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[ScientificAmerican] Earth’s CO2 Passes the 400 PPM Threshold—Maybe Permanently - Page 13

post #121 of 189
I do believe the climate is changing and I do believe we humans have some sort of impact, but how much is still an unanswered question. How we fix it is an even bigger question. Because herein lies the issue with human nature. Below I'll try and explain some scenarios that I foresee.

We may not be able to fix it, maybe only slow it down enough that we can adapt to it. But what would be the cost? Obviously as people are living differently across the Globe they'll have to implement different changes to their lifestyles and herein lies the big problem.

Humans are competitive and greedy. Simply put one will not refrain from using a resource if they know someone else will use it instead. So the western world will probably not agree to cut down on resource consumption just so the rest of the world can increase its consumption.

If the overall consumption will remain the same or even increase why sacrifice the well-fare of your own people for the benefit of others? Also many in poorer countries probably couldn't care less about any climate change and they'd just like a bigger slice of the pie - regardless of the consequences to the environment. They have been kept down for so long, haven't they? How come now that when they try to rise up, the evil western world tries to continue to keep them down? (at least that's what they think)

Fewer people overall seems like a simple answer with a not so simple implementation. Newer technologies also seem like a theoretically simple answer but they also have a cost - one which we may not see now.

Practically though I suspect that in short to medium term we'll see the usual minor steps: some more taxes here, some tax cuts there, some bans on some technology/chemicals/processes, some incentives for others, some fines, some protests ...

Depending on where you are and what you do these things will either be beneficial or detrimental to you.
post #122 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbie2009 View Post

And those who see all predictions made by global warmers have failed to pass and the models warmers use don't even take into account the SUN with regards to climate. Beyond retarded. All predictions wrong, don't include the sun, but very credible. Oh and caught cooking the numbers too.
Oh and seen as global warming wasn't working, changed to climate change, because ya know, without humans, the climate was always the same.

Friends of government get a pass on the carbon tax to "fight" global warming, smaller companies get raped and competition of the largest companies go out of business.

Whilst actual pollution continues unchecked and rich people flying around in private jets preach to cut your carbon footprint.
Very well said !
post #123 of 189
one thing is for sure
we never found this amount of atmospheric carbon dioxide from any ice cores and this goes back to almost 1M years
there will be a drastic result? well, we will see in near future

btw co2 might be a vital part of the growth cycle of plants and other living things but for us and most of agriculture it impacts in a very negative way (not just co2 but other gases\waste from the industry) increasing the fungi and other diseases in the plants requiring more resources to harvest and also use of toxic substances to balance.

try living "near" of a coal industry like 20km away you will see how bad it is.
impossible to use the land and you will get lungcancer slowly
Edited by jmcosta - 10/3/16 at 6:30pm
post #124 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kommanche View Post

OP's Post (Click to show)

The word you're looking for is "Climate Change". Global Warming is considered a redundant term, as not all climates get warmer as a result of climate change.

For example, melting sea ice is weakening the gulf stream, which may cause the UK to actually get colder as the gulf stream is a transatlantic current of warm water.

"Climate Change" requires a global change in wind patterns, not just an increase in temperature. There are all sorts of predictions that I am not allowed to accurately describe due to the terms and two stupidly hidden documents someplace on this website but what it boils down to is this.

There's not a single "climate scientist" on Earth who is actually espousing science when they claim the IPCC has it right.

The entire theory of CO2 apocalypse is based off of a misunderstanding of an imaging study done by the USAF in the 1960's and the preaching of a science-illiterate 'intellectual' from the 1800's who also introduced the concept of "peak oil" and claimed the world would run out before 1900.
post #125 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by cutty1998 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbie2009 View Post

And those who see all predictions made by global warmers have failed to pass and the models warmers use don't even take into account the SUN with regards to climate. Beyond retarded. All predictions wrong, don't include the sun, but very credible. Oh and caught cooking the numbers too.
Oh and seen as global warming wasn't working, changed to climate change, because ya know, without humans, the climate was always the same.

Friends of government get a pass on the carbon tax to "fight" global warming, smaller companies get raped and competition of the largest companies go out of business.

Whilst actual pollution continues unchecked and rich people flying around in private jets preach to cut your carbon footprint.
Very well said !
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post #126 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by rluker5 View Post

...or we could worry about those things we can, like voting for someone who will spend less resources on trying to control the weather.
It all seemed reasonable until it wasn't rolleyes.gif
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post #127 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mookster View Post

I just looked BulletBait's graphs, checked other sources, found the same info presented by credible sources (often scientists.)

To me this is a question of faith in certain scientists / politicians, not a question of faith in science itself. It's not even a question of faith in climate change; it's a question of faith in human-caused climate change. And if this climate change is human caused, it's a moral question and a question of realism surrounding the way people plan to deal with it.

Population control? Deny energy to developing worlds? Reduce our own energy consumption and risk becoming economically or militarily weaker than other nations? By the way, what if those other nations don't believe us, and will only end up buying up fuel that we decide not to?

What if we lose our influence and can't force China / Russia to adhere to our plans to stop global warming? If it truly is a question of survival for the human race, do we stop them now? If not, when?



No, people who deny or question human-caused climate change and the implications of it are not just scared. They're not just worried about their money. They're worried about faith driven decisions, when those people asking for our faith are not giving us realistic information to make decisions.. yet still forcing us to make a decision.

Not as simple as you want it to be. The world isn't sunshine and lollipops; if we aren't being given information about decisions, we need to remain skeptical about the implications of passive approval. We need to know what it means to fight climate change. It does not mean magical free energy. To some, it might mean eugenics, or genocide. To some, it might mean food can't be delivered to their bustling populations. Fossil fuels are a product of American industrialism, which is a product of American freedom, which is a product of rebellion against the British Empire, which many still view to be a reckless thing that led to THIS destabilization of the world.

I'm not saying that's a good point of view, I'm saying that people abroad might hold this point of view. Possibly certain religious extremists, or maybe entire countries who fought against American influence just in the last two world wars.

Global warming is kind of a big deal when you're in China, Russia, The Middle East, Argentina, Vietnam, South America, Cuba, Ukraine, Turkey.. I don't know? It's a long list of people who rely on America to keep the oil flowing to their country. The thought of American politicians and possibly military viewing global warming as a threat to America.. that MIGHT cause certain world leaders to be concerned about what America will do as the world's military, economic, and energy superpower.

Or maybe it's just that climate denying is stupid because science.

What people tend to forget in this argument is it doesn't matter why ti's caused, it is undeniable that it is happening! The only thing that matters is we have the ability to change it and we are not and for that we are fools that will suffer the consequences. The argument itself is a diversion from the reality.
post #128 of 189
Yawn, don't care one bit. CO2 is statistically insignificant as a green house gas in comparison to the real driver of temperature: Good old water vapor. CO2 levels have been massively higher on this planet than they are now innumerable times, long before mammals let alone humans walked the Earth. None of this matters at all. The climate is not, nor will it ever be static. It will get much hotter than it is now and, yes, it will get much colder too. There is nothing we can do to keep this climate where we want it and destroying our economies by regressing the technologies that make modern life possible is pointless and needlessly destructive to our lifestyles.

I'll continue driving my car and bike as much as I like thank you very much.
post #129 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

Yawn, don't care one bit. CO2 is statistically insignificant as a green house gas in comparison to the real driver of temperature: Good old water vapor. CO2 levels have been massively higher on this planet than they are now innumerable times, long before mammals let alone humans walked the Earth. None of this matters at all. The climate is not, nor will it ever be static. It will get much hotter than it is now and, yes, it will get much colder too. There is nothing we can do to keep this climate where we want it and destroying our economies by regressing the technologies that make modern life possible is pointless and needlessly destructive to our lifestyles.

I'll continue driving my car and bike as much as I like thank you very much.
What people tend to forget in this argument is it doesn't matter why ti's caused, it is undeniable that it is happening! The only thing that matters is we have the ability to change it and we are not and for that we are fools that will suffer the consequences. The argument itself is a diversion from the reality.
post #130 of 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by claes View Post

It all seemed reasonable until it wasn't rolleyes.gif
Just trying to come up with something related and more effective.
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