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VRM on the new AM4 motherboards - Page 132

post #1311 of 2036
Quote:
Originally Posted by chew* View Post

So your dud chip that sucked in titanium sucked in gigabyte...what a surprise.

I go by facts.

Facts prime is easy to cheat...suspect highly when not cascaded to show iterations and amount of work done...suspect 2 version not visible.
Suspect 3 low ram usage.


That just covers how you run and display your "prime"

All top tier boards have done 3200 np the way i test with multiple chips. Its expected its not a miracle...

The issue is not till you go mainstream and lower that 3200 real stable is a problem.

You happen to dodge quite a bit.

I show 3680 on k7...no comment.

Fan on back of mobo open case no comment. Might want to go edit that post now that i brought that up..

Binned to win no comment..

Change subject alot though..

Still on ancient microcode? News flash it clocks 100 mhz higher...eventually going to lose that..

Roll that beautiful bean err i mean vrm temp screen again...

I believe straight up guys with bad and good to say...

With the current breed...you would be a great reviewer though...

Everything perfect nothing to see here 10/10

I run prime at it's default settings as it is easy for others to compare to in that event. I arrange the prime workers window in a manner that allows as much pertinent information from HWINFO to be seen as possible and still allow others to see the workers have or have not failed.

Unlike some fellows I always post proof of what I've done and would never try to hide anything or trick anyone intentionally. I do make mistakes from time to time and if I realize it I'll post corrections.

I've posted several times that I have my Titanium on a P 5 ( check sig ) with fans blowing on the VRMS but not on the back side of socket. I do not and will not make any effort to conceal facts. Anyone wishing to compare vrm temps is welcome to do the same.

As for the 3680 mhz on the ram, that probably has as much to do with your abilities as the board - there are many thousands of users with my level of ram overclocking talent/experience , very few with yours.

One board, one set of ram, one cpu 15 minutes invested 4 ghz , 3200mhz cl14 1T. That's the reality.





No and I am aware that it is harder to run prime on the new micro-code
Edited by cssorkinman - 5/1/17 at 10:36am
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post #1312 of 2036
I was not saying that u cheat prime but it can be...and the way you display it...does not help in the event it became questionable. Hw info is ehh. Software lol.

Im also aware that you run it the easy way which is why i mentioned it...so for perspective for the rest...4150 on old microcode the easy way....far more realistic now smile.gif

My abilities derive more from ability to diagnose symptoms/bugs...


Giga reboot loops 5 times. There are5 timings...its a ryzen thing. 1 per timing. wink.gif

Most hit reset by second loop and miss the cool stuff that comes after grabbing a snickers bar and waiting.
post #1313 of 2036
Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post


That you will accept any information that appears to put the Titanium in a poor light and refuse anything that shows it to be equal or superior.


Titanium could - K7 could not.... simple as that.

 

I what?

 

Might want to double check who you're quoting before putting words in my mouth.

   
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post #1314 of 2036
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

That's the opposite way of how a conversation works.

Whatever an individual claims is meant to be supported by facts, or when said facts are unavailable, at least some observations of the material in question.

When resorting to unsupported claims, name-calling, smearing, putdowns, personal attacks and the likes then you do not have a conversation. Best case scenario is that you have a childish argument in the form of "mine is bigger than yours", worst case is that you have someone trolling just to get reactions.

So, lets stick to facts and get the conversation going instead of using empty claims and phrases like "nikos fets are reaching 100 trillion celsius temperature, they melt everything they touch, make a hole on the ground, fall until they reach the center of the earth and as a result make the earth explode and get us all killed" or "some guy I know had an msi board with nikos fets and it gave him HIV".

It's not a matter of liking what you read or not. If you claim something, prove it and stop wasting everyone else's time.


That's a conversation, prove me wrong but also let me try to help you with that...

There you have the datasheets. No absolute maximums, please.wackosmiley.gifthumb.gif

Nikos MSI fets
http://www.niko-sem.com/in/front/bin/home.phtml
http://products.niko-sem.com/images/product/148231008405971632.pdf
http://www.unikc.com.cn/UploadFile/products/2015710171838-PK616BA_REV1.0_20140220.pdf



Now, the TI fets used with the Taichi, Crosshair and even on the Prime.
http://www.ti.com/product/CSD87350Q5D/technicaldocuments
http://www.ti.com/general/docs/lit/getliterature.tsp?genericPartNumber=csd87350q5d&fileType=pdf


Figures, It is not a matter of me liking or not MSI/Nikos, it's just what the MSI X370 Titanium has to offer at $300 cost/benefit wise, it is how these fets are crap and cheap in their own datasheet.

Would I recommend anybody to build their $ 1000+ worth of hardware over that thing ? Hell NO

Would I buy and recommend the MSI X370 Titanium if it was anything like the Z270 Titanium quality wise ? Hell yeah.
post #1315 of 2036
Quote:
Originally Posted by yendor View Post

It works. even overclocked. Could debate about efficiency of JUST the mosfets til the cows come home, I will smile.gif, but it undeniably works, at load, with room to run hotter. Less expensive components and all.

As any B350 works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by virpz View Post

That's a conversation, prove me wrong but also let me try to help you with that...

There you have the datasheets. No absolute maximums, please.wackosmiley.gifthumb.gif

Nikos MSI fets
http://www.niko-sem.com/in/front/bin/home.phtml
http://products.niko-sem.com/images/product/148231008405971632.pdf
http://www.unikc.com.cn/UploadFile/products/2015710171838-PK616BA_REV1.0_20140220.pdf



Now, the TI fets used with the Taichi, Crosshair and even on the Prime.
http://www.ti.com/product/CSD87350Q5D/technicaldocuments
http://www.ti.com/general/docs/lit/getliterature.tsp?genericPartNumber=csd87350q5d&fileType=pdf


Figures, It is not a matter of me liking or not MSI/Nikos, it's just what the MSI X370 Titanium has to offer at $300 cost/benefit wise, it is how these fets are crap and cheap in their own datasheet.

Would I recommend anybody to build their $ 1000+ worth of hardware over that thing ? Hell NO

Would I buy and recommend the MSI X370 Titanium if it was anything like the Z270 Titanium quality wise ? Hell yeah.

Let them be ripped off. Titanium is great. Totally worth the price. There are much more to think about than the vrm parts thumb.gif
post #1316 of 2036
Quote:
Originally Posted by yendor View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

Funny, that's what guys said about my FX 8350 on the 990 GD 80. .

You won't get there on a dud chip, but you won't get an average chip there on a dud of a board either.

How about CL 14 3200 mhz 1 T on the very first bios using AXMP? Any other motherboards able to do that?

Wee asus board had no problem with xmp on release bios

Titanium bios may not have been perfect but at least it, like the biostar gt7, was mostly problem free without widespread issues.
Just worked, gratifying for flagship board.

Your nephew seems to have drawn the short end of the stick on his experience with the other half of that kit. Hard to judge, don't know skill level.
I'm curious did you ever run that kit on your titanium?

I taught him everything I know about ram overclocking.... ( which is very little tongue.gif )

It's possible they aren't as good as the 2 that ended up staying in my board. I did run both halves by themselves at 3200 cl 14 but didn't test both sets extensively. My nephew has bought his own set now and I haven't heard how he is getting along with them - he returned the other half of my kit to me and I'm running them now in 2x8 3200 mhz cl 14 1 T - I'll let you know how I get along with them.

Bios , windows and microcode updates make for complicated comparisons....lol I'll update you on how things go with his rig as well.
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post #1317 of 2036
Absolutely makes a ton of difference.

On all new bios etc the stuff im testing is hitting same max same volts.

Guide be posted on giga soon. Be way easier once you understand its quirks.

Simple terms auto multi plus refclock = win.

Deviate from above = lose.

Agesa or giga?

Little bit of both...but groundwork wise...it has the potential to do some pretty good stuff.

No bios can fix pwm sinks though...

Dropping switching frequency might cool fets down though.

They could have it cranked up high.

If you chose to use it with plans to actively cool vrm as i stated in day 1 launch...be fine.

Cruddy airflow closed case stock cooler 4 gig? Gl with that...
post #1318 of 2036
Quote:
Originally Posted by chew* View Post

Absolutely makes a ton of difference.

Guide be posted on giga soon. Be way easier once you understand its quirks.

Simple terms auto multi plus refclock = win.

Deviate from above = lose.

looking forward to that guide.
post #1319 of 2036
Quote:
Originally Posted by PsyM4n View Post

Yeah, I have no clue. Absolutely none.
It's not as if you can miss a spot when applying the coating. It's also impossible for debris, like a piece of hair, to find its way behind the coating when applying it, thus sorting the board.
Of course the coating is always perfect and lasts forever. thumb.gif

/sarcasm.











Now what was that you were lecturing me about?

Was it moisture?

Sorry to make you look dumb but you do that fine without help it seems...

People who do this on the professional lvl do know what they are doing.
Edited by chew* - 5/1/17 at 10:11pm
post #1320 of 2036
Quote:
Originally Posted by virpz View Post

That's a conversation, prove me wrong but also let me try to help you with that...

There you have the datasheets. No absolute maximums, please.wackosmiley.gifthumb.gif

Nikos MSI fets
http://www.niko-sem.com/in/front/bin/home.phtml
http://products.niko-sem.com/images/product/148231008405971632.pdf
http://www.unikc.com.cn/UploadFile/products/2015710171838-PK616BA_REV1.0_20140220.pdf



Now, the TI fets used with the Taichi, Crosshair and even on the Prime.
http://www.ti.com/product/CSD87350Q5D/technicaldocuments
http://www.ti.com/general/docs/lit/getliterature.tsp?genericPartNumber=csd87350q5d&fileType=pdf


Figures, It is not a matter of me liking or not MSI/Nikos, it's just what the MSI X370 Titanium has to offer at $300 cost/benefit wise, it is how these fets are crap and cheap in their own datasheet.

Would I recommend anybody to build their $ 1000+ worth of hardware over that thing ? Hell NO

Would I buy and recommend the MSI X370 Titanium if it was anything like the Z270 Titanium quality wise ? Hell yeah.

According to the documents you pointed to, the particular combination of nikos low and high side fets perform slightly better than the TI fets you pointed to. The numbers on these documents say so.

The difference here is minimal though. In practice, the difference would only affect extreme scenarios (ie: ln2, phase, etc) or scenarios when more than one low and/or high side fets are used per coil.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chew* View Post









Now what was that you were lecturing me about?

Was it moisture?

Sorry to make you look dumb but you do that fine without help it seems...

People who do this on the professional lvl do know what they are doing.

You can call me whatever you want. The fact is that errors happen. You might be doing the same thing perfectly fine for decades and still encounter a problem or two at some point. When that happens, it might not even be your fault.
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