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144hz Monitor Justification - Page 2

post #11 of 29
@Stretch56: A good starting point for you if you're considering 144hz would be the Dell S2716DG. It is 27", 1440p, 144Hz, G-sync, but it is TN. It's among the best TN monitors though in terms of color. You avoid the QC issues of the IPS monitors, have great Dell warranty, and 1ms response time. I personally don't notice a difference in response time (came from a 1ms TN to 4ms IPS). Negatives of this monitor are gamma shift (you already have a TN so you're likely used to it) and pixel inversion in some fast motion scenes. Which could be noticeable to you in some games.

Picking a 144hz monitor is stressful at the moment, there is no perfect option out there sadly. But whatever you choose as others have said it is a night and day difference vs. 60hz. One comparison I make is it is similar to a mild "soap opera effect" on all of these "120hz" TVs that are not really 120hz. Everything is butter smooth and without the choppiness / artificial look that motion interpolation brings by inserting blank frames on a TV. If that makes sense. I agree with everyone who says once you go 144hz you will never go back.

I'm excited for you. Seeing 144hz for the first time is a great experience. For me it was like seeing HD for the first time. I was grinning ear to ear and laughing out loud because I couldn't believe how great it was.

*Edit- and then there's the other decision of 24" or 27", and 1080p or 1440p. If you want to stick with 1080p I would go no larger than a 24" monitor.
Edited by jlp0209 - 8/29/16 at 8:23am
post #12 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlp0209 View Post

@Stretch56: A good starting point for you if you're considering 144hz would be the Dell S2716DG. It is 27", 1440p, 144Hz, G-sync, but it is TN. It's among the best TN monitors though in terms of color. You avoid the QC issues of the IPS monitors, have great Dell warranty, and 1ms response time. I personally don't notice a difference in response time (came from a 1ms TN to 4ms IPS). Negatives of this monitor are gamma shift (you already have a TN so you're likely used to it) and pixel inversion in some fast motion scenes. Which could be noticeable to you in some games.

Picking a 144hz monitor is stressful at the moment, there is no perfect option out there sadly. But whatever you choose as others have said it is a night and day difference vs. 60hz. One comparison I make is it is similar to a mild "soap opera effect" on all of these "120hz" TVs that are not really 120hz. Everything is butter smooth and without the choppiness / artificial look that motion interpolation brings by inserting blank frames on a TV. If that makes sense. I agree with everyone who says once you go 144hz you will never go back.

I'm excited for you. Seeing 144hz for the first time is a great experience. For me it was like seeing HD for the first time. I was grinning ear to ear and laughing out loud because I couldn't believe how great it was.

*Edit- and then there's the other decision of 24" or 27", and 1080p or 1440p. If you want to stick with 1080p I would go no larger than a 24" monitor.

Thanks for the help.

I originally considered the Dell S2716DG but I didn't think it would fit my desktop. Then I saw the Dell S2417DG 1440P 24" and it raised an eyebrow. I haven't seen any reviews yet and it was $569.99 a few weeks back, but today it's down to $499.99. Still a little high, but it might be worth the wait. My only concern with the 24" at 1440P, is the scaling. I've read that 1920x1200 is the perfect size for a 24", like the Dell U2415 IPS but it's only 60hz.

My main problem is that I only have a Best Buy in my area for comparing monitors in person. They have very few on display and no 144hz monitors. I would have to drive (3) hours to LA for a Micro Center or the Bay Area for a Fry's to find monitors I can look at first hand. So I'm left to researching everything online and gambling that the monitor I choose will live up to expectations.
Edited by Stretch56 - 8/29/16 at 1:33pm
post #13 of 29
144Hz alone isn't going to improve your sp experience. I'd recommend a decent 1440p FreeSync (AMD) or G-Sync (Nvidia) monitor to run around 50 - 75Hz, and then you can also raise the graphics quality settings. Variable refresh will do wonders for you when your fps fluctuates as much as the range I listed above. On top of eliminating frame tears, it seems to also smooth out the frame pacing, that's why around 50fps can still look smooth with it compared to software v-sync or fast sync.

Some guidelines that might be helpful:
For MP: 100Hz + low motion blur + fast sync, gains motion clarity with reduced input lag and eliminates tearing
For SP: 50 - 75Hz variable refresh rate, gains smoothness in frame pacing, eliminates tearing, increase graphics quality, option to downsample, greatly reduced stuttering
Edited by mouacyk - 8/29/16 at 11:58am
post #14 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mouacyk View Post

144Hz alone isn't going to improve your sp experience. I'd recommend a decent 1440p FreeSync (AMD) or G-Sync (Nvidia) monitor to run around 50 - 75Hz, and then you can also raise the graphics quality settings. Variable refresh will do wonders for you when your fps fluctuates as much as the range I listed above. On top of eliminating frame tears, it seems to also smooth out the frame pacing, that's why around 50fps can still look smooth with it compared to software v-sync or fast sync.

Thanks,

I originally decided on the BenQ XL2430T but it was $329 last time I checked. But then the whole G-Sync issue came into play because of the price point on the XL2430T so I adjusted my budget to include it. I'm still committed to the 24" size but the 1440P is very intriguing.
post #15 of 29
Your emphasis seems to be SP, but I think the BENQ monitors you listed are meant more for MP (144Hz, TN, and motion blur reduction) and a lot of its potential will be wasted when you only game in sp.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824025112

I have used the above ultrawide IPS monitor overclocked at 75Hz through DP. If you have an AMD card, this monitor will work even greater -- the 75Hz becomes native along with the ability to turn FreeSync on. And you will get the great colors of an IPS panel. This monitor is more fit for SP, considering the price and aspect ratio (use ultra-wide fixer tools). I bought mine at $280, when it was still retailing for around $500. Just make sure you don't get the older models with the bottom gray lines when FreeSync is enabled.
post #16 of 29
Honestly man anything above 85hz looks awesome. 100 is the sweet spot for performance I think. With a 1070, you may have a hard time with some games, but I'd go for the Acer Predator XB271HU. It checks all the boxes, IPS, 144hz+, 1440p, G-Sync, and at 27", I think the pixel density is dead on for what it is.
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post #17 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mouacyk View Post

Your emphasis seems to be SP, but I think the BENQ monitors you listed are meant more for MP (144Hz, TN, and motion blur reduction) and a lot of its potential will be wasted when you only game in sp.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824025112

I have used the above ultrawide IPS monitor overclocked at 75Hz through DP. If you have an AMD card, this monitor will work even greater -- the 75Hz becomes native along with the ability to turn FreeSync on. And you will get the great colors of an IPS panel. This monitor is more fit for SP, considering the price and aspect ratio (use ultra-wide fixer tools). I bought mine at $280, when it was still retailing for around $500. Just make sure you don't get the older models with the bottom gray lines when FreeSync is enabled.


When I started down the upgrade road a few weeks ago, I thought about just getting either a Dell U2415 or U2515 and calling it good. I was mainly looking for a sharper higher resolution panel then my 1680x1050 Dell. Of course that opened the floodgates because the monitor industry and gaming had changed so much since I bought my Dell 2208WFP. Now with bigger monitors, 1440P & 4K resolutions, OLED on the horizon, 144hz to 180hz refresh rates, 1 to 4ms response times, low input lag and Display Ports, it's enough to make a sane person question their own purpose in life.

Ideally for me, there should be a 24" 144hz IPS with a 1 to 4ms response out there. Unfortunately I haven't found one and so as with everything, compromise comes into play. It's just like my water cooling build. I used a Corsair C70 that was configured for a basement radiator. But of course, I had to have a short PSU otherwise the bottom Rad wouldn't fit. Then I had to fabricate (2) rails out of 1/8" bar Aluminum for the bottom Rad to fasten too and then re-position the rails as far forward as I could to have enough clearance for my fittings and PSU cables. Then I had to fabricate a bracket to hold my EK-XRES 140 Revo on to the motherboard tray, and on and on and on. Sometimes It's nice to just be a dumbass and not have to think something to death.

But we have to play the cards we're dealt. Harry Callahan once said, "A man's got to know his limitations" My limitation is that I overthink S**T to death and ultimately spend way more than my budget. But what the hell, that's why there's credit cards and Dell financing.

Thanks again thumb.gif
post #18 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTRtank View Post

Honestly man anything above 85hz looks awesome. 100 is the sweet spot for performance I think. With a 1070, you may have a hard time with some games, but I'd go for the Acer Predator XB271HU. It checks all the boxes, IPS, 144hz+, 1440p, G-Sync, and at 27", I think the pixel density is dead on for what it is.


I don't really want to spend $800 for the Predator or the ROG Swift PG279Q. $800 was the original budget for my GTX1070 and a monitor, excluding the EK waterblock for the 1070. I know they both have their own QC issues and that just may be the way things are nowadays, but it doesn't hurt to be optimistic. $400 to $500 is going to be my new monitor budget.
post #19 of 29
Well, it's really different strokes for different folks. I used to preach the awesomeness of 120Hz+ monitors and I said that I would never go to anything below 120Hz, and here I am with a 60Hz monitor again tongue.gif The bottom line is that you will get used to whichever monitor you use, be it 144Hz, 60Hz, 4K, TN, IPS, 24", 27", 55"etc. Adaptive refresh technologies can help sway your decision, but in the end, you need to choose a monitor that will make the time you spend on your computer the most lifelike and enjoyable.

While I won't argue that 120Hz+ makes everything better, be it watching movies with SVP, gaming, and even general navigation, it isn't all that great. Well, it is, but you can re-acclimate yourself to a 60Hz monitor if you chose to. To make analogy, it's like using an IPS monitor for years and going back to TN. Will the colors be less accurate? Most likely, but you will get used to it if you use that TN long enough, unless you primarily do color-sensitive work. There is an adjustment phase with everything, and because of that, I try not to limit my selections to one particular technology. Instead, try to find the best balance of the things that are important to you.

For example, since around 2012 until April this year, I was primarily using 120Hz+ monitors (BenQ XL2720T and Z). I was loving the experience that high refresh rates offered, but something was always off. While the higher refresh rate was more realistic, and the ppi of a 27" 1080p monitor allowed me to sit at a variety of positions and distances while being able to easily read stuff, I never really felt immersed into what I was doing. So, I did some research and chose UHD550. Twice the size, IPS, 4 times the resolution, but no 120Hz.

While I miss having 120Hz, the other things I get in return balances things out (well, it's more one-sided now). This monitor is closer to my ideal than before, and it compliments my usage habits very well.

I'm sorry for the vagueness of my post, but it's really hard to give you a concise recommendation because there are no hard-cut lines other than your budget.
post #20 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by airisom2 View Post

Well, it's really different strokes for different folks. I used to preach the awesomeness of 120Hz+ monitors and I said that I would never go to anything below 120Hz, and here I am with a 60Hz monitor again tongue.gif The bottom line is that you will get used to whichever monitor you use, be it 144Hz, 60Hz, 4K, TN, IPS, 24", 27", 55"etc. Adaptive refresh technologies can help sway your decision, but in the end, you need to choose a monitor that will make the time you spend on your computer the most lifelike and enjoyable.


I appreciate the advice, I really do.

I'm going through what everybody else has gone through at some degree or another. It's not our fault, that the monitor manufactures won't give us what we want and only give us what they think we need. Albeit some are better at listening to consumers than others. With that said, they're obligated to their shareholders and need to make a profit. I'm all for capitalism but it seems there's a market for 24" IPS 144hz gaming monitors that's being ignored. It's not like the technology isn't there, they just want a higher profit margin and they get that by producing the Acer Predator XB271HU and ROG Swift PG279Q, knowing we'll buy it because they're the only game in town with those parameters.

My son had an older Samsung P2770FH 1920x1080 @60 Hz that he left at home. I tried it out, but the 1080P didn't work for me on the 27". I could make the physical size work but I preferred a smaller footprint. So since the Devil's in the Details, it was just a matter of trying to find the best bang for the buck, just like all of us do.

Maybe I'm getting to old or I'm still to much of a rebel but it seems like many of the manufacturers that produce gaming style monitors, use the same panels, come up with gamer style designs with proprietary OSD's and call themselves unique. It's like choosing between Chevron and Shell gasoline. No matter what you name it, it's still a fossil fuel. An AU Optronics M240HW01 V8 TN Panel is the same panel, whether it's in an Acer XB241H, Asus PG248Q or a AOC G2460PG. There all priced about the same so what's the difference. Beats me.

Must be time for a Xanax and a two fingers of Scotch. rolleyes.gif
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