steam OS... That's a lot of potential customers compared to DX12. DX12 only has Windows 10, which has been the subject of a lot of controversy with people that refuse to upgrade to it... If DX12 gets used, it will be DX11 features used under the DX12 API, like we saw with Tomb Raider. No benefits at all.

So what's left? DX11 vs Vulkan.
nVidia's favorite vs AMD's favorite...

Unfortunately, nVidia has way too much influence in the industry compared to AMD, so progress goes slower than it could.

DX11.3 is all/most of the DX12 graphics features in DX11, so it could work either way. Between Vulkan and DX11.3 I'm still not concerned about skipping W10 for gaming.
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post #18 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assirra View Post

Yes, nvidia is to blame.
Not the fact that Vulkan is esentially the successor of OpenGL which is barely used compared to the widespread DirectX.

Developers avoided OpenGL because AMD implementation was tragically bad - as can be seen by Doom benchmarks in it.
post #19 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by thegreatsquare View Post

DX11.3 is all/most of the DX12 graphics features in DX11, so it could work either way. Between Vulkan and DX11.3 I'm still not concerned about skipping W10 for gaming.
Fair enough. To clarify, I meant whatever falls under FL11_0, or DX11.0. DX11.1 features won't be used because nVidia doesn't support them, and DX11.3 features are half supported by AMD, and the other half by nVidia... Rather than working towards the strength of both, developers will likely leave those features out of the equation in the first place... Unless as part of a new GameWorks nVidia's features are used while leaving AMD in the dust.

nVidia will have the benefit in both DX11 and DX12 then. AMD will suffer from overhead in DX11 and nVidia can pretend that their cards are better for DX12 because AMD doesn't support its features... At least AMD is making an effort to push its features now, considering they're likely a lot more straightforward for developers. Tier 3 resource binding is one of the most beneficial things a developer can have, but since nVidia is limited here, they have to take that into account when programming... And as long as that's the case, AMD's strengths will not come to light, sadly.
post #20 of 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelius View Post

Developers avoided OpenGL because AMD implementation was tragically bad - as can be seen by Doom benchmarks in it.

AMD's OpenGL performance has little to nothing to do with it. Devs avoided OGL because it had poor documentation, little tooling, and thanks to almost no compliance testing, extremely inconsistent results; some vendors' implementations were completely broken, some disregarded conformance to get better performance, etc.
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