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[Various] RX 470 Reviews - Page 16

post #151 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111 View Post


Atleast compare it to the rx 480 4gb, particularly because they have the same amount of memory. The rx480 4gb is only 199 and only 2% slower than the rx480. Additionally, the true MSRP of the power color AIB rx470 is 199. It just happens to be on sale because at 200 dollars and up it just doesn't make sense.

You quoted me comparing it to the 480 4gb at the end. The 470 4gb and 480 4gb offer nearly identical performance. Whichever is cheaper would probably be the better p/$.
Quote:
... In my view that card is the best RX 470 as it will perform very closely to RX 480 4GB if not the same.
taken from above.

So many people saying prices are inflated due to demand, and you're the contrarian saying the price is actually higher, it's just on sale on launch day? rolleyes.gif I haven't known review sites to list msrp as sale prices
post #152 of 437
RX 470 should have been the 4gb card from the start. I have a feeling that the RX 480 4gb only existed to hit that mythical $199 price point on launch. The reference 4gb cards never existed in the first place, they were just firmware neutered.
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post #153 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by bucdan View Post

the PowerColor RX 470 4 GB is the winner for this family of cards.

PowerColor set the MSRP as $199

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post #154 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

PowerColor set the MSRP as $199


I know, what's your point? I'm a bit lost. I said $199 for an AIB 470 4GB was the most reasonable peak. I know it cuts into the 4GB Reference 480, but I also said that the 480 4GB should've never existed.

It's almost as if the AIBs decided to do a limited quantity run for the 480 4GB. Sadly AMDs MSRP of $149 for the 470 4GB was totally blown out since it performed near a $199 480 4GB and the AIBs knew that and adjusted accordingly.

The pricing mistake pretty much started with the 480. With the reference coolers and the 4GB model. Then it did translate to adjustments by AIBs for the 470, and soon the 460.

AMD can't make this same mistake with the Vega family.
Edited by bucdan - 8/4/16 at 1:27pm
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post #155 of 437
Still at $199 it's a decent value compared to the $270-$280 rx 480 customs, even the 4gb 480 customs when you consider how close they are to each other. It's when you add the $250 1060 to the equation it makes you really wonder what they were thinking. AMD mostly responsible because not knowing they would cost this much is a poor excuse, halfway done in by their own partners. Lol sabotage..

And @tajoh111, my apologies

@SoCalMX70 I was talking about the reactions to the 470.
Edited by tkenietz - 8/4/16 at 1:34pm
post #156 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by bucdan View Post

I'm a bit lost

As am I, the 4GB 480 does exist so why would the PowerColor RX 470 4 GB be the winner for this family of cards at $199?
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post #157 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

As am I, the 4GB 480 does exist so why would the PowerColor RX 470 4 GB be the winner for this family of cards at $199?

Because I think that an AIB HSF 470 4GB would be more appealing than a Reference HSF 480 4 GB (Although I do love the way the cooler looks!). So I just think that the Reference HSF 480 4GB shouldn't have existed, or any Reference cooler card because it translated terribly for the pricing for 470 cards (in general) and AIB HSF RX 480 cards.

Being within 5 FPS but with an aftermarket cooler, I would've picked that over the reference 480 4 GB, imo. Even if I liked the reference cooler a lot.

I just think this whole pricing issue started with the 4GB 480s and using Reference coolers for all 480s. Imagine if AIBs released custom cards for the price of the reference cards (or much closer to). They would be just as appealing as custom 1060s
Edited by bucdan - 8/4/16 at 1:39pm
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post #158 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

As am I, the 4GB 480 does exist so why would the PowerColor RX 470 4 GB be the winner for this family of cards at $199?

4gb RX 480 @ $199 was reference, 4gb RX 470 @ $199 is not. If a custom RX 470 performs like the RX 480 4gb reference card and is more available, how is it not a winner?
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post #159 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

PowerColor set the MSRP as $199

I bet it was a typo.
post #160 of 437
Quote:
Originally Posted by bucdan View Post

After seeing the 470 release, they really missed it; the whole marketing team and those that set MAP should be fired; it seems that they didn't account for AIB sale numbers and retailer sale prices.

Too much overlap between the 470 and the 480. AIB 470 vs Reference 480, or not, it's too close in pricing. The 4GB 480 should've never existed. It Should've been the 8GB 480 Reference for $229, then AIBs will make it $259. The 4GB 470 reference would've sat perfectly at $169, with AIBs, making it $199. Then you have your niche 470 8GB that would be a free for all for AIBs, but odds are that they wouldn't make it because the 8GB 480 exists for a little more.

AMD has their pricing structure plan all wacked out. Either they didn't plan for distribution and sale prices, or they're not stepping on the throats of AIBs and etailers to control pricing to make a more attractive market. Nvidia on the other hand, has a great pricing structure (although over priced, because they can right now) for every model, and even leaving gaps for ti models (A 1060 ti will exist, the price gap and performance between the 1070 and 1060 is too much to not release another card there).

From the looks of it, the PowerColor RX 470 4 GB is the winner for this family of cards.

DAMN that mining farm. So it's that bastard that's buying up all of the cards lol. Damn miners.

What likely happened is AMD was shocked by the price to performance of what was supposedly a gtx 1070 that was 50% faster than an rx480 at a supposed $379.

At this point AMD knew the max they could sell their card for 249, but knowing how Nvidia cards are configured, they knew a 1060 was likely to come out at a very competitive price with the rx480.

But AMD knew they needed to launch to gain back marketshare and had to do this even at the cost of profits. What originally AMD wanted to do is launch the rx480 at 300 dollars or so. But with the 1070 pricing(the marketed price, AMD could not anticipate the FE Gouge), they couldn't launch it at that price and had to lower it to 239.99. However, because Nvidia was going to launch the 1060 much sooner than they initially thought, even the rx 480 8gb wasn't a good enough value proposition. Internally, you could predict, the 1060 was going to perform about 8 percent better with a price around 249.99 and when you add the nvidia brand, it will out compete the rx 480 at 239.99. So what AMD did to counter this was launch the rx480 4gb at 199.99.

You could tell this was a last minute change because all initial cards had 8gb of 2ghz ddr5 on it. This was not initially planned. However this would cause chaos and cannibalization with the rest of AMD lineup. And that's exactly happened, basically because of the high cost of finfet, AMD was in a dilemma. Basically for the rest of the rx series pricing to make sense, AMD would have to price their products below cost or basically have products with bad price to performance compared to the rx480 4gb. The latter is what is happening.

The same thing is going to happen with the rx460 as well. It's going to have 35-40% of the performance of the rx480 4gb but it will be price only 50 to 60% of the cost.

AMD pricing structure is all messed up and anyone that knows about product segmentation and product lines, knows you don't price your products so close together to cause confusion and cannibalization of sales. The worst thing is, the rx 480 4gb is likely going to be the most desired product from AMD lineup and yet it is going to have the lowest potential sales volume because its requires a full working Polaris die and AMD doesn't want to to sell it because the 8gb version is more profitable.

Pricing the rx470 at 150 is simply unprofitable and AMD can't afford to take the hit. AMD is lucky mining is going on right now, otherwise these rx 470's wouldn't sell at their msrp.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarathKasun View Post

4gb RX 480 @ $199 was reference, 4gb RX 470 @ $199 is not. If a custom RX 470 performs like the RX 480 4gb reference card and is more available, how is it not a winner?

You answered your own question unintentionally. Basically when two different products that perform sort of the same depending on the AIB, with very similar pricing, you have cannibalization of sales. When the pricing is this close a rx 480 4gb sale is the lost sale of an rx 470 and an rx470 sale is potentially a lost rx 480 4gb sale. You want distinct pricing and performance to segment the market to expand your potential revenue. Targeting the same segment with two different chips that serve the same purpose is a waste and causes confusion in the marketplace.
Edited by tajoh111 - 8/4/16 at 1:49pm
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