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[Official] MSI X370 XPOWER GAMING TITANIUM AM4 Owners Club - Page 55

post #541 of 1119
Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

1. Who is responsible for taking a leap of faith purchasing ram before a QVL is out for the motherboard they plan to use?
2. If it didn't work, how did you flash to the beta bios?
3. Who is responsible for trying a beta bios that killed one of your sticks?
4. Only certified to work at 2400mhz - you can hope for more, but you can't expect it.
5 . Is the 3200 mhz kit on the QVL? The one you originally tried is not, nor were there ANY cl 16 3200 kits listed on the QVL the last time I looked.

I see far too many "blame the hardware " types around here - gets old.

How many times will I have to tell you a beta bios did not kill a stick of memory? this is the third time. I only ran a beta which ironically was the one that supposedly bricked boards, in my case it did not negatively affect anything, and I was easily able to revert back to the official 1.3 version without incident. The 2 kits of ram that did suffer hardware failure on at least 1 stick were both on bios version 1.1 as it came to me from MSI. In both instances of this happening, I was able to get the one stick that survived to work at 2667 with no problems at all. But what good is half a memory kit that works, and half that is completely dead.
I am done with this discussion now. Have fun
post #542 of 1119
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmunn View Post

To follow this up, I have been building my own computers since 1979, and have built many thousands at work, since I do this for a living, not just as a hobby. This Ryzen experience has been one of the worst I have ever had..

Since we're going to relate personal backgrounds...

Well pretty early in 1979 I was 10... and the only person I knew with a "home computer" at the time was my Aunt/Uncle. That being some form of TRaSh 80. It wasn't until I would say 1982 that through yard sales etc I got a Commodore 64... So personally I definitely wasn't building anything back in the early days of home computing aka 8 bit era.

When I started building my own was somewhere around 1998 or 1999. So let's say that in comparison I have all of 18 years with this. In that time I've probably built a few hundred systems. Those being for myself, friends and family. Ranging from basic systems to gaming and a few very specific systems for professional services.

Since the launch of Ryzen I've built two X370 based systems and both have worked with ram @ 3200. Mine is on an MSI Titanium and one for a friend on an Asus CH6. I've got a Gigabyte K7 coming in Tuesday or Wednesday for a third build.

There were some issues with the Asus board. It just felt far more touchy in regards to settings. Definitely something that was improving as bios updates came. As opposed to my Titanium with the 1.1 bios that was a rock out of the box.

Both of these systems used DDR 4 I have had laying around for at least a year.. none of it is on QVL. Yet when trying to keep costs down.. I use what I have on hand. Both systems are using early G.Skill 4000 kits that were collecting dust on my shelves. Why? because they never seemed to work quite right at 4000 on the Z170 systems I tested them on. So I figured I would toss them in and see what happens. So the MSI has been @ 3200 memory for over a month with 0 issues and the Asus has been there for the last 3 weeks after things got sorted out. Lucky for my friend we missed out of the bios bricking issue with the CH6.

Personally I'm not sure tossing around numbers like "1000's of systems built" or decades of background is really the route I would have gone. I've got a lot of G.Skill and some Corsair memory laying around. These kits I have working were just ones I randomly pulled out of the pile. The only "checking" I did on them.. was to make sure they were single rank kits. Beyond that I run my ram @ 1.37 instead of 1.35... due to the fact it's run at 1T instead of 2T... and I manually input the timings which I stole from one of Elmor's early posts in t he CH6 threads.
post #543 of 1119
Those were the days when you ordered a kit, and soldered on all the components yourself. If you were careful, and lucky it would work just fine, but usually required a few reworks before everything was correct and it worked smile.gif

It wasn't until the PC clone days you could order the boards already assembled and build a PC as we sort of know it today.
post #544 of 1119
Anyone notice how the QVL differs from boad manufacturer to board manufacturer? Only ram that seems to run fine at 3200MHz on Titanium is Samsung b-die yet Asus has Hynix chips running at 3200MHz and dual rank Hynix running at 3200MHz as well...even 16GB modules at that. Gygabyte are doing the same.

With the 1.4x beta bios my 16GB sticks of Corsair dual rank Hynix 3000MHz would run at 2666MHz properly (still not 3000MHz)....but not on any other bios. I also purchased a kit of Corsair 3200MHz modules recommended by AMD but they won't work with current bios.

Asus has enabled the command rate to be changed in bios, MSI still nothing.

Good on you if you were lucky enough to have high frequency rams 4000MHz lying around to use at 3200MHz because tey work, good luck to you if you had 3200MHz Samsung b-die modules you are running at spec....good on you!

Fact of the matter, yeah 1.1 bios may be solid on basic levels but doesn't mean MSI have freeeeken dropped the ball when it comes to bios implementation and improvements!!!! No adjusting command rate, no HPET on/off, no voltage offset, no P-state adjustment,no updating AGESA blah blah blah......give us a freeeeken break, MSi are beyond slack when it comes to bios improvement if compared to the competition.
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post #545 of 1119
Sad to say it but I am off to get a different MB
Its cheaper than getting new ram and there are boards out there now that support my RAM.

Honestly this is a shame as I like most of my MSI products and had a nice MSI theme in my open case Core P5 build with 2x 1080 sea hawks with the branded MSI SLI
But its clear that MSI are struggling with this bios and with little to NO feedback I am not willing to sit back and hope that some time in the distant future they may get around to doing the job properly.

Good luck all, I hope you various issues are sorted soon.
post #546 of 1119
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanjiro View Post

Sad to say it but I am off to get a different MB
Its cheaper than getting new ram and there are boards out there now that support my RAM.

Honestly this is a shame as I like most of my MSI products and had a nice MSI theme in my open case Core P5 build with 2x 1080 sea hawks with the branded MSI SLI
But its clear that MSI are struggling with this bios and with little to NO feedback I am not willing to sit back and hope that some time in the distant future they may get around to doing the job properly.

Good luck all, I hope you various issues are sorted soon.

General consensus is that ASRock is making the "better" boards right now, but it's a wild guess for everyone at the moment. I'm sticking with my Carbon for now. The next generation of AM4 boards will most likely be better once Ryzen matures. So I can hold out until then.
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post #547 of 1119
I think if you can get at least 2400 or 2667 mhz, it is advisable to hold out and give this MB a chance until at least after AMD releases the new microcode with better memory support in May (or June). It's only been a month since Ryzen release, and MSI even released new motherboards (Krait, SLI, etc.). That may be where their resources went to instead of updating our bios.

And as mentioned before: when you change memory settings and you can boot, then power off and on a couple of times prior to stress testing so that memory training/timings gets worked out.
 
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post #548 of 1119
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmunn View Post

I have gone through 2 different boards, and 4 kits of ram to find something that would even work at ddr4 2400, I have my third kit of G.skill tridentz sitting here afraid to install it, for fear of it having 1 stick die again (would be third time in a row)

So I can appreciate that you are happy, and some others are happy, but just know that was a matter of pure luck and NOT certainty or some form of wisdom on your part. The anger and ill will being felt by many of us is very real, and very justified.

No. It isn't they just as of less then a month ago had beta bios that bricked boards they are being cautious which imo is a great thing
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmunn View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

What do you mean nothing to do with wisdom ? You messed around with a beta bios - that is about as foolish as it gets.

I didn't mess around with a beta bios, I was running bios version 1.1 when the issues with ram happened. trying beta 1.41 didn't help so I went back to the final official 1.3 they provided on the website, which I am still running right now. with g.skill fortis series ddr4 2400 cl16 ram, which by the way, is identical chips as the trident-z cl16 memory kits, hynix, but the different is the configuration stored on the module has the correct timings to make it work right out of the box. So if you buy the lower speed fortis kits that are jedec compliant DDR4 specifications, they will auto detect and boot right up with zero issues. The problem with that is the infinity fabric sets its speeds based on the ram frequency, so to extract the full power of the processor practically requires running a DDR4 overclock to 3000 or 3200 or even higher.
You really don't grasp this stuff at all i am sorry to say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by wmunn View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

What do you mean nothing to do with wisdom ? You messed around with a beta bios - that is about as foolish as it gets.

I didn't mess around with a beta bios, I was running bios version 1.1 when the issues with ram happened. trying beta 1.41 didn't help so I went back to the final official 1.3 they provided on the website, which I am still running right now. with g.skill fortis series ddr4 2400 cl16 ram, which by the way, is identical chips as the trident-z cl16 memory kits, hynix, but the different is the configuration stored on the module has the correct timings to make it work right out of the box. So if you buy the lower speed fortis kits that are jedec compliant DDR4 specifications, they will auto detect and boot right up with zero issues. The problem with that is the infinity fabric sets its speeds based on the ram frequency, so to extract the full power of the processor practically requires running a DDR4 overclock to 3000 or 3200 or even higher.


Here is what you did from my point of view. You bought a kit that was not on the QVL for the motherboard and being disappointed that it didn't run at rated speeds you tried a beta bios which went very badly ( which has happened on about any brand of board out there with this platform). You then bought a cheap ddr4 kit rated that IS on the QVL but only rated for 2400 mhz operation and you are once again disappointed because it only runs at .... 2400mhz

People that take responsibility for failures - learn , people who think they are above making mistakes.... repeat them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by wmunn View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post

Here is what you did from my point of view. You bought a kit that was not on the QVL for the motherboard and being disappointed that it didn't run at rated speeds you tried a beta bios which went very badly ( which has happened on about any brand of board out there with this platform). You then bought a cheap ddr4 kit rated that IS on the QVL but only rated for 2400 mhz operation and you are once again disappointed because it only runs at .... 2400mhz

People that take responsibility for failures - learn , people who think they are above making mistakes.... repeat them.

You are again taking it out of context and twisting the meaning.
1. I purchased a memory kit with the board BEFORE there was a QVL even published, based on information provided by AMD themselves, who should know
2. I was not disappointed that it would not run at rated speed, it didn't run at ANY speed.
3. The beta bios in my case did NOT go badly at all, it just wasn't any better than the original 1.1
4. the g.skill fortis kit was NOT on the QVL when I bought it, but it does work. I am not disappointed the 2400 kit does not run faster, I bought it to use for now until things are better.
5. I do have a kit of 3200 memory, and am waiting until the AGESA and bios are updated properly before I try again.

1. Who is responsible for taking a leap of faith purchasing ram before a QVL is out for the motherboard they plan to use?
2. If it didn't work, how did you flash to the beta bios?
3. Who is responsible for trying a beta bios that killed one of your sticks?
4. Only certified to work at 2400mhz - you can hope for more, but you can't expect it.
5 . Is the 3200 mhz kit on the QVL? The one you originally tried is not, nor were there ANY cl 16 3200 kits listed on the QVL the last time I looked.

I see far too many "blame the hardware " types around here - gets old.

Completely agree, with, well everything. mine work. 3200 cl16. Took a bit of work
Quote:
Originally Posted by AuraNova View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by sanjiro View Post

Sad to say it but I am off to get a different MB
Its cheaper than getting new ram and there are boards out there now that support my RAM.

Honestly this is a shame as I like most of my MSI products and had a nice MSI theme in my open case Core P5 build with 2x 1080 sea hawks with the branded MSI SLI
But its clear that MSI are struggling with this bios and with little to NO feedback I am not willing to sit back and hope that some time in the distant future they may get around to doing the job properly.

Good luck all, I hope you various issues are sorted soon.

General consensus is that ASRock is making the "better" boards right now, but it's a wild guess for everyone at the moment. I'm sticking with my Carbon for now. The next generation of AM4 boards will most likely be better once Ryzen matures. So I can hold out until then.
says who? Asus or giga by far if not using msi
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post #549 of 1119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mega Man View Post

says who? Asus or giga by far if not using msi

Following all the threads involving Ryzen mobos, the AM4 socket, and the VRMs, that's quite a few threads. It seems like there are less people having issues with ASRock than with ASUS or Gigabyte. I'd say Gigabyte seems to be a close second as far as "best board" is concerned.

I have an MSI Carbon, so I went with what I thought was the right decision for me. I have never had any major issues with an MSI board out of the previous 3 I had before this one. I don't expect to have one with this one either.
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post #550 of 1119
Quote:
Originally Posted by AuraNova View Post

Following all the threads involving Ryzen mobos, the AM4 socket, and the VRMs, that's quite a few threads. It seems like there are less people having issues with ASRock than with ASUS or Gigabyte. I'd say Gigabyte seems to be a close second as far as "best board" is concerned.

I have an MSI Carbon, so I went with what I thought was the right decision for me. I have never had any major issues with an MSI board out of the previous 3 I had before this one. I don't expect to have one with this one either.

I've heard good things about say for example the Taichi... the only issue from my end is I can never find one in stock. Gigabyte seems mostly positive (have a K7 coming this week).

The only "hands on" I've had is with the Titanium and CH6. My personal experience based on those two... I'll take the Titanium currently. I've had two CH6 boards because one was in a friends build and the other was for me. I just keep having tweak issues with the Asus and in general the ROG line is good for me (I have almost every board they had in the Z170 line as an example).

Looking at ASRock with say the Taichi or Gigabyte with the Gaming 5 or K7... you are also in a much more attractive price range (my opinion). In your case with the Carbon that is also in a much better price position than the Titanium.

The only thing that the Titanium on paper gives you over those boards.... If you are using a second M.2 drive you can run it at the 2.0 X4 and still use all your X1 slots... I have a few PCIE x1 devices I use so that was actually a "thing" for me. (almost all the other boards disable the x1 slots and a few give you the option to run the second M.2 at x2 and still use the x1 slots). The Titanium was also the only non Bio Star board I could find in stock at the time. While I'm happy with it... the Titanium (and the CH6) are over priced in my opinion. They would both be better priced around the $220 range (again my opinion). At least the ASRock board that is over $200 has a 5 Gigabit NIC onboard to give you something "more" for the increased price.
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