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Extreme Air Zen Design Suggestions

6K views 197 replies 24 participants last post by  Klue22 
#1 ·
I just finished putting my first real gaming rig together, and found out quite quickly that temps were way too high, so I even bought a huge Cougar Panzer Max ATX-Full tower and equipped it with 4 x 120mm intake fans and 3 x 120mm exhaust fans, and STILL, if I attempt IntelBurn at all it reaches 100 C within 3 minutes and shuts down my system (MB Thermal Protection) even with fresh MX-4 Paste. So if you ever have any doubt that stock coolers are junk, just use me as an example lol.

Now Im planning on buying a decent, yet inexpensive AIO 240mm liquid system to combat the heat of my Phenom II X4 970 Black, and I'm unsure which to buy. Reviews are non-conclusive, and place each AIO in a different spot each and every time, there is no real pattern, but I am planning on using the AIO on my future AMD Zen build, and I am wondering which to buy. I am interested in:

Enermax Liquitec II 240mm
Silverstone TD02 240mm
Artic "Liquid Freezer" 240mm

Any suggestions?
 
#3 ·
Are you sure it was a wraith cooler? Those are new and only on certain new cpu models iirc, You would have had to buy one seperately, the cooler your cpu came with is not a wraith cooler. Every other stock cooler is junk, that's why AMD making the wraith cooler was notable.
 
#4 ·
You must be doing something wrong. The Wraith is much better than the older stock cooler and it does ok. I got 4.5 hz with it on an 8350 and another fellow got 5 ghz with it. Even made a youtube video. The old one sounds like a mosquito in your ear tho. And the Wraith has better cooling capacity than that one.

The only time I have ever seen overheating to a system shutdown came when the motherboard bios "forgot" to rev up the fans under load.
 
#5 ·
Well I suppose it could not be called the wraith back then, but to find out if it was a wraith (because there are simply so many coolers on the market), I looked at modern wraith cooler images. It is nearly identical. It looks like AMD ran the wraith coolers for a very long time, but maybe they didnt call them Wraith until later, I am unsure. The only difference between my cooler and a modern wraith is a slightly smaller fan though. Otherwise the copper pipes and aluminum heatsink are identical.
 
#6 ·
i can second that the wraith is better than the stock cooler. is it posible that its plugged into the wrong header ?
 
#7 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by xxpenguinxx View Post

I OC'd my 965 to 4GHz on the stock cooler. It ran near 60C at full load and sounded like a jet engine, but it worked. Is the CPU fan revving up when the temps rise?
Yes, it revs up, it gets quite loud, but what is surprising to see is that the fan blows down on to the CPU, I think this is where the problem lies in this particular cooler. Maybe thats what makes is not a wraith, a junk fan facing the wrong way? I cant see why anyone would let the heat rise up the copper pipes and then decide to blow the heat all over the heat sink again, just doesnt make any sense. Do modern Wraiths "Pull" instead of "Push"?
 
#8 ·
#12 ·
#13 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moparman View Post

For an aftermarket cooler this Coolgate is nice and you can't beat the price. I ordered one and the I30 they had. With push pull fans as it comes with both sets of clips the coolgate does pretty well and for $14 you can't go wrong. https://www.coolerguys.com/products/spire-coolgate-2012-sp988b1-v3-pwm-cpu-cooler
Well while that cooler does look good and is incredibly cheap, if I were to do air, I would want copper contact, I would probably do a good old Hyper 212 EVO, totally worth $30 any day of the week. Stick with what you know, right? This may be my first physical build but Ive helped others build and Ive been an advid enthusiast since age 10, I just never have money to build.

But anyways, I am more interested in an AIO Water solution because I do plan on building that AMD Zen rig as shown in my signature. AMD has confirmed that the socket bracket will remain the same and that any cooler that works with AM2, AM2+, AM3, AM3+, FM1, or FM2 will be directly interchangeable with the new AM4 socket, so I want to buy an AIO now so I don't need/want to later on.
 
#14 ·
Don't waste your money on a sealed liquid cooler. The only AIO systems worth buying are the Swiftech & EKWB coolers, both of which are well over $100. Your case supports up to 170mm tall air cooler. You'd be much better served by a ND-D15, NH-D15S, Silver Arrow, or something similar. You'll see temperatures to a 280mm CLC with much less noise & no risk of leaks at a lower cost. As long as you're not using RAM with stupidly tall heat spreaders, you shouldn't have clearance issues there, even most of the 140mm coolers will fit in your case without issue, but verify that height before buying as well. The only reasons to consider the current CLC designs are if you just prefer the look or already bought RAM with compatibility issues.
 
#15 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlewbell View Post

Don't waste your money on a sealed liquid cooler. The only AIO systems worth buying are the Swiftech & EKWB coolers, both of which are well over $100. Your case supports up to 170mm tall air cooler. You'd be much better served by a ND-D15, NH-D15S, Silver Arrow, or something similar. You'll see temperatures to a 280mm CLC with much less noise & no risk of leaks at a lower cost. As long as you're not using RAM with stupidly tall heat spreaders, you shouldn't have clearance issues there, even most of the 140mm coolers will fit in your case without issue, but verify that height before buying as well. The only reasons to consider the current CLC designs are if you just prefer the look or already bought RAM with compatibility issues.
Hmmm, interesting, but I am planning on overclocking and from what Ive heard if you dont want to spend $500+ on a custom water cooling setup, to get AIO units.

What do you think of the new gen Hyper 212X Dual fan Turbo edition? The single fan new gen 212X is only $5 less, and even if it doesnt fit, I can just pull a fan off. Im willing to spend $5 for push-pull effect. And unlike alot of comanies, Cooler-Master didn't mess with the design much because they know its already such a flawless design, all they did is put notches in the fins to deal with heat pockets and used a much newer fan with a longer life bearing. Do you think the 212X is good?
 
#16 ·
#17 ·
The 212 can handle around 1.4 volts for everyday use and a little more for benching. With good case air flow the twin towers can handle 1.5 + volts. I have gone over 1.6 volts with mine. The AIOs can't do any better than that. How far are you planning to OC?
 
#18 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by WallacEngineer View Post

Hmmm, interesting, but I am planning on overclocking and from what Ive heard if you dont want to spend $500+ on a custom water cooling setup, to get AIO units.

What do you think of the new gen Hyper 212X Dual fan Turbo edition? The single fan new gen 212X is only $5 less, and even if it doesnt fit, I can just pull a fan off. Im willing to spend $5 for push-pull effect. And unlike alot of comanies, Cooler-Master didn't mess with the design much because they know its already such a flawless design, all they did is put notches in the fins to deal with heat pockets and used a much newer fan with a longer life bearing. Do you think the 212X is good?
There's nothing necessarily wrong with the Hyper 212X, but it's not in the same class as the larger air coolers I mentioned. If you're really wanting to overclock, you're better off getting something larger. The ones I would recommend looking at are as follows:
Noctua NH-D15
Noctua NH-D15S
Phanteks PH-TC14PE
Thermalright Silver Arrow
Cryorig R1 Universal
Cryorig R1 Ultimate

Depending on your choice of RAM, the front fan on some of these may not be able to fit in your case, but most of these will only do slightly worse with only a single fan. Additionally, with the PH-TC14PE, you may have to omit the screw that holds the bracket over the heatsink for the center fan to fit in your case. Once the cooler is mounted, this screw doesn't do anything, so that's not a problem, but it's good to know before you have issues.
 
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#19 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlewbell View Post

There's nothing necessarily wrong with the Hyper 212X, but it's not in the same class as the larger air coolers I mentioned. If you're really wanting to overclock, you're better off getting something larger. The ones I would recommend looking at are as follows:
Noctua NH-D15
Noctua NH-D15S
Phanteks PH-TC14PE
Thermalright Silver Arrow
Cryorig R1 Universal
Cryorig R1 Ultimate

Depending on your choice of RAM, the front fan on some of these may not be able to fit in your case, but most of these will only do slightly worse with only a single fan. Additionally, with the PH-TC14PE, you may have to omit the screw that holds the bracket over the heatsink for the center fan to fit in your case. Once the cooler is mounted, this screw doesn't do anything, so that's not a problem, but it's good to know before you have issues.
I have seen and read reviews of all the products you have posted here. The Cyborg Ultimate R1 seems to win in performace, but doesnt inclue fluid-dynamic bearings, I do see an interesting adition from Be Quiet! Though, The Dark Rock Pro 3 seems to have quite good performance from dual towers and fluid bearings, and a slightly lower $70 price than the $90 Cyborg or $85 Noctua, but has a funny design of 100mm front fan then 135mm rear fan, not sure how it would play out. Theres one final addition, the Cooler master GTS V8, just because of triple heatsinks. Any speculation on these?
 
#20 ·
Cryorig is not a Cyborg!
buttkick.gif
biggrin.gif


Fluid Dynamic bearing is just a fancy name for a fancy sleeve bearing.

I've been following this thread from first post and didn't reply because of how you were posting. I was pretty sure you were making false claims about your cooler and blaming it for poor case airflow and user error .. not really a cooler problem at all. Now we know that is what it was.

Like others have said, a good air cooler is better than a CLC .. will cool just as well or better, make much less noise, and last many, many years longer.

If you want to go water cooler, get a Swiftech Hxxx X2 series or EK xxx Predator series AIO cooler. Both are real water cooling, not 'wanna-be-water' cooling CLCs.
 
#21 ·
I think I may have found the one I like best - The Cyborg R1 Universal rather than the ultimate. Seems to be the only High-End Dual Tower capable of clearing high RAM Heatsinks, which my Future-Plan G.Skil Trident-Z Series RAM will probably need. Every picture I looks at shows the Noctura, Phanteks, and R1 Ultimate all being too large to fit properly.
 
#22 ·
CRYORIG! CRYORIG! CRYORIG! CRYORIG!
biggrin.gif


Cyborg does not cool well at all. It is too full of cyborgs! R1 Universal cools very well because it is immune to cyborgs.
biggrin.gif



R1 Universal is very good.
thumb.gif
 
#23 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

CRYORIG! CRYORIG! CRYORIG! CRYORIG!
biggrin.gif


Cyborg does not cool well at all. It is too full of cyborgs! R1 Universal cools very well because it is immune to cyborgs.
biggrin.gif



R1 Universal is very good.
thumb.gif
I have done more research and found that a Thermalright True Spirit Power Edition 140mm has a ridiculous 360 Watt TDP, and is supposed to out-class most dual-towers and even some high-end AIO , liquid units (240mm units), this and its massive 48mm (6x8mm) of heat pipes, really leads be to believe that somehow this single-tower design that is very affordable, absolutely destroys all other solutions. Especially as it being a single tower means absolutely no chance of RAM or other interference.

I am also interested in the Thermalright Silver Arrow ITX, or Noctua D15S as both are dual tower designs but with only a single fan in the middle, using case intake for the front radiator cooling.

So what do you think of these ideas?
 
#24 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by doyll View Post

CRYORIG! CRYORIG! CRYORIG! CRYORIG!
biggrin.gif


Cyborg does not cool well at all. It is too full of cyborgs! R1 Universal cools very well because it is immune to cyborgs.
biggrin.gif
Haters gonna hate...Cyborgs cools very well ..
tongue.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by WallacEngineer View Post

I have done more research and found that a Thermalright True Spirit Power Edition 140mm has a ridiculous 360 Watt TDP, and is supposed to out-class most dual-towers and even some high-end AIO , liquid units (240mm units), this and its massive 48mm (6x8mm) of heat pipes, really leads be to believe that somehow this single-tower design that is very affordable, absolutely destroys all other solutions. Especially as it being a single tower means absolutely no chance of RAM or other interference.

I am also interested in the Thermalright Silver Arrow ITX, or Noctua D15S as both are dual tower designs but with only a single fan in the middle, using case intake for the front radiator cooling.

So what do you think of these ideas?
For a single tower the True Spirit Power Edition 140mm is a good cooler, It'd definitely be a huge upgrade from your stock cooler, but don't expect it to beat dual tower coolers.
 
#25 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashura View Post

Haters gonna hate...Cyborgs cools very well ..
tongue.gif

For a single tower the True Spirit Power Edition 140mm is a good cooler, It'd definitely be a huge upgrade from your stock cooler, but don't expect it to beat dual tower coolers.
Im not sure if it really would loose to most twin towers, I mean just look at the things specs, it must be the most powerful single tower in existance, Ive never even heard of 300+ watt TDP from an air-cooled system, and it does have bigger and more heat pipes than ANY Noctua, Phanteks, the Cryorig, pretty much any other heatsink on the market. Im also interested in Tall RAM clearence so I can have my G.Skill Trident-Z modules, so with the Exception of the R1 Universal Im going to have to eliminate the front fan and either delete it or move it to the rear (unlikely due to clearence and air choke-point).

So, after hours of reasearch, I have conluded that my final options are:

Cryorig R1 Universal ($90)
Noctua NH-D15S ($80)
Phanteks TC14 (Removing Front Fan) ($75)
Thermalright Silver Arrow IB-E (Removing Front Fan) ($90)
Thermalright Silver Arrow ITX ($80)
Thermalright True Spirit Power Edition ($55)

So everybody, Final Thoughts?

Im gonna go out on a limb and say that personally, I am most interested in the Thermalright Silver Arrow IB-E, followed by the Cryorig R1 Universal, and finally the Phanteks TC14.

The Silver Arrow has a demanding lead over all other Air Coolers in sheer performance, but removing the front fan will change that a bit I am sure. The Cryorig R1 Universal is the only unit where I can utilize both fans in their intended orientation, but sacrifices performace over the ultimate with its thin fan, isnt a premium, insanely nicely built unit like the Thermalright or the Phanteks, and is not the best performer either but may be due to my tall RAM problem. However, is a front fan necessary when you have 4 x 120mm corsair high airflow fans for the intake of your case alone? Im not sure. Finally, the Phanteks uses the most advanced materials, coatings, and quite the odd radiator fin design, however; Im sure this is even more engineering.

Also, keep in mind my future AM4 Zen build. Who knows, if I get a full-sized dual-tower cooler now, I may be ablue to use the front fan as intended later on.
 
#26 ·
I have used both AIO and air coolers ( AIO was a few years back ) but I would pick air coolers anyday some of the dual tower coolers cool exactly the same as some dual aio ones but the benefit at a much lower noise and the air coolers are cheaper and safe ( water leak, no thanks ).

Regardless of their colors, Noctua have always been a favorite of mine so used a lot of their coolers in various sizes. So my choice would be the Noctua one, but I have read good things about cryorigs coolers
 
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