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post #7911 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBoom View Post

Well thats the thing, I matched the curve to give me what the manual oc was giving me so more or less the same core not higher.

Yeah I was using HWM for the raw power numbers so I'm not sure how accurate that is. But I did observe that the normalized TDP was hitting a max of 124% which does make sense since 320w + 24% is roughly 400w.

Second observation is that total system power draw was at ~600w on my AX860i graphing. This is at 8K Supo which isn't that CPU intensive so unless my CPU was drawing more than 200w at 1.245v 4.5ghz in Supo, there can't be anything else that adds up to 600w..

Of course it is not holding at the max though. It somehow hit that max briefly before it power limited itself and throttled down possibly.

That math seems a little off to me. Are you using the stock bios?

It would be 124% * 250 watts, and the stock bios will hit above 120% briefly for anyone but it doesn't mean it won't back down below 120% literally a second after.

Measuring power draw via software isn't really reliable anyways, specially since you are manipulating it. It's best to verify software and hardware together, using a power meter device. Look a page or two back, nrpeyton measured it out of the wall, the Palit bios only gives yo 30 watts.

I'm quite certain that with only 330 watts you won't hold 1.092v, I'm just letting you know you might want to consider shunt modding your card to unlock its true potential or settle for what you can get around 1.032-1.050v which is fine as well.
Edited by SlimJ87D - 5/1/17 at 7:28am
post #7912 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Atotarho View Post

Thanks, I started 3 tests at once, all ok. But the memory worked at 10,400 MHz, so it should be? I have a bios ichill 4, the memory I usually work at 11400 MHz. So these 2 capacitors can not be soldered? A transistor what role does it perform?

How did you knock them off btw?
post #7913 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlimJ87D View Post

How did you knock them off btw?
I had an Arctic Cooling Accelero Hybrid III-140, the radiator on the back of the board was very stuck, I tried to tear it away, it jumped off and touched the parts.
post #7914 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by feznz View Post

I could tell you back in the day of GTX 580s I derminined that 1000Mhz was my max stable overclock with software based voltage I had had these cards for about a year and probably used for 8 hours a week gaming and idling on the web for 12hours a week the rest of the time the PC was off. (the days before boosting clocks)
Hearing about lots about failing card ect I really had to see for myself how long would these cards last 24/7 folding ??? while keeping the cards under 60°C with max stable OC of 1000Mhz which never crashed during folding.

Answer;
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
the first card 3 weeks, the second card about another 2 weeks of normal use

My question to you, what was your voltage at? Was it max? What was the slider at and volts please.
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post #7915 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlimJ87D View Post

That math seems a little off to me. Are you using the stock bios?

It would be 124% * 250 watts, and the stock bios will hit above 120% briefly for anyone but it doesn't mean it won't back down below 120% literally a second after.

Measuring power draw via software isn't really reliable anyways, specially since you are manipulating it. It's best to verify software and hardware together, using a power meter device. Look a page or two back, nrpeyton measured it out of the wall, the Palit bios only gives yo 30 watts.

I'm quite certain that with only 330 watts you won't hold 1.092v, I'm just letting you know you might want to consider shunt modding your card to unlock its true potential or settle for what you can get around 1.032-1.050v which is fine as well.

My bad I should have probably mentioned this earlier but my card is a Zotac Amp Extreme not a FE. Using stock Amp Extreme bios.

So it should be 320*124%.

I think the curve probably works better for those on FE and shunt modded.
post #7916 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlimJ87D View Post

The thing that kills cards quicker worse than voltage is heat, heat just so happens to be a by product of voltage and current, power.

Nvidia already put too much safeguards into the card. Voltage is capped, power is limited, temperatures throttle.

Most of these safeguards are more due to heat than they are current and voltage. The specs for the vram, vrm, capacitors, resistors, conductors, etc are all way over spec. The vrm can go up to 150C and draw 40 watts each on an FE.

This guy isn't completely wrong when he says voltage will decrease the life of a card, but he's not specific enough. Like you said, is it on air? Stock blower? Etc. He shares no data.

1.092v is such a tiny amount I can't imagine it harming anything.

From all our conversations, it just makes sense that voltage is capped so low due to power draw, not because of the life of the card.

The dang FE can barely run at 1.050v without power limiting on Witcher 3. What would be the point of allowing us to do 1.24v only to discover we'd be power limited and binned to 1.050v anyways? That's what nvidia was thinking when they capped the voltage. They were using math. To determine what the card will be used for.

I don't think they were concerned with the life of the card and capping them at 1.092v as we used to have 1.187v in the past with the 600,700,900 cards correct me if I'm wrong.

But maybe they predicted a irresponsible turbo nerd breaking their card with a shunt mod drawing 500+ watts at 1.187v, lol.

Lol, true.

Think you hit it on the nail with power though.

The number 250..............: (the stock TDP of your 1080 TI)






Sure the number 250 is also famous for many things lol. But it's also a "nice even number".

And it's also Nvidias TDP design for our 1080TI.... but how can something so volatile as a GPU be exactly 250 TDP? lol... of course it's not.
It's a marketing ploy. No one is going to release a card with a TDP of 279, or 296. Or 178. Because it's bad marketing.

Also if you think about CPU's (as a comparison). The most power hungry CPU (that I recall) to ever be released domestically was AMD's FX-9590 at 220w. Despite socket compatibility you couldn't even run this CPU off a mid-range mobo because they thought you'd blow the VRM up (in fact on it's release it was OEM only -- they wanted it restricted to system builders).

With all the focus on environment & energy e.t.c. + "performance per watt"... how could Nvidia possibly release a card with a TDP greater than 250w? Of course they couldn't. Because they'd of been slammed for it by the press! Big time!

So instead they artificially limit the performance of our cards for this marketing stunt. For shareholders and for their profit. (But if that's the reason; can you blame them)?

Also Nvidia doesn't strike me as the kind of company that likes anyone doing anything different from their ideology (and rules). You just have to watch their Chief Exec, 'Jensen Huang' talking at CES 2017 and you get the picture lol.

I never blamed them at first, until I watched 'Jensen Huang' talk about self-driving cars at CES,
What? self-driving cars?
yeah!
lol
that's right. that's what all your hard earned cash is going on.
Millions of dollars poured into research into things like Self-Driving Cars. Amongst other big grand claims that were also made at CES, hardly any of them actually talked about GPU development!

...now I start to wonder... lol

Anyway; these cards are crying out for Shut mod.
But to be honest that's not so bad:
It feels good doing something "forbidden". wink.gif
Edited by nrpeyton - 5/1/17 at 11:15am
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post #7917 of 10445
Many tests have shown that 1080ti SLI does not offer as much performance as single.
The SLI of 1080 loses by up to 10% only while single gets to lose by up to 30%.
Did anyone else notice that?
post #7918 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luckbad View Post

Okay, I believe at this point I've found my best memory overclock.

6210 MHz yields the highest scores in SuperPosition. 6220 does not artifact, but it yields much lower scores. 6237 will artifact or freeze.

Test Environment
Note that I'm not running in a 100% perfect benchmark environment for maximum scores. I was only interested in testing the memory on my GPU.
  • My CPU isn't overclocked to its limit. It's just a 6700k running at lowish voltage at 4.4 GHz (my daily speed, not a real benching speed).
  • My RAM is not overclocked beyond its XMP right now. 16GB of G.Skill TridentZ DDR4 3600 at 15-15-15-35
  • My GPU core is not absolutely maxed out. It's running at +92, which is 2075.5 MHz.
  • I'm allowing for some overvoltage, but it's limited to 1.075 and is not currently Locked via a curve

That is a long preamble for nothing earth shattering at all. Basically, I mentioned in my previous post that as I clock the GPU memory clock up or down, I see pretty wild fluctuations in my SuperPosition scores. +407 offset is definitively better than +417 every single time, well beyond the margin of error. I skipped up until I started seeing artifacts and/or freezing and found a comfortable memory overclock where that would never happen.

Then I started changing numbers and running SuperPosition (4K Optimized). I kept the fans on my Zotac 1080 Ti Amp Extreme at 100% and let the GPU cool down to 35 °C between runs (not its actual idle temp, but it was getting to ~55-58 °C during each run and didn't take long to get to 35).

Offset | Clock | Score
+597 | 6210 | 10270
+615 | 6210 | 10281
+628 | 6220 | 10123
+610 | 6210 | 10279
+605 | 6210 | 10282
+616 | 6220 | 10126
+615 | 6210 | 10285
+599 | 6210 | 10280
+596 | 6210 | 10281
+618 | 6220 | 10123
+596 | 6210 | 10276
+620 | 6220 | 10126

Long story short, everything clocked at 6210 MHz gives scores within the margin of error. There are thresholds at which the memory will gain frequency, and it seems like it doesn't really matter what the number is within that frequency band is, just what the actual clock is.

Looks good. smile.gif

Did you also do a quick check with OCCT?

Memory technology hasn't changed much since 1080 (non TI).. we're just using higher binned/rated chips. Therefor I don't think posting this next graph would be tooooo off-topic for this thread (given as I said technology with memory is actually so similar and architecture is the same).

But anyway here's what happened to me with my 1080 Classy:

(You may have to right click & select 'open new tab' and view in FULL SIZE).



And just a little info on different GDDR5X memory specs (from micron datasheet).




Anyway you'll notice from the graph that at +925 I was actually scoring higher than at +775.
But what I also had to take into account was that at +925 the card was error correcting (dropping frames). It just so happens that because of the utterly ridiculous extent of my memory overclock -- it was sooo fast it actually "made up for" the error-correcting & lost frames and even surpassed it.

However.. I don't believe that's a healthy situation for my card. Therefore I dropped my memory overclock back to my "highest scoring overclock" that didn't throw up errors in OCCT. smile.gif

Felt more comfortable.

Also; micron memory responds quite nicely to temp drops. (I am hoping I can improve on my maximum error-free +556 after I go water).

P.S.
Before I forget. don't pay any attention to 1.5v between +650 and +675 on graph, (I messed up and lost data and was forced to fill in the blanks due to limited time). I can assure 110% though the rest is all 110% accurate & true account.

Edited by nrpeyton - 5/1/17 at 9:26am
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post #7919 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by nrpeyton View Post

Just tried the PALIT BIOS myself, but due to losing 2000 FAN RPM; I'm afraid any experiments & their results are going to have to wait until after I've picked & installed a full-cover waterblock on this card.

It idles at 65C if I leave the fan profile to default, lol. And maxed out It doesn't go higher than 2700 RPM. No good on a FE!! normal max is 4700RPM!!

Any recommendations? There are no reviews yet comparing temps for different 1080 TI blocks.
Meaning I may just grab the EK block; the rest of my equipment , is all EKWB, (barring the Chiller of course).

On my Classy 1080 I never gave it a 2nd thought, massive PCB guaranteed great temps. But the baby-sized PCB of the reference design will impact cooling; so I want a block that scrapes every last possible degree C.

I've been impressed with my EK block. Mine has maxed at 36c so far. If it cools the other components (vrm, mem, etc) anything like my old 780 lightning, those are probably around 30 c. My old lightning could monitor mem, vrm, and PCB temps. With my EK block, the memory sat no more than low 30s. Same temps or lower for vrm. That was with me overclocking and overvolting. Vrms never got out of the 30s even when pushing 1.4 volts on the core. My computer is even in the hottest room in my house by far.
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post #7920 of 10445
Quote:
Originally Posted by feznz View Post

I could tell you back in the day of GTX 580s I derminined that 1000Mhz was my max stable overclock with software based voltage I had had these cards for about a year and probably used for 8 hours a week gaming and idling on the web for 12hours a week the rest of the time the PC was off. (the days before boosting clocks)
Hearing about lots about failing card ect I really had to see for myself how long would these cards last 24/7 folding ??? while keeping the cards under 60°C with max stable OC of 1000Mhz which never crashed during folding.

Answer; Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
the first card 3 weeks, the second card about another 2 weeks of normal use

wow, so there is truth in it after all.

I wonder how long it would of lasted without any o/c at stock voltage.... (for comparison)







Quote:
Originally Posted by DerComissar View Post

Another block consideration for you may be the Aquacomputer Kryographics block, with their active cooled backplate.
This is the bit tech review of the TXP block that I ordered, which also fits the 1080Ti:
https://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/graphics/2016/09/23/titan-x-pascal-water-cooling-review/1

I ordered it directly from Aquacomputer in Germany, along with the active-cooled backplate:
https://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3458&XTCsid=bpvgo27iuaini7b5km10vmqpi
https://shop.aquacomputer.de/product_info.php?products_id=3463&XTCsid=bpvgo27iuaini7b5km10vmqpi
They tend to be in short supply at times. Aquatuning and Performance PC also sell them, but are often oos.

I found a recent review, with the active cooled backplate, from VSG at Thermalbench:
http://thermalbench.com/2017/04/26/aqua-computer-kryographics-pascal-1080/

Note that this review is for the 1080 version, but should be very similar to the TitanXP/1080Ti block.

The gpu temps were slightly lower than the EK block, but of interest was the significant reduction in vrm temps, from using the active backplate.: Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I've used several EK gpu blocks in the past. I had an Aquacomputer block on one of my 780Ti's, and was impressed with its thick copper construction. The backplate was also much thicker than EK's backplate, but I didn't have the optional active cooling attachment on that block.

The test results from the Thermalbench review look very good, as keeping the vrm temps low is very important as well.

I had purchased an EK TitanXP block (which fits the 1080Ti as well) before buying the AC block, but have decided to use the Aquacomputer Kryographics block instead.

Edit:
OCUK may have them as well, I see the backplate listed there, but not sure if they have the blocks yet.
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/water-cooling/water-blocks?ckSuppliers=44&sSort=5&n=384&ckTab=0

excellent info, I'm definitely going to read up more about this block.

the idea of an actively cooled backplate is highly intriguing.

I'm one of the guys who uses a fan blowing onto the back of the socket of my mobo for another 10c off my CPU temp, so actively cooling a backplate with water to me is actually a very natural and excellent idea :-)

rep+ for info ;-)








Quote:
Originally Posted by Bishop07764 View Post

I've been impressed with my EK block. Mine has maxed at 36c so far. If it cools the other components (vrm, mem, etc) anything like my old 780 lightning, those are probably around 30 c. My old lightning could monitor mem, vrm, and PCB temps. With my EK block, the memory sat no more than low 30s. Same temps or lower for vrm. That was with me overclocking and overvolting. Vrms never got out of the 30s even when pushing 1.4 volts on the core. My computer is even in the hottest room in my house by far.

So with EK Titan / 1080 TI block; you're maxing out under 40 at full load?

Nice.

You just using regular water/radiators?
Edited by nrpeyton - 5/1/17 at 9:39am
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