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[EuroGamer] Nintendo NX is a portable console with detachable controllers + powered by Nvidia Tegra technology - Page 9

post #81 of 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

i understood what he meant. smile.gif

But as i pointed out, that's when you compare them with PC ports under DX11. It's a different story with fixed hardware in the console space, console devs squeeze every drop they can out of the hardware.

Edit:

Speedy beat me to it. thumb.gif


part of the reason why im skeptical on overall performance. I personally don't see it passing the Xbox One in performance, but possibly can get close to it on "docked" mode. The #1 thing nintendo needs to do is address the development space. part of the reason why devs dont liek working with the WiiU was it was a pain to develop for as Nintendo doesn't have the resources to help other devs as much as MS or Sony does. Let's just hope Nintendo actually got somewhere when Nintendo joined the Khronos group of companies last year.
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post #82 of 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

Nintendo is now completely irrelevant to "hardcore" gamers, they've been more or less irrelevant for years now, but this looks like they're completely backing out of competing with Sony and MS..

I guess mobile games and gimmick filled low-cost garbage is now their future. I was hoping the NX would be their return to the NES, SNES, and N64 days..
Mind sharing how you managed to come up with that? lachen.gif

I think there is a 50% chance this comes with pascal based. This means it has the potential to have 1tflop of performance considering what the x1 can already do. 640 cores x 1ghz x2 = 1.28tflop. Considering the xbox1 is 1.31 tflops and Nvidia tflops are worth about 30-40% more when it comes to gaming, it has the power to reach a touch beyond xbox 1 performance. I think an 800mhz or 1tflop would be enough to do it as well. However, the problem could be memory bandwidth but consoles have done wonders to work around this for years now.

If this has maxwell, it is dead in the water, it if has pascal, I could see xbox one and ps4 ports coming to it, which is exactly what it needs to be successful. If I was Nvidia, I would sell this pascal based SOC dirt cheap to create leverage to create a programming standard that integrates arm + some sort of graphic core which essentially allows ps4 and xbox one games to come to tablets in the near future and cell phones in 2 years or so. Basically a mobile version of mantle which uses arm processors.

The Wii U is 3.5 Gigaflops, about 1/4 the power of the Xbone, if Nintendo can achieve similar performance to Xbox that means they would be quadrupling the power of the Wii U while making it a handheld at the same.

That sounds like a very compelling option to me.
post #83 of 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaSceptre View Post

i understood what he meant. smile.gif

But as i pointed out, that's when you compare them with PC ports under DX11. It's a different story with fixed hardware in the console space, console devs squeeze every drop they can out of the hardware.

Edit:

Speedy beat me to it. thumb.gif

What's to stop Nvidia's hardware from working better if there was an API design specifically for it? AKA not a mantle derivative.

Directx 11 is not the best working environment because the OS has lots of overhead. The fact that Nvidia manages so well on it should not be a strike against NV hardware itself. Just because Nvidia hardware doesn't get much benefit on directx12 doesn't mean it cannot get benefits from a low level API. GCN derived Mantle based API's not giving much performance to Nvidia titles should not be much of a surprise. That's like expecting AMD to run gameworks features especially well.

It likely means it just needs a different API thatis more tailored for it's hardware rather than GCN. And this is why Nvidia wants to do business with Nintendo.

The only reason, Nvidia would want to do business with a lower margin product would be to get it hardware in a larger installed base and to get game developers to program using it. So why not make an API that similar to the NX programming environment. One that would make games run better and faster on Tegra hardware or atleast their GPU's so that game developers can port scaled down versions of console games onto tablets and eventually cellphones.

I am guessing what Nvidia wants is for PS4 and Xbox one games to get ported to the NX. Once these games get ported to ARM and to tegra, software developers will consider porting these games to tablets and cellphones and this is where Nvidia makes money. Basically if Nvidia can have ps4 and xbox one games ported to tablets and consoles, even companies like apple will think about using Nvidia graphics in their tablets and phones and that equals big money in the long run.

The consoles being so underpowered in the first place is what makes this all possible. A 1 tflop to 1.3 tflop chip should be possible even in mobile form. As someone mentioned before, a tegra chip can easily exceed the power of an xbox one if given access to 40 watts of power. In that toms review, the gtx 1060 can achieve 3.8tflops for 60 watts and the xbox one only has 1.3 tflops of power.
Edited by tajoh111 - 7/26/16 at 1:27pm
post #84 of 406
Tegra? Bahahaha.
Yes lets go with a SOC with GP107 instead of getting a custom SOC from AMD with mugh bigger GPU part.

Holy crap, talk about giving rats about graphic performance
post #85 of 406
Firstly we don't know if this is true at all. Now if they go with a hybrid console like how the NeoGeo X was. And the price of the console is around $150 to $250 they will sell crap loads of it in no time. I will for sure buy one as i have with other consoles as i only play exclusive games on each consoles only. But for people who want to play multi plat games will be a no go if this does not have at least the power of Xone. But if this hybrid is really true will they stop making there handheld which makes them loads of money. I really cant see this happen. Or probably they are thinking of killing off the console and handheld. It makes sense in one way for them. That is in japan handheld is like console to them now. And if they do that they can kill two birds at once. And if this has games that only use to come to handheld. Now comes to console as well it will sell like crazy.
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post #86 of 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111 View Post

What's to stop Nvidia's hardware from working better if there was an API design specifically for it? AKA not a mantle derivative.

Directx 11 is not the best working environment because the OS has lots of overhead. The fact that Nvidia manages so well on it should not be a strike against NV hardware itself. Just because Nvidia hardware doesn't get much benefit on directx12 doesn't mean it cannot get benefits from a low level API. GCN derived Mantle based API's not giving much performance to Nvidia titles should not be much of a surprise. That's like expecting AMD to run gameworks features especially well.

It likely means it just needs a different API thatis more tailored for it's hardware rather than GCN. And this is why Nvidia wants to do business with Nintendo.

The only reason, Nvidia would want to do business with a lower margin product would be to get it hardware in a larger installed base and to get game developers to program using it. So why not make an API that similar to the NX programming environment. One that would make games run better and faster on Tegra hardware or atleast their GPU's so that game developers can port scaled down versions of console games onto tablets and eventually cellphones.

I am guessing what Nvidia wants is for PS4 and Xbox one games to get ported to the NX. Once these games get ported to ARM and to tegra, software developers will consider porting these games to tablets and cellphones and this is where Nvidia makes money. Basically if Nvidia can have ps4 and xbox one games ported to tablets and consoles, even companies like apple will think about using Nvidia graphics in their tablets and phones and that equals big money in the long run.

The consoles being so underpowered in the first place is what makes this all possible. A 1 tflop to 1.3 tflop chip should be possible even in mobile form. As someone mentioned before, a tegra chip can easily exceed the power of an xbox one if given access to 40 watts of power. In that toms review, the gtx 1060 can achieve 3.8tflops for 60 watts and the xbox one only has 1.3 tflops of power.

Yes, they would definitely get more performance if their hardware was in a console, so what? I also never said Nvidia wouldn't get benefits from a low-level API, nor did i treat their DX11 performance as a strike against them.. The only reason i even talked about the fact that consoles are fixed hardware is because you were stating things like 'Nvidia tflops are worth about 30-40% more when it comes to gaming".. Your only data point for that statement is console ports running on DX11, with AMD hardware suffering from driver overhead. Under DX12 it's a different story, and in consoles its far more extreme than that.

As i said earlier, you're going way off the deep end.. Hey, if Nvidia's master plan is to have PS4 and X1 games ported onto tablets and phones then that's great, you're welcome to believe what you want lol. I've made my points already, it's going to be another one of Nintendo's weak, gimmick focused systems for casuals/kids. By the time it comes out it will also be competing with the Neo and Scorpio anyway..
post #87 of 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nintendo workers 
Sir, cellphones are hurting our handheld performance and our semi-portable Wii U console is a disaster
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nintendo boss 
Mmmm... lets double down on another portable device and forget about consoles

rolleyes.gif
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post #88 of 406
^ Sounds about right.. lachen.gif
post #89 of 406

It's not news that Nintendo listens to the needs of the Japanese market first, then the rest of the world.

 

They've been doing so since pretty much their rebirth as a videogames company.

 

Their home market buys handhelds in enormous quantities, so a shift in that direction would only be natural for them. Not for the rest of us, but that's exactly the reason we're a bit stumped.

   
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post #90 of 406
this company is going to eventually fall under the weight of being run by monkeys.
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