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[PCGamesN] You can't play Onward if you are under 5'6", as dev struggles to bring VR shooting to all.

5K views 67 replies 42 participants last post by  ChronoBodi 
#1 ·
Quote:
Onward, an Arma-like squad shooter made for VR and currently in early access, has a minimum height requirement of 5'6", excluding 13% of American men and 78% of American women. However, head height can be a problem in many VR experiences, and solving it is far from trivial.
source

Welllllll.... lol to that actually.
 
#7 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by EniGma1987 View Post

The only thing I can think of is so the gun is positioned at the right height. But that seems extremely easy to solve IMO. Have a menu line to set your height and based on that apply an offset to model position. Done.
Exactly right from the user point of view.

from the actual game coding side, it takes a little bit more work, but is not as hard as giving it up completely as they are doing now, that is just plain laziness.

the Dev just don't want to have to recalculate all the FOV pattern for all the objects in game.
 
#8 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by starliner View Post

Um, what? Why does the avatar in the game have to be the same height as the player?
I can think of a lot of ways it can be an issue. Like effecting the range of motion. The distance a head travels when squatting is very different for a person 5'2" vs 6'. And you can only build so much tolerance in before running into issues. Changing camera position and/or model dimensions adds it's own problems. All things unique to VR compared to normal gaming.
 
#10 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prophet4NO1 View Post

I can think of a lot of ways it can be an issue. Like effecting the range of motion. The distance a head travels when squatting is very different for a person 5'2" vs 6'. And you can only build so much tolerance in before running into issues. Changing camera position and/or model dimensions adds it's own problems. All things unique to VR compared to normal gaming.
all they need is a good sub routine that takes care of the calculations from different FOV, then have the game automatically translate all the shifted dimensions based on the player height.

The Devs are just trying to push the game out the door quickly, they don't want to waste time creating a sub-routine to do the calculation as it might be a lot of work without much return if the game flops.

every new VR Devs is trying to capitalize on being the first out there with a catchy title, and then hopefully generate enough revenue to work in something more serious and detailed.
 
#11 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllGamer View Post

all they need is a good sub routine that takes care of the calculations from different FOV, then have the game automatically translate all the shifted dimensions based on the player height.

The Devs are just trying to push the game out the door quickly, they don't want to waste time creating a sub-routine to do the calculation as it might be a lot of work without much return if the game flops.

every new VR Devs is trying to capitalize on being the first out there with a catchy title, and then hopefully generate enough revenue to work in something more serious and detailed.
Even if the issue does get fixed (the devs have acknowledged it) there's also very weak demand to consider.
 
#12 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllGamer View Post

all they need is a good sub routine that takes care of the calculations from different FOV, then have the game automatically translate all the shifted dimensions based on the player height.

The Devs are just trying to push the game out the door quickly, they don't want to waste time creating a sub-routine to do the calculation as it might be a lot of work without much return if the game flops.

every new VR Devs is trying to capitalize on being the first out there with a catchy title, and then hopefully generate enough revenue to work in something more serious and detailed.
The Onward dev is actually only one guy. He dropped out of college and used every penny he had towards the game. Pretty awesome story actually. https://www.google.com/amp/uploadvr.com/onward-college-dropout-vr-shooter/amp/ But yes it still seems he has some learning to do.
 
#14 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swolern View Post

Everyone knew VR was going to be a slow start. Your just pointing out the obvious.
Its been well over a year. Where's the must have content?

VR has become a trainwreck of fragmentation; different specs, different features, different challenges of setting up a room at home. Not to forget artificial incompatibilities for the sake of sales platforms, instead of generalized drivers. On top of that, there is the highly questionable quality of the 'games' themselves.

...I'll see myself out.
 
#16 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

Its been well over a year. Where's the must have content?
very very few so far, most of what is available right now, nothing AAA, all are more geared towards "Learning" for school type of stuff.

very much the same way when CD ROM started, all mostly school related stuff, nothing serious until a couple of generation later.

so, we're seeing the same phase again, only this time is with the VR adaptation.

all we'll see in the next couple of years will be mostly interesting stuff to give people an idea of what it can do.

but it will be up to serious developers to put some real money into it.

The closest to AAA game you can count for VR is Elite Dangerous, and maybe the EVE VR thing, everything else is very meh...

for non game stuff, there a lot of interesting Virtual Touristic destination like the Mount Everest, and other stuff you see featured often
 
#17 ·
As someone who is Male and 5'3( I have a light case of Noonan Syndrome ), this actually made me laugh. I am used to being denied access to roller coasters when I was younger, but now not being able to play certain games is a new one for me.
biggrin.gif
I have no issues with this though it is one guy making a game so you can't expect it to be perfect. It would be different if this was from some AAA dev studio. I wish him all the best. I might need to go invest in some shoe lifts though.
tongue.gif
 
#18 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToTheSun! View Post

This is very Darwinistic. Short people will not be able to play, so they'll be depressed. That will lower their rate of procreation, creating a bias for taller people.

Makes sense to me. All for the betterment of Mankind.
Other way round - tall people will be stuck in games, whereas short people will go out and procreate.

Tall people have had their time, now for the rise of the short people.

Or something.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

Back on topic: VR sales have stagnated after first adopter sales dried up. Height restrictions for certain games won't help this situation.
http://www.roadtovr.com/what-vr-headset-makers-not-analysts-have-actually-said-about-sales-expectations/

Good read here about why that bit of disinformation is doing the rounds.

Essentially SuperData, a games industry statistics company, vastly overestimated sales of the PSVR headset. They then revised their estimate down and claimed it was the market's fault, not their own fault for completely screwing up the estimate.

In turn this lead to a lot of news outlets claiming that VR wasn't selling. This was also compounded by a Chinese website giving a number of 140,000 Vive units sold, which was also a huge underestimate of the number sold (the original article even states that this number was an underestimate).

So how are sales actually going? No one really knows for sure. But the main companies in the VR device market seem quite happy, if that is any indication.
 
#19 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by GingerJohn View Post

Other way round - tall people will be stuck in games, whereas short people will go out and procreate.

Tall people have had their time, now for the rise of the short people.

Or something.
http://www.roadtovr.com/what-vr-headset-makers-not-analysts-have-actually-said-about-sales-expectations/

Good read here about why that bit of disinformation is doing the rounds.

Essentially SuperData, a games industry statistics company, vastly overestimated sales of the PSVR headset. They then revised their estimate down and claimed it was the market's fault, not their own fault for completely screwing up the estimate.

In turn this lead to a lot of news outlets claiming that VR wasn't selling. This was also compounded by a Chinese website giving a number of 140,000 units sold, which was also a huge underestimate of the number sold (the original article even states that this number was an underestimate).

So how are sales actually going? No one really knows for sure. But the main companies in the VR device market seem quite happy, if that is any indication.
The last thing this industry needs is news of another complication, even if it is getting fixed.
 
#20 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

Its been well over a year. Where's the must have content?

VR has become a trainwreck of fragmentation; different specs, different features, different challenges of setting up a room at home. Not to forget artificial incompatibilities for the sake of sales platforms, instead of generalized drivers. On top of that, there is the highly questionable quality of the 'games' themselves.

...I'll see myself out.
Even if the hardware was fully capable, I can't see how it will work out. Running around in a virtual world while twisting ankles and bashing shins in the real world.
 
#21 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by essanbee View Post

Even if the hardware was fully capable, I can't see how it will work out. Running around in a virtual world while twisting ankles and bashing shins in the real world.
just dedicate a room in your house just for VR.

have every wall and floor padded, so you can tumble and roll without hurting yourself.... except for crushing the Oculus / Vive headset
tongue.gif
 
#23 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

The last thing this industry needs is news of another complication, even if it is getting fixed.
The last thing the industry needs is people with an obvious axe to grind trying to find and exaggerate every tiny problem they can.

Quote:
Originally Posted by essanbee View Post

Even if the hardware was fully capable, I can't see how it will work out. Running around in a virtual world while twisting ankles and bashing shins in the real world.
The Vive has a VR Chaperone feature, which displays the real word in the headset when you get close to the edges of your pre-defined play area. I'm not sure how Oculus intends to solve this problem though.
 
#24 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by starliner View Post

Um, what? Why does the avatar in the game have to be the same height as the player?
More like, why can't the game adjust model height and view port to player height?

If they are worried about short/small models having an advantage (smaller profile) then they could calibrate stride length/speed to height.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prophet4NO1 View Post

I can think of a lot of ways it can be an issue. Like effecting the range of motion. The distance a head travels when squatting is very different for a person 5'2" vs 6'. And you can only build so much tolerance in before running into issues. Changing camera position and/or model dimensions adds it's own problems. All things unique to VR compared to normal gaming.
This is a VR game that should be taking these things into account from the beginning.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lombardsoup View Post

Its been well over a year.
It's been more than twenty years since affordable personal stereoscopic 3D headsets have been available.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swolern View Post

The Onward dev is actually only one guy. He dropped out of college and used every penny he had towards the game. Pretty awesome story actually. https://www.google.com/amp/uploadvr.com/onward-college-dropout-vr-shooter/amp/ But yes it still seems he has some learning to do.
Well, I guess that explains it.
 
#26 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by di inferi View Post

There is a minimum height for US military... may not be 5' 6"... but you know lol.

Guess I find it amusing since I am tall lol.
Min height for the US army is 4'8
 
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