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POLL: Old Intel Quad core Q9650 system.....so many upgrade options....not sure what to do - Page 3

Poll Results: What should my upgrade path be?

 
  • 14% (2)
    Upgrade just the RAM to 8gb and see what happens ($50-60 option)
  • 21% (3)
    Upgrade the core components (mobo, cpu, RAM, PSU, gpu (maybe) ($1200 option)
  • 64% (9)
    Upgrade everything; sell exisiting system on kijiji, CL, etc and build from scratch ($1600-1800)
14 Total Votes  
post #21 of 35
I say keep the current system and upgrade the ram and gpu (a second user 900er should do till the new acrhitecture come out) then save for the new system.

Myself I had a q6600 before my current rig, and that equalled a low end i3 so I found a qx6800 on ebay and that gave me a tad more oomph
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post #22 of 35
Just a minor thing before I start, in the thread title you say you have a Q9450 but in the sig rig you list a Q9650 at 3.8 Ghz, so, which is it? Or you have two rigs? Can I assume it's just a typo in the title?

Anyway, I can tell you for certain that 4 GB of RAM is slowing you down considerably at this point. A modern web browser with multiple tabs open will eat RAM and forget about alt-tabbing out of games without some major SSD / HDD trashing slowdown. I was already having slowdowns with 4 GB on a Q9550 at 3.4 Ghz system five years ago and the upgrade to 8 GB solved them. 4 GB is also below what many games nowadays require as the minimum.

Even if you decide to move forward with a new rig, getting an extra 4 GB of RAM will always make for a nice secondary rig.

Also, from the games you say you want to play, if it's at 1080p, you may as well give the GTX 1050 Ti a try, even with your current system (plus the extra RAM, of course). At 3.8 Ghz the CPU won't bottleneck it much, but it's probably the last card I'd recommend for that system. One thing is for sure, it will lower the burden on your PSU dramatically and increase performance quite a bit compared to the GTX 480 you currently have. You'll probably save 30w on idle alone, and while gaming expect 120w+ savings. Also, it has hardware support for HEVC 4K video decode.


Going for this cheap 2 component upgrade route will give you some months to wait to see what AMD's Zen has in store and whether it will bring price changes across the board, also for Intel. 6 core CPUs may enter the mainstream next year price-wise, so now is a so-so time to be buying a whole new system.
Edited by tpi2007 - 11/27/16 at 12:05am
 
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post #23 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by umgill45 View Post

salvage my TMJ10 case, PSU (620HX), CPU cooler (NH-D14), SSd (Intel X25m G2), optical drives, hard drives.

Depending on how heavily you've used the system the PSU may be worth swapping, but the rest of this stuff is fine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by umgill45 View Post

will spend more to get future proof as I said I'd like the next one to last atleast around the same as this one did

Highly unlikely you're going to get nine years out of a system unless you don't keep up with new software or are content with a snails pace near the end of that time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by adre View Post

Don't forget that he is planning to use it for about 9 years. So that 5-7% improvement would mean an extra 1 year.

No quad core part is going to be viable for much beyond the most basic uses nine years from now anyway and LGA-1151 isn't going to have anything more, ever.
Quote:
Originally Posted by umgill45 View Post

So lets say I upgrade now. Coffee lake being too far....should I go with 6 cores with an LGA 2011? or LGa 1151 and 4 cores with HT

If you want to keep the system for any length of time and still have an upgrade path in the future, LGA-2011v3. A 6800K will last quite a while, and four or five years from now, when multi-threaded performance is even more important, you can pick up a second hand 10-14 core Xeon at ~3GHz for a hundred bucks to keep the system hanging in there.

Might be worth waiting until January and seeing what Zen can do first.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjee View Post

I think what others are trying to say is that no one knows what the third stage of optimization truly is.
Might be a third unknown we haven't accounted for other than performance gains/ architectural change (as they are the first two stages of CPU development as laid out by intel in march of this year)

The only relevant factor that Kaby Lake could possibly change is clock speed potential, which is not increasing enough to make a real long term difference. It's not like Kaby Lake is an unknown...the mobile parts have been out a month (I had an i5-7200U for a short time and can confirm no IPC change from Skylake).

While I'm not keen on the whole future proofing idea, LGA-1151 in general has no future.
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post #24 of 35
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post

Just a minor thing before I start, in the thread title you say you have a Q9450 but in the sig rig you list a Q9650 at 3.8 Ghz, so, which is it? Or you have two rigs? Can I assume it's just a typo in the title?

Anyway, I can tell you for certain that 4 GB of RAM is slowing you down considerably at this point. A modern web browser with multiple tabs open will eat RAM and forget about alt-tabbing out of games without some major SSD / HDD trashing slowdown. I was already having slowdowns with 4 GB on a Q9550 at 3.4 Ghz system five years ago and the upgrade to 8 GB solved them. 4 GB is also below what many games nowadays require as the minimum.

Even if you decide to move forward with a new rig, getting an extra 4 GB of RAM will always make for a nice secondary rig.

Also, from the games you say you want to play, if it's at 1080p, you may as well give the GTX 1050 Ti a try, even with your current system (plus the extra RAM, of course). At 3.8 Ghz the CPU won't bottleneck it much, but it's probably the last card I'd recommend for that system. One thing is for sure, it will lower the burden on your PSU dramatically and increase performance quite a bit compared to the GTX 480 you currently have. You'll probably save 30w on idle alone, and while gaming expect 120w+ savings. Also, it has hardware support for HEVC 4K video decode.


Going for this cheap 2 component upgrade route will give you some months to wait to see what AMD's Zen has in store and whether it will bring price changes across the board, also for Intel. 6 core CPUs may enter the mainstream next year price-wise, so now is a so-so time to be buying a whole new system.

thanks for the feedback! much appreciated!

The 9450 is a typo (sorry but I couldnt find the option to edit the title -is there one).
I have a Q9650 that came from acherry pciked batch (kinda attached to it now lol).

That being said I have no trouble waiting for the 6 core coffee lake either. The only main issue was the minor freezing in browersers with multiple tabs open.

I can add new ram and as the posters above you mentinoed go for a qx6800 and possibly a 1050ti as you recommended. seems about 2-300$ to wait until 2017 which is totally fine.
post #25 of 35
cool but dont get a qx6800. your q9650 is the better chip.

just the ram and gpu and youll be set for a while
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post #26 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by umgill45 View Post

thanks for the feedback! much appreciated!

The 9450 is a typo (sorry but I couldnt find the option to edit the title -is there one).
I have a Q9650 that came from acherry pciked batch (kinda attached to it now lol).

That being said I have no trouble waiting for the 6 core coffee lake either. The only main issue was the minor freezing in browersers with multiple tabs open.

I can add new ram and as the posters above you mentinoed go for a qx6800 and possibly a 1050ti as you recommended. seems about 2-300$ to wait until 2017 which is totally fine.

You're welcome! thumb.gif

As to editing the thread title, there is an option for that right below the title. It allows you to edit both the post and the thread title. Here is an example:



The Q9650 is a great CPU, I'm assuming it's an E0 revision.

As to going for a QX6800, don't, that is an inferior CPU in every way: it's 65nm Conroe based (vs 45nm Penryn of yours) with 4 MB of L2 per pair of cores (vs 6 MB x 2 in yours) and has a 1066 Mhz base FSB (which bottlenecks it) vs the 1333 Mhz of the Q9650 you have. The QX6850 that they released shortly after is also an inferior CPU compared to yours - still a 65nm CPU, the main difference to the QX6800 being the lower TDP and having a 1333 Mhz FSB). Both the QX6800 and QX6850 use way more power, overclock less, have less L2 cache and don't have SSE 4.1 instructions.

The only CPU upgrade that you could think about is either a QX9650 or a QX9770, but even though they have an unlocked multiplier, they are actually both inferior to yours because Intel never made an E0 revision of them, they are both the older, hotter running C0.

Trust me, if you have the E0 revision you already have the best CPU made for the P45 platform. And you also happen to have the best motherboard.

Doubling the RAM will give you immediate benefits, I was in the same situation with a very similar rig to yours five years ago (I also had a Gigabyte P45 motherboard and also a GTX 480) and the 4 -> 8 GB RAM upgrade made a big difference in multitasking even back then. With 4 GB of RAM when I alt-tabbed out of a game the system would just sit there for a while shifting data from RAM to the HDD before becoming responsive again. After the upgrade it became a smooth transition. Nowadays even for playing games 8 GB is a must. It's the best upgrade you can make right now, followed by the GTX 1050 Ti.
Edited by tpi2007 - 11/27/16 at 11:29am
 
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post #27 of 35
If you like to tinker/overclock and want to get a bit more out of your system try for a X5470 Xeon CPU, you can get your EP45 UD3P to support it and it has a 10x multiplier, pretty cheap on ebay, they run nice and cool when overclocked, so 10x multi with an easily achievable 420 FSB and you have a 4.2ghz quad that will hold it's own for a while. Grab 8GB of 1600mhz ram, run it at 1:1 1680mhz. Grab a second hand GTX970/R9 290x or a new GTX1060/RX 480.

Failing that, wait for ZEN and Kaby Lake, even if you don't like AMD, if ZEN performs well Intel will need to respond, be it lower prices or releasing something early. Also Vega/Volta GPU's should be around soon so it's a good time for some big leaps forward from where you are in terms of CPU, GPU, RAM, HDD, Chipset.

You are still on DDR2, PCI-E 2.0, SATA 2 and a power hungry fire breathing GPU. There are plenty of platform changes that make it worth while upgrading to Kaby Lake or ZEN.

I still have a Q9550 in my media PC, at stock 2.83ghz speed it's getting a bit dated, especially with 4gb of ram. I previously had it at 4.0ghz and with 8GB of ram, it was still quite usable when overclocked compared to my 4670K with 8gb of 2600mhz ram and an SSD.

8gb of ram made a big difference with my Q9550 so it could be a simple performance increase for your day to day use and might be enough to get you by until Kaby/ZEN. FYI, 2 x 4gb sticks would be better than 4 x 2gb sticks. If you want the xeon search ebay for one that's been modded to work in a 775 socket, it needs a sticker applied to the pads on the bottom of the CPU to change the pin out and also they cut the CPU substrate so you can install it in the 775 socket without having to cut your motherboard socket. It seats 90 degrees out from normal because it was made for socket 771. plenty of people doing it so search away. Your 9650 is probably capable of 4.2ghz as well, but it has a 9 x multiplier so you'll need 466 FSB. I was using 471 FSB on my P5Q Deluxe with my Q9550 at 1.365v.
Edited by LiamG6 - 11/27/16 at 1:57am
post #28 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by LiamG6 View Post

If you like to tinker/overclock and want to get a bit more out of your system try for a X5470 Xeon CPU, you can get your EP45 UD3P to support it and it has a 10x multiplier, pretty cheap on ebay, they run nice and cool when overclocked, so 10x multi with an easily achievable 420 FSB and you have a 4.2ghz quad that will hold it's own for a while. Grab 8GB of 1600mhz ram, run it at 1:1 1680mhz. Grab a second hand GTX970/R9 290x or a new GTX1060/RX 480.

Failing that, wait for ZEN and Kaby Lake, even if you don't like AMD, if ZEN performs well Intel will need to respond, be it lower prices or releasing something early. Also Vega/Volta GPU's should be around soon so it's a good time for some big leaps forward from where you are in terms of CPU, GPU, RAM, HDD, Chipset.

You are still on DDR2, PCI-E 2.0, SATA 2 and a power hungry fire breathing GPU. There are plenty of platform changes that make it worth while upgrading to Kaby Lake or ZEN.

I still have a Q9550 in my media PC, at stock 2.83ghz speed it's getting a bit dated, especially with 4gb of ram. I previously had it at 4.0ghz and with 8GB of ram, it was still quite usable when overclocked compared to my 4670K with 8gb of 2600mhz ram and an SSD.

8gb of ram made a big difference with my Q9550 so it could be a simple performance increase for your day to day use and might be enough to get you by until Kaby/ZEN. FYI, 2 x 4gb sticks would be better than 4 x 2gb sticks. If you want the xeon search ebay for one that's been modded to work in a 775 socket, it needs a sticker applied to the pads on the bottom of the CPU to change the pin out and also they cut the CPU substrate so you can install it in the 775 socket without having to cut your motherboard socket. It seats 90 degrees out from normal because it was made for socket 771. plenty of people doing it so search away. Your 9650 is probably capable of 4.2ghz as well, but it has a 9 x multiplier so you'll need 466 FSB. I was using 471 FSB on my P5Q Deluxe with my Q9550 at 1.365v.

Ah, good point about the CPU, I had forgotten about that one. From what I remember he'll need to buy a shim adapter for the CPU to work in the socket, since it's a socket LGA771 CPU that is going into a 775 socket, but other than that it should work.

You got initially mixed up in the RAM though. His board only supports DDR2 (some models did support DDR3, but not his), so his RAM speed choices won't go up to 1600 Mhz, only 1066 Mhz or possibly 1200 Mhz if he can find any.
Edited by tpi2007 - 11/27/16 at 2:14am
 
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post #29 of 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post

Ah, good point about the CPU, I had forgotten about that one. From what I remember he'll need to buy a shim adapter for the CPU to work in the socket, since it's a socket LGA771 CPU that is going into a 775 socket, but other than that it should work.

You got initially mixed up in the RAM though. His board only supports DDR2 (some models did support DDR3, but not his), so his RAM speed choices won't go up to 1600 Mhz, only 1066 Mhz or possibly 1200 Mhz if he can find any.

oh yeah, just realized my ddr2 is 1066mhz not 1600mhz haha. I checked my saved OC bios and I had it at 1:1 and its 2 x FSB = 942mhz. I thought it was 4 x FSB = RAM speed for some reason, been a while haha. So he could get away with DDR2 800mhz ram at 420 x 2 = 840mhz, or try and push it to 4.4ghz and run ram at 880, but might need a set of DDR2 1066.

you can buy xeon's that have been modified to just drop into socket 775 these days. they are modded by chinese ebay sellers as they know they are in demand.
post #30 of 35
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post

You're welcome! thumb.gif

As to editing the thread title, there is an option for that right below the title. It allows you to edit both the post and the thread title. Here is an example:



The Q9650 is a great CPU, I'm assuming it's an E0 revision.

As to going for a QX6800, don't, that is an inferior CPU in every way: it's 65nm Conroe based (vs 45nm Penryn of yours) with 4 MB of L2 per pair of cores (vs 6 MB x 2 in yours) and has a 1066 Mhz base FSB (which bottlenecks it) vs the 1333 Mhz of the Q9650 you have. The QX6850 that they released shortly after is also an inferior CPU comapred to yours - still a 65nm CPU, the main difference to the QX6800 being the lower TDP and having a 1333 Mhz FSB). Both the QX6800 and QX6850 use way more power, overclock less, have less L2 cache and don't have SSE 4.1 instructions.

The only CPU upgrade that you could think about is either a QX9650 or a QX9770, but even though they have an unlocked multiplier, they are actually both inferior to yours because Intel never made an E0 revision of them, they are both the older, hotter running C0.

Trust me, if you have the E0 revision you already have the best CPU made for the P45 platform. And you also happen to have the best motherboard.

Doubling the RAM will give you immediate benefits, I was in the same situation with a very similar rig to yours five years ago (I also had a Gigabyte P45 motherboard and also a GTX 480) and the 4 -> 8 GB RAM upgrade made a big difference in multitasking even back then. With 4 GB of RAM when I alt-tabbed out of a game the system would just sit there for a while shifting data from RAM to the HDD before becoming responsive again. After the upgrade it became a smooth transition. Nowadays even for playing games 8 GB is a must. It's the best upgrade you can make right now, followed by the GTX 1050 Ti.

Thanks for the details! I edited the thread title!

Yes its an E0and it runs with a super nice Vcore that is possibly the reason its survived this long lol. I paid a premium to get it i remember (around the $50-100 mark) so I guess i'll hang on it a bit longer.

Capture.JPG 55k .JPG file but its been showing its age now for sure.

As for the ram Ive been bidding on a identical set to the one isn my signature; hope i win. But looks like DDR 2 ram is not getting any cheaper for sure. It the same here right now once I alt tab its like 3-4 seconds of a black screen and then I see my desktop. first it used to be just like minimizing windows. Thanks for the advise my gf will be happy knowing we can go on a vacation in a few months since I dont need the funds just yet biggrin.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by LiamG6 View Post

If you like to tinker/overclock and want to get a bit more out of your system try for a X5470 Xeon CPU, you can get your EP45 UD3P to support it and it has a 10x multiplier, pretty cheap on ebay, they run nice and cool when overclocked, so 10x multi with an easily achievable 420 FSB and you have a 4.2ghz quad that will hold it's own for a while. Grab 8GB of 1600mhz ram, run it at 1:1 1680mhz. Grab a second hand GTX970/R9 290x or a new GTX1060/RX 480.

Failing that, wait for ZEN and Kaby Lake, even if you don't like AMD, if ZEN performs well Intel will need to respond, be it lower prices or releasing something early. Also Vega/Volta GPU's should be around soon so it's a good time for some big leaps forward from where you are in terms of CPU, GPU, RAM, HDD, Chipset.

You are still on DDR2, PCI-E 2.0, SATA 2 and a power hungry fire breathing GPU. There are plenty of platform changes that make it worth while upgrading to Kaby Lake or ZEN.

I still have a Q9550 in my media PC, at stock 2.83ghz speed it's getting a bit dated, especially with 4gb of ram. I previously had it at 4.0ghz and with 8GB of ram, it was still quite usable when overclocked compared to my 4670K with 8gb of 2600mhz ram and an SSD.

8gb of ram made a big difference with my Q9550 so it could be a simple performance increase for your day to day use and might be enough to get you by until Kaby/ZEN. FYI, 2 x 4gb sticks would be better than 4 x 2gb sticks. If you want the xeon search ebay for one that's been modded to work in a 775 socket, it needs a sticker applied to the pads on the bottom of the CPU to change the pin out and also they cut the CPU substrate so you can install it in the 775 socket without having to cut your motherboard socket. It seats 90 degrees out from normal because it was made for socket 771. plenty of people doing it so search away. Your 9650 is probably capable of 4.2ghz as well, but it has a 9 x multiplier so you'll need 466 FSB. I was using 471 FSB on my P5Q Deluxe with my Q9550 at 1.365v.

Appreciate the insight: I'll keep an out for ZEN and whats coming down the line. Its great to hear that my system can still make it till the new cpus are avaiable. the RAM suggestion really helps me as I thought my system was dying.
I wouldnt have known any better unless I posted here to see what others like you did that have experienced the same issues. (love this forum for this!!)

For the RAM i think I wont be able to get a 4GBx2 config as ebay shows mostly 1 or 2GB sticks.
http://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_odkw=ddr2+8gb&_blrs=spell_check&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR4.TRC1.A0.H0.Xddr2+pc2-8500.TRS0&_nkw=ddr2+pc2-8500&_sacat=0
s it a real dealbreaker if I can only get 4 sticks of 2GB?

Also until a few years ago I was running at 455 FSB with a 9 multiplier but my OC has become unstable over the years redface.gif So ive backed down to 3.8Ghz for now and is P95 stable on small/large/blend for 24 hours. Looking into the 1050/ 1060 right now also!Hopefully the 480 is far behind in perf to give me a nice graphics boost too!

Thanks. smile.gif
Edited by umgill45 - 11/27/16 at 10:56am
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