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Problems replacing a 2TB HDD with a 4TB SSD

2K views 41 replies 9 participants last post by  Lady Fitzgerald 
#1 ·
I'm replacing my HDDs with SSDs. On the first drive I tried to swap out, I tried using Macrium Reflect to clone the 2TB HDD (WD Black) to a Samsung 850 EVO SSD and found out (the hard way) that cloning an MBR drive to a GPT drive will convert the GPT to MBR, which meant half of my new SSD was inaccessible. After converting the SSD back to GPT and reformatting it (quick format), I used FreeFileSync to copy my data on the 2TB HDD to the SSD. However, when I removed the HDD and replaced it with the SSD, then changed the drive letter on the SSD back to the drive letter of the original HDD, after a few minutes, the drive would disappear from Computer and Management. When I rebooted, chkdsk would run, supposedly fixing any problems, then after Win 7 had been running for a few minutes, either the drive would disappear again or Windows Explorer would stop running and the computer would freeze up. This happened several times until I got ticked off enough to swap the original HDD back into the computer. After booting up again and changing the now changed drive letter on the HDD back to original drive letter, everything seems to be working just fine.

What the big fat hairy heck went wrong? Is the problem related to the switch from MBR to GPT? Was a folder/file syncing (FreeFileSync) the wrong program to use? Did I mess up the SDD beyond repair? I've got a small fortune invested in this change-out and I can't get past the first drive.
 
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#3 ·
This doesn't involve the OS (btw, I have successfully cloned OS drives from HDD to SSD but they were both MBR drives each time). There is only data on the drive.
 
#5 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcEsSalvation View Post

To me it sounds like something still didn't copy quite right. But even reading about issues like this frustrates me from how much time I've blown to doing things like this.
Supposedly, everything should have copied over just fine since FreeFileSync verified each file copied over correctly.
 
#6 ·
If you were transferring the OS I'd tell you just to clone the drive then make a second partition on any remaining space, but if this isn't even being used for booting, why can't you just manually partition the drive then copy files over?

Anyway, not sure why the drive is disappearing, but I would zero write the whole thing...could be an issue with TRIM of garbage collection being confused somehow and if wiping it the hard way doesn't fix things then you can probably rule it defective and get a replacement.
 
#7 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post

If you were transferring the OS I'd tell you just to clone the drive then make a second partition on any remaining space, but if this isn't even being used for booting, why can't you just manually partition the drive then copy files over?

Anyway, not sure why the drive is disappearing, but I would zero write the whole thing...could be an issue with TRIM of garbage collection being confused somehow and if wiping it the hard way doesn't fix things then you can probably rule it defective and get a replacement.
With SSDs, you don't zero write to wipe them; that runs up the write count too much, unnecessarily shortening the write life of the SSD. Instead, you are supposed use Secure Erase with the software that comes with the SSD or use Parted magic to Secure Erase it (Secure Erase essentially resets the SSD without writing over anything).

When I tried to clone to the dang thing, it changed from GPT to MBR and I could not access the unallocated part of the drive. That's why I had to convert the thing back to GPT, reformat, then use FreeFileSync to copy the files over.

Since I swapped the HDD back into the computer, I tired updating Samsung Magician to the latest version but it wouldn't even see the SSD when it was plugged into the hot swap bay (Magician saw my boot SSD, though, a Samsung 840 Pro). I pulled the SSD from the hot swap bay and used a cable to connect it to a USB 3.0 port. The computer popped up a window say the disk had some errors so I let it automatically fix the errors. This a screen shot of the report after it finished (supposedly) fixing the errors:



It's curious that this window never came up before. Of course, it's all Greek (or Sanskrit) to me. Hopefully, someone here can translate this.

After the latest "fix", Magician is finally able to see the new SSD when in the hot swap bay.

It's too late for me to horse around with trying the swap again. My frustration levels are already boiling way too high right now and I need to simmer down a bit overnight.
 
#8 ·
Looks like something broke the indexing metadata when you copied the files over and then chkdsk finished the job by attempting to fix things (it likes to delete important MFT contents and call it a "fix"). I hate NTFS; half the problems that make journaling file systems prudent to use cause NTFS to shaft itself anyway. Most of my storage drives are formatted with exFAT at this point.

I'd fully wipe the drive, manually partition and format it, then make sure it works. After that copy all of your stuff over with robocopy and, if you're using NTFS on the new drive, omit any junk attributes/security properties that might cause issues.

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc733145(v=ws.11).aspx

If you just use the D and T flags (for the "/copy:" part), you keep only the critical stuff (the files and their time stamps), while dumping any indexing, security/permission, or attribute info. Shouldn't cause problems to do this unless you have encrypted files or don't want to lose the hidden attribute. You can reindex things later, if you want.
 
#9 ·
@Sean Webster @Lord Xeb Care to jump in here?
 
#10 ·
I couldn't sleep so I decided to try using FreeFileSync again to make sure I hasn't lost any files and got this error message right at the beginning.

 
#12 ·
why not just use free file sync to mirror over all the files?
 
#13 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

I've don't GPT to MBR cloning and vise Versa with acronis true image no problem. I have some keys for you if you need and want to give it a try
I assume by "don't" you meant "done" (typos happen; no worries).
wink.gif


Thanks, Sean! I finally broke down and used Samsung Magician to Secure Erase the borked SSD. I'm guessing I screwed up something with my idiotic attempt to "fix" it with Mini Tool Partition Wizard Free. I had never had a reason to use Secure erase before and I was impressed with how fast it worked and that it took the SSD back to uninitialized. After that, I created a new New Volume as GPT and I have FreeFileSync running right now (it has 960GB of 1.3TB left to go so it will be quite a while before it is finished, especially since it is set to verify each file as it is copied over). If this try goes south, I'll talk to you about those keys.
 
#14 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

why not just use free file sync to mirror over all the files?
That was what I did after I had converted it back to GPT but then the SSD kept disappearing when I did the swap. When I tired to synchronize again, FFS would stop with the error I posted earlier. I'm trying it again after I took the SSD back to square one with Secure Erase; right now, I'm in hurry up and wait mode (it takes time to move 1.3TB off a spinner, even a WD Black).
 
#15 ·
Well, I'm mad enough to chew nails (big ones) and spit out thumb tacks (and sink them into old oak)! Everything seemed to go fine until I swapped the SSD out with the E: drive and tried to change the drive letter of the SSD to E:. I couldn't even do it from within Drive Management; I had to use Mini Tool Partition Wizard to change the drive letter. Then I started getting the same old nonsense again! I couldn't even get Win 7 to boot until I disconnected the SSD, booted, then reconnected. I was able to reboot after that but still kept getting errors. I tried chkdsk and it just froze on me. I tried Secure Erasing again and it kept failing. I ripped the stupid SSD out the computer and put it into the hot swap bay and was finally able to secure erase it.

This time around, I left out the E: drive, then initialized and formatted directly to E:. Now, I'm trying to use FreeFileSync to copy from the one of the E: Drive backup drives (which is G:), which is in the 3.5" hot swap bay, directly to the E: SSD, which is in the 2.5" hot swap bay. If this doesn't work, I'm going to try another SSD on the odd chance the problem is the SSD itself. If that doesn't work...
 
#16 ·
you can convert MBR to GPT and such with out formatting. I believe I used AOMEI Partition Assistant Pro to convert all my MBR disks over to GPT when i moved them to my new rig. However there is probably other programs that might be free.
 
#17 ·
I think I may have finally found the problem. My E: HDD is a 2TB drive. The SSD is 4TB. The HDD was connected to one of the Marvel ports on my MOBO (when I built the machine, I used one of the Marvel ports for my main data drive in case I wanted to cache the drive with an SSD in the other Marvel port but the HDD was plenty fast for me so I never did cache it). Well, after repeated failures trying to get my data onto the 4TB SSD without errors, then having the SSD drop out when I swapped it out with the HDD, I disconnected the E: drive, put one of its backup drives in the 3.5" hot swap bay and the SSD in the 2.5" hot swap bay and used FreeFileSync to copy over the data. I also had formatted the SSD as E: since I had problems changing the drive letter before. The transfer took several hours but, once finished, I pulled the HDD out of the hot swap bay, then rebooted with the SSD still in its hot swap bay. Everything seemed to work just fine, so I relocated the SSD to the E: drive's slot. Again, everything seemed fine when I booted up.

I started to do a restore my C: drive to the previous image since the profile for my keyboard was gone and I probably had other problems after several cold reboots when my computer or a window would freeze up, but I decided to be cautious and verify the image to make sure it didn't get damaged from all the problems I had been having. At 2% verification, the E: drive went AWOL. The same thing happened again after another reboot (mutter, mutter, mumble, mumble).

At that point, since the SSD seemed to work just fine in the hot swap bay, I pulled it from the E: slot and put it in another slot that is running off my HBA card (I already have a 4TB HDD running off the HBA card without any problems), then rebooted again. Everything seemed to be working just fine so I tried verifying the image again and, this time, the image verified. I still need to restore to that image but I'm going to wait a day or so first to make sure the SSD doesn't misbehave.

Apparently, the problem was with the not so marvelous Marvel port or its cable. Since I have an extended ATX MOBO crammed into a small ATX case, the cabling is rather crowded so I'm not going to worry about trying to see if the cable was at fault. Frankly, I don't give the north end of a southbound furry little rodent since this entire machine will be getting replaced once I finish building the case for my new machine.

Besides all the time I wasted on this stupid fiasco, what bites my ample asset is I put 5.35TB of writes on the SSD just to get 1.32TB to "stick". I know, I'm not likely to use up the rest of the 150TB of allowable writes under the warranty in the next five years but it still galls me to no end.

I was up much of the night putzing around with this mess (politer terminology than what I had been using) so I'm putting my ample asset to bed before too much longer. If the SSD is still behaving after I return to the land of the living, I'm going to start populating my four E: drive backup SSDs.
 
#18 ·
Update. It's been almost two hours now and the SSD hasn't gone south or AWOL yet so I'm heading to bed while I'm awake enough to find it. Thanks to everyone who chimed in here!
 
#19 ·
After having no trouble populating the four backup SSDs, I was transferring data from the F: HDD to the F: SSD when the miserable, misbegotten E: drive dropped out again! Samsung Magician and Speccy can see the drive but Disk Management can't. What the heck?! I pulled the SSDs and replaced the HDDs for now until I can figure out what the bloody heck is going on!
 
#20 ·
I skimmed most of thread and just going to randomly spit out some stuff that may or may not help.

Personally. The way I would do is put both drives in the system. boot from a linux usb drive. any flavor is fine. use the command line (dont be scared) and use a program called dd to clone the drive. You are going from a smaller drive to a larger drive so no issues there. Once the clone is complete remove the old drive from the system. Then using some info posted above about converting to gpt setup. after that just use a partition manager to increase the partitions or create new ones.

Once that is completed when you boot back up in windows since you made a byte for byte clone the disk will still have the same uuid and should take the same drive letter and everything as the original.
 
#21 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trippen Out View Post

I skimmed most of thread and just going to randomly spit out some stuff that may or may not help.

Personally. The way I would do is put both drives in the system. boot from a linux usb drive. any flavor is fine. use the command line (dont be scared) and use a program called dd to clone the drive. You are going from a smaller drive to a larger drive so no issues there. Once the clone is complete remove the old drive from the system. Then using some info posted above about converting to gpt setup. after that just use a partition manager to increase the partitions or create new ones.

Once that is completed when you boot back up in windows since you made a byte for byte clone the disk will still have the same uuid and should take the same drive letter and everything as the original.
Thanks! However, since I'm copying from an MBR to a GPT disk, won't that convert the GPT to MBR, same as the first time when I tried to clone the disk.
 
#22 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Fitzgerald View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trippen Out View Post

I skimmed most of thread and just going to randomly spit out some stuff that may or may not help.

Personally. The way I would do is put both drives in the system. boot from a linux usb drive. any flavor is fine. use the command line (dont be scared) and use a program called dd to clone the drive. You are going from a smaller drive to a larger drive so no issues there. Once the clone is complete remove the old drive from the system. Then using some info posted above about converting to gpt setup. after that just use a partition manager to increase the partitions or create new ones.

Once that is completed when you boot back up in windows since you made a byte for byte clone the disk will still have the same uuid and should take the same drive letter and everything as the original.
Thanks! However, since I'm copying from an MBR to a GPT disk, won't that convert the GPT to MBR, same as the first time when I tried to clone the disk.
Yes. It will be a 100 percent exact copy of the drive. After you clone it. Then you convert it from mbr to gpt after you are finished.

http://www.thewindowsclub.com/convert-mbr-to-gpt-disk
 
#23 ·
If that's a Samsung 850 Evo you have there, it's certified for 300 TB of writes per week for 5 years. Don't worry, you haven't degraded its life at all.
 
#24 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trippen Out View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Fitzgerald View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trippen Out View Post

I skimmed most of thread and just going to randomly spit out some stuff that may or may not help.

Personally. The way I would do is put both drives in the system. boot from a linux usb drive. any flavor is fine. use the command line (dont be scared) and use a program called dd to clone the drive. You are going from a smaller drive to a larger drive so no issues there. Once the clone is complete remove the old drive from the system. Then using some info posted above about converting to gpt setup. after that just use a partition manager to increase the partitions or create new ones.

Once that is completed when you boot back up in windows since you made a byte for byte clone the disk will still have the same uuid and should take the same drive letter and everything as the original.
Thanks! However, since I'm copying from an MBR to a GPT disk, won't that convert the GPT to MBR, same as the first time when I tried to clone the disk.
Yes. It will be a 100 percent exact copy of the drive. After you clone it. Then you convert it from mbr to gpt after you are finished.

http://www.thewindowsclub.com/convert-mbr-to-gpt-disk
Unfortunately, my problems started after converting the MBR clone to GPT so I'm a wee bit leery of that method. Right now, I'm suspecting the drive itself may be bad since I haven't had any problems with the other SSDs I got so far, especially since the problem SSD is from a different batch than the other otherwise identical SSDs I have worked with so far. To test that theory, I'm currently using FreeFileSync to copy the E: HDD to another SSD that I won't be needing for a while, giving me plenty of time to get a replacement for the problem SSD if it turns out it actually is the culprit.
 
#25 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post

If that's a Samsung 850 Evo you have there, it's certified for 300 TB of writes per week for 5 years. Don't worry, you haven't degraded its life at all.
It is a Samsung 850 EVO (4TB) warrantied for only 150TB for five years, which is only about 576GB per week. Although it's highly unlike I'll ever write that much to it, it still galls me to waste any of the write life (also keep in mind that is only the amount of warrantied write life; it could fail sooner or last longer than that).
 
#26 ·
From samsung:

Warranty
Product
5 Years Limited Warranty or 300TBW Limited Warranty
 
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