Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [Techreport] Nvidia makes its GTX 1060 3GB card official
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[Techreport] Nvidia makes its GTX 1060 3GB card official - Page 28

post #271 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piraal View Post

To be fair, many people bought 970's before Nvidia was outed for their fake spec sheet. I know I did, and lucky NCIX gave me store credit, but I also know many couldn't return to their retailers, and they just had to accept that they got, got.
Agreed. A big portion did. But why the trust remains to buy nVidia again is still beyond my comprehension. I guess the fear of switching brands and getting something worse is common.
This was something nVidia was aware of... And not fixable... On the other hand, something like the power over PCI-E slot was something AMD was unaware of, and fixable. The media had more articles about the power consumption than over the 3.5GB issue... Not that the GTX 970 didn't get attention, just not as much. Look at the DPC issue with Pascal. Barely any attention at all. This would fall in the same category as AMD's power consumption, as in, unknown by the hardware vendor and fixable...
post #272 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlock View Post

950 Pro 256 GB is slower than 950 Pro 512 GB, exact same model number. Identical model number doesn't guarantee identical performance if the full product name is different(as is in case of 1060 3 vs 6GB) I don't see Samsung calling it 950 Pro SE/LE and I don't see it getting sued either. wink.gif

People are just too emotional with video cards (but not SSDs!). I guess not much is going on in their life.
No name
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 7820X @ 4.6GHz/1.17v Asus ROG Strix X299  MSI GeForce GTX 1080 Ti Gaming X 11G 32GB G.Skill Trident Z @ 3800MHz CL16 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Samsung 850 Pro 512GB  Samsung 850 EVO 1TB  Corsair H100i V2 Windows 10 Pro x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
34" Asus Swift PG348Q G-Sync 3440x1440 @ 100Hz Corsair Vengeance K70 Corsair RM1000x Corsair Carbide Series 600C 
MouseAudioAudio
Logitech G900 Chaos Spectrum  Creative Sound Blaster Z Bose Companion 20 
  hide details  
Reply
No name
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i7 7820X @ 4.6GHz/1.17v Asus ROG Strix X299  MSI GeForce GTX 1080 Ti Gaming X 11G 32GB G.Skill Trident Z @ 3800MHz CL16 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Samsung 850 Pro 512GB  Samsung 850 EVO 1TB  Corsair H100i V2 Windows 10 Pro x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
34" Asus Swift PG348Q G-Sync 3440x1440 @ 100Hz Corsair Vengeance K70 Corsair RM1000x Corsair Carbide Series 600C 
MouseAudioAudio
Logitech G900 Chaos Spectrum  Creative Sound Blaster Z Bose Companion 20 
  hide details  
Reply
post #273 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherlock View Post

950 Pro 256 GB is slower than 950 Pro 512 GB, exact same model number. Identical model number doesn't guarantee identical performance if the full product name is different(as is in case of 1060 3 vs 6GB) I don't see Samsung calling it 950 Pro SE/LE and I don't see it getting sued either. wink.gif

Bad comparison. All SSD's typically are faster with higher capacities on the same controller due to the nature of the technology itself. I can't remember the specific details but the information is out there and known. Going to go reread on the subject for my own sake.

Better consult Scotland Yard next time, Sherlock. wink.gif(sorry, had to)
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYU87 View Post

People are just too emotional with video cards (but not SSDs!). I guess not much is going on in their life.

See above.

No one is being emotional. I for one have no interest in a 470, 480 or any flavor of 1060. I do however want to help people make better purchase decisions by making them aware of situations like this.

If some of you still at this point cannot see the major flaws in the naming scheme of this card let alone as to why buying a 3gb card at this performance level is a bad idea I'm just not sure there is any logic out there that would make sense to you.
Edited by SoloCamo - 8/23/16 at 4:50pm
The Struggle (4k)
(20 items)
 
File Server
(12 items)
 
Lenovo G50-45
(6 items)
 
CPUGraphicsRAMOS
Athlon II X2 250u Nvidia 6150SE  2gb DDR3 1066mhz Windows 10 Home 64 bit 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
AMD A8-6410 AMD R5 Crucial Ballistix 8GB DDR3L 1866 CAS10 Crucial BX100 250gb 
Optical DriveOS
DVD Windows 10 Home 
  hide details  
Reply
The Struggle (4k)
(20 items)
 
File Server
(12 items)
 
Lenovo G50-45
(6 items)
 
CPUGraphicsRAMOS
Athlon II X2 250u Nvidia 6150SE  2gb DDR3 1066mhz Windows 10 Home 64 bit 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
AMD A8-6410 AMD R5 Crucial Ballistix 8GB DDR3L 1866 CAS10 Crucial BX100 250gb 
Optical DriveOS
DVD Windows 10 Home 
  hide details  
Reply
post #274 of 332
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloCamo View Post

Bad comparison. All SSD's typically are faster with higher capacities on the same controller due to the nature of the technology itself. I can't remember the specific details but the information is out there and known. Going to go reread on the subject for my own sake.

Better consult Scotland Yard next time, Sherlock. wink.gif(sorry, had to)
See above.

No one is being emotional. I for one have no interest in a 470, 480 or any flavor of 1060. I do however want to help people make better purchase decisions by making them aware of situations like this.

If some of you still at this point cannot see the major flaws in the naming scheme of this card let alone as to why buying a 3gb card at this performance level is a bad idea I'm just not sure there is any logic out there that would make sense to you.

Point is selling 1060 3GB and 6GB but have the 3GB being slower than 6GB is not false advertisement and can't be sued as such, Nvidia have no obligation under law to have both perform the same as the exact product name is different.

The causal consumer of any product category will always get feasted on by such schemes because they don't do proper research, they are easily satisfied or they don't care because they have better things to do with their time and money and don't care about their purchase.

Just because it have been " industrial practice" to have different memory SKUs share the same chip doesn't mean Nvidia must be obliged to do so for every product, as long as they don't openly declare 1060 3GB and 6GB perform the same or have identical CUDA count they are in the clear.
Edited by sherlock - 8/23/16 at 5:15pm
Skylake 1080 FTW
(18 items)
 
XPS 15
(7 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-6700K  ASUS Maximus VIII Ranger EVGA 1080 FTW TridentZ DDR4-3000 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung SM951 128GB Samsung 840 Pro 256 GB Muskin Reactor 1TB Seagate Baracuda 2TB ST2000DM001 HDD 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Seagate Baracuda 2TB ST2000DM001 HDD Corsair H110i GT Windows 10 Pro  Acer XB321HK 32" 4K G-sync 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Corsair K70 Rapid Fire EVGA SuperNova 650 P2 NZXT H440 Black Logitech G900  
Mouse PadOther
Razer Vespula CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD - PFC Sinewave UPS Syst... 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-7700HQ 2.8Ghz(3.8Ghz Turbo) Dell XPS 15-9560 Nvidia GTX 1050 8GB DDR4-2400 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
256GB PCIE SSD Windows 10 Pro 15.6" 1080p 
  hide details  
Reply
Skylake 1080 FTW
(18 items)
 
XPS 15
(7 items)
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-6700K  ASUS Maximus VIII Ranger EVGA 1080 FTW TridentZ DDR4-3000 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveHard Drive
Samsung SM951 128GB Samsung 840 Pro 256 GB Muskin Reactor 1TB Seagate Baracuda 2TB ST2000DM001 HDD 
Hard DriveCoolingOSMonitor
Seagate Baracuda 2TB ST2000DM001 HDD Corsair H110i GT Windows 10 Pro  Acer XB321HK 32" 4K G-sync 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Corsair K70 Rapid Fire EVGA SuperNova 650 P2 NZXT H440 Black Logitech G900  
Mouse PadOther
Razer Vespula CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD - PFC Sinewave UPS Syst... 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-7700HQ 2.8Ghz(3.8Ghz Turbo) Dell XPS 15-9560 Nvidia GTX 1050 8GB DDR4-2400 
Hard DriveOSMonitor
256GB PCIE SSD Windows 10 Pro 15.6" 1080p 
  hide details  
Reply
post #275 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloCamo View Post

So... what about the most obvious part that you are overlooking for some odd reason. It's been given the same exact model number. Newer gen cards in a numbers hierarchy being slower or equal isn't exactly new... The geforce 4 ti4200 was a lot faster than the geforce 5200, and even the 5600 in many cases. And there are other cases as well...

The issue here is they are literally calling it the same in the same family of gpus and there is a clear performance difference. The buyer isn't going to see" 93% of the gtx1060 6gb performance for 20% less!" on the box. Most people would questions specs a lot more on different model numbers, not when the card is labeled the same minus vram amount.

Whatever happened to calling something like a 1060 LE, SE, GT, etc.? At least the naming advised you that they are not the exact same. Like I said, either should called this a 1050ti or called the 6gb 1060 the 1060ti.

Neither is good practice and both are dishonest.

However in amd case, your more likely to have someone negatively affected than Nvidia.

Both r9 285 and 6870 both imply better performance than their predecessor. Sure it might have a different name than the 280 and 5870 but its named differently in a bad way and the nature of the name implies they are better but they are not. Add in the value of these predecessors(280 and 5870) and a none ignorant consumer would be better off buying these cards than the 285 and 6870 because they had lower street pricing at the time. However because of the naming you would think they were upgrades. Add in the time gap between launches and it creates the potential for sidegrades or even downgrades. The best way to avoid this is downgrade the series down a tier. Like the gtx 680 vs gtx 770. The gtx 770 is the better performer but the step down a tier in naming implies that it isn't enough to be an upgrade.

With the gtx 1060 3gb and 6gb. You have a 200 dollar product and a 250 dollar product. Since there is no competition in Nvidia product stack as 970 and 980 are still more expensive and 960 and below are worse values, the 1060 3gb value proposition remains. For 20% saving for products relatively released near the same time, the 20% savings implies some degradation of performance. It could be more clear for sure like when Nvidia used to say the number of cores on their products but with amd naming antics as of late, if AMD gets a pass for their naming, Nvidia can get a similar pass.
post #276 of 332
@tajoh111
I doubt the naming was ever that import as long as there was a climb in performance or just improvements in the general stats. Years ago Nvidia rebranded many chips after the 8800-series, but toned it down over the years. AMD on the other hand picked that up and had a horrible rebranding, refreshing, rebadgin (whatever) of the 6000, 7000 into R7/R9-200/300 models who are almost identical.

What the fans and buyers loathe Nvidia for are the mistakes with the GTX970 and the aweful Titan branding. Whenever a new Geforce with uneven stats is out from now, the PC-Gamers are automatically on the fence. Yet I don't understand why a slimmed down model should have the full chip enabled like the bigger cards. That often hasn't happened in the recent years at all.

As you say, there is no law to force Nvidia or any other vendor to do this. In the benchmarks the missing SM brings not that much of performance loss as many gamers feared. I was pleasently surprised that the 3GB 1060 can even oftentime take on the 8GB RX480's. Of course there may and will be cases where the FPS will tank at some point. Anyhow the people buy AMD solely for hope that it will not happen with their cards. At this point in time just nobody knows.

-> What is overlooked here is that the OC models of the 3GB version have a little high clocks as the 6GB ones. I have to compare all the models, but there are already 1060 3gB models for sale at 1860+ MHz as factory overclock. For yous not touching additional OC, this is a good base to play their games.

In all honesty, I rather have a questionable card like the budget segment than no such option at all. All of us educated people are not forced to recommend such a card. Yet we can warn or at least mention the potential buyers that this cards are maybe weaker. Several IT magazines and gaming-sites are doing exacty this. If the reader then still decides to buy this product, it is his own decision. To give those guys bad names because you don't like their choise is very small-minded and very unfair.

I mean, how arrogant and unwordly can someone be, if they think to be uplifted to decide what other people do with their own money? And worse, insult them for their chose - that is so low....
Edited by Hardware Hoshi - 8/23/16 at 6:39pm
post #277 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

@tajoh111
I doubt the naming was ever that import as long as there was a climb in performance or just improvements in the general stats. Years ago Nvidia rebranded many chips after the 8800-series, but toned it down over the years. AMD on the other hand picked that up and had a horrible rebranding, refreshing, rebadgin (whatever) of the 6000, 7000 into R7/R9-200/300 models who are almost identical.

What the fans and buyers loathe Nvidia for are the mistakes with the GTX970 and the aweful Titan branding. Whenever a new Geforce with uneven stats is out from now, the PC-Gamers are automatically on the fence. Yet I don't understand why a slimmed down model should have the full chip enabled like the bigger cards. That often hasn't happened in the recent years at all.

As you say, there is no law to force Nvidia or any other vendor to do this. In the benchmarks the missing SM brings not that much of performance loss as many gamers feared. I was pleasently surprised that the 3GB 1060 can even oftentime take on the 8GB RX480's. Of course there may and will be cases where the FPS will tank at some point. Anyhow the people buy AMD solely for hope that it will not happen with their cards. At this point in time just nobody knows.

-> What is overlooked here is that the OC models of the 3GB version have a little high clocks as the 6GB ones. I have to compare all the models, but there are already 1060 3gB models for sale at 1860+ MHz as factory overclock. For yous not touching additional OC, this is a good base to play their games.

In all honesty, I rather have a questionable card like the budget segment than no such option at all. All of us educated people are not forced to recommend such a card. Yet we can warn or at least mention the potential buyers that this cards are maybe weaker. Several IT magazines and gaming-sites are doing exacty this. If the reader then still decides to buy this product, it is his own decision. To give those guys bad names because you don't like their choise is very small-minded and very unfair.

I mean, how arrogant and unwordly can someone be, if they think to be uplifted to decide what other people do with their own money? And worse, insult them for their chose - that is so low....

Of course you would start off your post downplaying a cards that have nothing to do with the topic at hand - and ironically aimed at only one company. Horrible rebranding? Or is it horrible to you that a rebranded 290x can beat a 980 in many cases? Funny you don't mention the 680 being rebranded into the 770 of course.

But that's all besides the point as anyone can the nonsense you are spewing. You say:
Quote:
"In the benchmarks the missing SM brings not that much of performance loss as many gamers feared."

Really, because an 11fps drop at 1080p in RoTR isn't a big difference?

You continue to make odd justifications as to why people would buy this card such as those factory overclocked cards that are over $200 and ridiculously close to 480 8gb and 1060 6gb pricing, making them irrelevant. If you want to continue to defend ignorance, that's on you. I'm not going to sit here and not call out a foolish purchase on the basis of "it's their money and choice". Of course it is - but that doesn't suddenly make it not an ignorant and foolish purchase decision. Small minded and unfair? The world is not fair and reality is reality. Stop sugar coating a bad decision it doesn't help anyone.

You need to look at the bigger picture here of what I have been stressing and stop focusing on wrong perceptions about what I am saying. Or you can just continue to think I am "unworldy, arrogant and small minded". Oh and don't forget "uplifted" as well. I like that one.
Edited by SoloCamo - 8/23/16 at 7:14pm
The Struggle (4k)
(20 items)
 
File Server
(12 items)
 
Lenovo G50-45
(6 items)
 
CPUGraphicsRAMOS
Athlon II X2 250u Nvidia 6150SE  2gb DDR3 1066mhz Windows 10 Home 64 bit 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
AMD A8-6410 AMD R5 Crucial Ballistix 8GB DDR3L 1866 CAS10 Crucial BX100 250gb 
Optical DriveOS
DVD Windows 10 Home 
  hide details  
Reply
The Struggle (4k)
(20 items)
 
File Server
(12 items)
 
Lenovo G50-45
(6 items)
 
CPUGraphicsRAMOS
Athlon II X2 250u Nvidia 6150SE  2gb DDR3 1066mhz Windows 10 Home 64 bit 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
AMD A8-6410 AMD R5 Crucial Ballistix 8GB DDR3L 1866 CAS10 Crucial BX100 250gb 
Optical DriveOS
DVD Windows 10 Home 
  hide details  
Reply
post #278 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloCamo View Post

Of course you would start off your post downplaying a cards that have nothing to do with the topic at hand - and ironically aimed at only one company. Horrible rebranding? Or is it horrible to you that a rebranded 290x can beat a 980 in many cases? Funny you don't mention the 680 being rebranded into the 770 of course.

How often has the 290x been rebranded / refreshed already? How often the HD7970 already? Hell, the whole 7000 and 200 have been rebranded each at least once. If you have practically the same card for years, it is no wonder they get faster at some point. AMD has optimized those cards to hell. Havin't one rebrand here and there from a model to the next lower tier once in a while would be OK for both vendors. Just fiddling with the specs a bit and sell i.e. a 290X as a 390X is not!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloCamo View Post

But that's all besides the point as anyone can the nonsense you are spewing. You say:
Really, because an 11fps drop at 1080p in RoTR isn't a big difference?

And? That is one game with a certain setting. I will not repeait my other posts over and over again just because posters like you have such an ignorant tunnel vsion to get what I tell. I have named more than enough scenarios where this card could make sense. To declare them nonsense just shows you don't care for those arguments at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloCamo View Post

You continue to make odd justifications as to why people would buy this card such as those factory overclocked cards that are over $200 and ridiculously close to 480 8gb and 1060 6gb pricing, making them irrelevant. If you want to continue to defend ignorance, that's on you. I'm not going to sit here and not call out a foolish purchase on the basis of "it's their money and choice". Of course it is - but that doesn't suddenly make it not an ignorant and foolish purchase decision. Small minded and unfair? The world is not fair and reality is reality. Stop sugar coating a bad decision.

As we have already discussed alot, the prices are not stable at the moment and can be very different depeing the region they are sold. What card is irrelevent will be decided by the buyers and their needs, not you. Turning down your own ignorance could help to see this too. I am not defending this card at all costs and have stated I did buy the bigger one despite the higher costs.
You can not sugar coat a bad decision it it is not yours to make in the first place. Speaking as a PCMR I am, getting rid of all the casual gamers with their crappy APUs and consoles would be my delight. However I don't insult those players all day because their lack of judgement. They feel good with their choice and there is nothing in the world to change that. The potential buyers of the 1060 3GB version might feel the same.

Once the prices have stabilized and better equilized to all regions, we can make a better judgment as I msut have said half a douzen times already.
post #279 of 332
It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. Seeing that the 1050 2/4 is like to fall into the same situation I can't help hope they get sued and lose so they'll have a little more incentive to stop practices of this nature. I wonder if they'll limit this to the lower end of the stack?
post #280 of 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by maltamonk View Post

It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. Seeing that the 1050 2/4 is like to fall into the same situation I can't help hope they get sued and lose so they'll have a little more incentive to stop practices of this nature. I wonder if they'll limit this to the lower end of the stack?

Nah, the GTX 1050 will probably contain another chip called GP107. The even smaller GTX / GTS 1040 should be the GP 108 then. They are not the same as the GP106 in the GTX 1060s. I still don't understand what you guys want to sue. There is no juridical basis to succeed.
Edited by Hardware Hoshi - 8/23/16 at 7:34pm
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Hardware News
Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Hardware News › [Techreport] Nvidia makes its GTX 1060 3GB card official