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post #91 of 1391
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defoler View Post

And yet it looks like the 6700K will give you the same thing, with just higher FPS on games. If you are willing to pay in FPS to save a few seconds of video editing and encoding, that is your call.
If you mainly game, what will be the point?

 

Not necessarily. The 6900k / Zen both have demonstrable superior streaming performance at higher settings.. even my 3930k handles certain streaming loads better than the 6700k that I had. As to editing and encoding, again that depends on workloads and job size.. some tasks scale very well with additional cores/threads, more than a 'few seconds' worth. If the Zen clocks well enough and the gaming performance is within 10-15% of a 6700k, then yes, my call would be to take more cores and threads. I think you're being too binary in your assessment.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by teh-yeti View Post


Considering how the FX line up did actually include a quad core variant, is it too outlandish to believe that they could include 4c/8t zen chips with the very similar IPC, higher clocks, and an even lower price than the hexacores? Were this the case, is it possible for us to see such a part priced similarly to mid tier i5's (~$200) that boasts all of the multi threading benefits of an i7? Though I may be getting my hopes up too high, my real hope for zen is that it drastically raises the bar for the mid-end markets and makes a compelling alternative to the i3 line.

Seriously, someone please answer me. I'm new here and have been wondering about this.
 
I would think that it's very likely. 

Edited by SuperZan - 12/23/16 at 10:43am
     
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post #92 of 1391
I made a translation using tpi2007-rusty-French-super-translate-algorithm for those interested:
Quote:
Computing performance

H.264 1080p & H.265 4K encoding, WPrime, PovRay 3.7, Blender 3D, 3DSMax 2015 / Mental Ray, Corona Benchmark

With its eight real cores, Zen achieves some prowess despite the limited 3.3 Ghz frequency. It even gets dangerously close - for Intel - to the Core i7-6900K, offering performance comparable to that of the i7-5960X at the same frequency (3.3 Ghz Tubo mode). The allegations made by AMD a few months ago seem to be true in practice and that's excellent news. Compared to the FX-8370, we noted a performance gain of around 35% at the same clocks, in line with AMD's predictions (40%).

(Note from me: concerning the last sentence, that's actually not what AMD said, they said 40% more IPC compared to Excavator. Here they are comparing it against a Piledriver CPU, which is two revisions prior. In any case, more IPC and more performance don't have to necessarily 100% match.)


Gaming Performance

Far Cry 4, GRID: Autosport, Battlefield 4, Arma III, X3: TC, The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt, Anno 2070

If the results may seem disappointing in face of the average of the games tested, it should be kept in mind that the prototype tested is an eight core with an especially low base frequency (in particular Turbo mode). Now, games are still very sensitive to clockspeeds and have a hard time benefiting from more than 4 cores. It's thus difficult in these conditions to compare it against an i7-6700K, where the clocks surpass 4 Ghz. Notwithstanding, the Zen architecture proves itself to an effectiveness degree that we haven't seen from AMD in a long time.


Power consumption

Measured at full load (in watts)

The power consumption measurement of the Zen CPU was made with a current clamp at the ATX 12V connector at full load. While true that it's less precise than the ones we usually make with an oscilloscope, it gives a good idea of the performance of Global Foundries' 14nm LPP process. Once we remove the parts related to the motherboard's VRMs, we estimate that the CPU uses a little less than 90w, a number very close to that of a 6900K. A result that is a good indication for what comes next.



The Zen architecture should allow AMD to make a serious comeback in the CPU market, including the high-end segment that they abandoned for a long time. Intel risks a setback, which is a well deserved consequence of years of laxity and arrogance (the Core i7-6950X at 1900 euros is the perfect illustration). Do we expect a return of true competition in the CPU market? Not everything is yet won by AMD. While it does seem that the eight core CPUs are on the right track, the CPU maker must rapidly finalize the four core derivatives with noticeably higher clockspeeds than current prototypes: 3.8, looking into 4 or 4.2 Ghz seem to us the minimum to tickle the latest Kaby Lake CPUs. At last, there is still one unknown: the pricing. While certain rumours talk about a rather low price list, we doubt that AMD will sell them at sales prices now that it at last has an opportunity to recover from its years of losses. Above all, it shouldn't crap itself on the final straight...


Edited by tpi2007 - 12/23/16 at 3:38pm
 
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post #93 of 1391
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRobot23 View Post

Does this mean that ZEN is close? I mean - January 1/2 2017

Dr. Su said Zen would be Q1 2017, likely looking at February or March, but we could be blown away with a January release.
    
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post #94 of 1391
I'm expecting the 8 core Zen to be priced at least $400 possibly higher. If we're lucky there might be a $300-350 SKU.
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post #95 of 1391
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defoler View Post

While true, if you are buying a CPU which gives you a small edge in 2-3 games, but gives the opposite in every other game, what real choice do you have? Pay for an overall less performing package just because?
Also we have seen that a game using DX12 or vulkan, it doesn't necessarily impact on CPU choice, so I wouldn't go that far.

Doom vulkan reviews showed that the game engine doesn't really utilise higher cpu core count.
You expect game engine developers to really develop for multi CPU core, but so far, they have moved very little to that direction.
And yet it looks like the 6700K will give you the same thing, with just higher FPS on games. If you are willing to pay in FPS to save a few seconds of video editing and encoding, that is your call.
If you mainly game, what will be the point?

Well, you are basing that on the premise that there will be only 2-3 games that will be well threaded in the future while all others will be lightly threaded and coded for outdated APIs. I think that is a faulty assumption given that it was announced not long ago that there are at least 15 DX12 games in development for a 2017 release. Also likely to be more Vulkan titles announced and released. I think it's safe to assume that DX12 and Vulkan are the APIs being used for most games being released currently and in development for the future. They'll probably also be developed for the new APIs from the ground up as opposed to most titles today that are only patched to run a DX12 or Vulkan code path.
post #96 of 1391
I'm wondering where they got the 35% performance increase from. In compute Zen has at least 88% higher performance perf clock with SMT, in games it's 55%, and I'm pretty sure none of the games they tested even used SMT on an octacore.
post #97 of 1391
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vesku View Post

I'm expecting the 8 core Zen to be priced at least $400 possibly higher. If we're lucky there might be a $300-350 SKU.

Though I've heard this thrown around the rumor mill, I still find it incredibly unlikely. It makes no sense to price something in a bracket with products it isn't competing against. I even suspect that $500 is a little too low, and would be more optimistic of $600-$700. The reason being that if you price a product close to another, such as the 6700K, it will be compared to that product. As has been pointed out, there are different applications for Ryzen and the intel mainstream.

I am, however, open to different opinions and VERY open to an ultra cheap (relatively speaking) octacore chip, so long as we, and the market as a whole, keep in mind that this chip is not necessarily designed just for gaming.
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post #98 of 1391
The more info and leak details that come out, the more SR5 6/12 looks better and better. Now we just need the prices...

AMD has already stated they are out of the Dual core market, and that all CPUs will have SMT enabled. With the Zen CPUs all coming from the same die, IPC will be the same and you just need to choose a chip based in your price range and core/clock needs. Need high clocks for gaming go 4/8 need more power for multitasking get the 8/16, want a mid range chip with lots of thread and can hit ~4.2ghz(guessing) get the 6/12.
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post #99 of 1391
35% performance increase at same clock ?! And Ryzen have lower clock speed than piledriver so that gap won't be big if this is true
post #100 of 1391
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePath View Post

35% performance increase at same clock ?! And Ryzen have lower clock speed than piledriver so that gap won't be big if this is true

Well it's 8 cores with simultaneous multithreading, so in well threaded programs you'll see a decent improvement.
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