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ROG Crosshair VI overclocking thread - Page 1162

post #11611 of 17677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Batuhano View Post

Unfortunately downclocking is not working for me, i have no issues with bclk 100 setting. I already changed the cpu ratios in zenstates for 131.4 blck and oc works, got 4000mhz but no downclocking at idle, just 4000 mhz.

What Windows power profile are you using? High performance and Ryzen Balanced power plans won't down clock (ryzen plan visually) unless you change the minimum processor state to at least 50%.

Balanced and power saving plans will downclock but their other settings hamper the max performance of ryzen, mainly in the single core sector, but power saving will also hamper multi core performance.
Edited by Reikoji - 4/26/17 at 8:08am
post #11612 of 17677
Quote:
Originally Posted by alt-echi View Post

Quick question smile.gif. I see the latest BIOS on the ASUS website is 1002.

Is that the latest one here?

I'm just confused about the other BIOS's Elmor has posted up on his first post


Before you are allowed to ask questions you must read every previous post. Its the law!

 

Kidding...

 

Just read the OP carefully and slowly. It is all there. I use 0082 because I like 1t timings. I have flashed 0003 beforehand to get the base clock lowered during start to help train faster ram frequencies and mitigate cold boot problems.

post #11613 of 17677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reikoji View Post

What Windows power profile are you using? High performance and Ryzen Balanced power plans won't down clock (ryzen plan visually) unless you change the minimum processor state to at least 50%.

Balanced and power saving plans will downclock but their other settings hamper the max performance of ryzen, mainly in the single core sector, but power saving will also hamper multi core performance.

Im using balanced power plan frown.gif i know it should work but its not. Another thing i just remembered, the vcore setting for p0 also didnt worked in zenstates. I changed it to 1.425v but in hwinfo vcore its not changed. But as i said before i have no problems while using blck at 100

(Im using latest zenstates)
post #11614 of 17677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Targonis View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by madweazl View Post

Not only that but cooler temps can bring stability to overclocks not possible on air.

There is a reason why even an AIO cooler is a better choice for MOST people than air cooling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluej511 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Targonis View Post

There is a reason why even an AIO cooler is a better choice for MOST people than air cooling.

I really wouldn't go as far as saying that though. Problem is, AIO are cheaply made, aluminum rads, very VERY weak pumps. Just look at this chart, compare it to a NH-D15 (which is pretty much cheaper then the AIO) and look at the quiet mode results, which give you the same noise as the air cooler. Its a 1°C difference between the two, yes if you ramp up the fans you get better temps, its also 16db louder, meaning pretty much twice the sound and then some (every 10db is perceived as twice as loud)

Now yes i know that once you get into crazy high voltages water cooling is absolutely beneficial, i just want this blah blah high regard for AIO/CLC/custom loops for CPU temps to stop being so ignorant. People are thinking they'll see a 20°C drop going from air to water, its just not true at all in the case of CPUs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madweazl View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Targonis View Post

There is a reason why even an AIO cooler is a better choice for MOST people than air cooling.

They may work for some people but I find zero value in the AIO outside of aesthetics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpecChum View Post

I only go AIO as I prefer the look - I really don't like a huge chunk of metal staring at me through my case window tongue.gif

I'd go custom loop if I really wanted performance, saying that a decent AIO's performance is more than acceptable tho.

There are two issues here related to liquid cooling. The first is the damage that can occur if it leaks, which depends on the user's case location. This is sufficiently obvious that it need not be addressed in detail.

The second issue is that thermodynamics limits what non-refrigerated coolant can do. In steady state for a given CPU power level, the heat being removed from the CPU is the same with air and with coolant. In order for a liquid-cooled CPU to be slightly cooler, the heat exchanger and fans have to be more efficient transferring heat to air than the air system at the CPU is. To be more efficient requires the liquid-to-air thermal resistance be significantly lower than for the heat pipe vapor to air thermal resistance at the air cooler over the CPU. This generally requires the liquid cooler to have more fin area and more air flow velocity at the heat exchanger; something easier done away from the CPU.

Note that for the CPU to be cooler, the liquid has to be cooler, and the heat transfer to the fins at the heat exchanger will be thereby reduced, everything else being equal. Fortunately for the successful comparison of the liquid system to the air system, the heat pipe schemes in air coolers are less effective at transferring heat to the fins than radiator-style heat exchangers are in liquid-cooled systems. Thermodynamics is thus the reason for the very modest increase in temperatures shown by the large Noctua units in the chart.

Laws of thermodynamics, simplified: You can't win; you can't break even; you can't get out of the game.
     
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD Ryzen 1800X ASUS ROG CROSSHAIR VI HERO X370 Asus ROG STRIX nVidia GeForce GTX1080Ti-O11G G. Skill TridentZ F4-3200C14D-32GTZ 
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Samsung SSD 850 EVO 256GB Asus UltraDrive 8X Noctua NH-D15 SE-AM4  Linux Mint 18.1 MATE 64-bit  
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
LG 4K TV OLED55B6P Logitech MK235 RF Wireless Keyboard & Mouse PC Power & Cooling Turbo-Cool 860i Nanoxia Project S 
Mouse
See Keyboard 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
147,456 cores all registers exposed at the console 4096 36-bit words rotary drum 
Optical DriveMonitor
6 magnetic tape drives neon lites for every register; oscilloscope for... 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
AMD Ryzen 1800X ASUS ROG CROSSHAIR VI HERO X370 Asus ROG STRIX nVidia GeForce GTX1080Ti-O11G G. Skill TridentZ F4-3200C14D-32GTZ 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Samsung SSD 850 EVO 256GB Asus UltraDrive 8X Noctua NH-D15 SE-AM4  Linux Mint 18.1 MATE 64-bit  
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
LG 4K TV OLED55B6P Logitech MK235 RF Wireless Keyboard & Mouse PC Power & Cooling Turbo-Cool 860i Nanoxia Project S 
Mouse
See Keyboard 
CPUGraphicsRAMHard Drive
147,456 cores all registers exposed at the console 4096 36-bit words rotary drum 
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6 magnetic tape drives neon lites for every register; oscilloscope for... 
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post #11615 of 17677
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluej511 View Post

I really wouldn't go as far as saying that though. Problem is, AIO are cheaply made, aluminum rads, very VERY weak pumps. Just look at this chart, compare it to a NH-D15 (which is pretty much cheaper then the AIO) and look at the quiet mode results, which give you the same noise as the air cooler. Its a 1°C difference between the two, yes if you ramp up the fans you get better temps, its also 16db louder, meaning pretty much twice the sound and then some (every 10db is perceived as twice as loud)


Now yes i know that once you get into crazy high voltages water cooling is absolutely beneficial, i just want this blah blah high regard for AIO/CLC/custom loops for CPU temps to stop being so ignorant. People are thinking they'll see a 20°C drop going from air to water, its just not true at all in the case of CPUs.

Fair enough, though I did go for the Corsair H110i for my Ryzen build....fans need to be replaced. I MAY go with a full water setup, but my wife might divorce me if I dropped the money on a full liquid setup after my current Ryzen setup plus a new video card(waiting for Vega numbers before I decide what to get).
post #11616 of 17677
Quote:
Originally Posted by Batuhano View Post

Im using balanced power plan frown.gif i know it should work but its not. Another thing i just remembered, the vcore setting for p0 also didnt worked in zenstates. I changed it to 1.425v but in hwinfo vcore its not changed. But as i said before i have no problems while using blck at 100

(Im using latest zenstates)

Before using zenstates, was it downclocking with balanced plan with you Pstates setup from bios?
post #11617 of 17677
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaseki View Post




There are two issues here related to liquid cooling. The first is the damage that can occur if it leaks, which depends on the user's case location. This is sufficiently obvious that it need not be addressed in detail.

The second issue is that thermodynamics limits what non-refrigerated coolant can do. In steady state for a given CPU power level, the heat being removed from the CPU is the same with air and with coolant. In order for a liquid-cooled CPU to be slightly cooler, the heat exchanger and fans have to be more efficient transferring heat to air than the air system at the CPU is. To be more efficient requires the liquid-to-air thermal resistance be significantly lower than for the heat pipe vapor to air thermal resistance at the air cooler over the CPU. This generally requires the liquid cooler to have more fin area and more air flow velocity at the heat exchanger; something easier done away from the CPU.

Note that for the CPU to be cooler, the liquid has to be cooler, and the heat transfer to the fins at the heat exchanger will be thereby reduced, everything else being equal. Fortunately for the successful comparison of the liquid system to the air system, the heat pipe schemes in air coolers are less effective at transferring heat to the fins than radiator-style heat exchangers are in liquid-cooled systems. Thermodynamics is thus the reason for the very modest increase in temperatures shown by the large Noctua units in the chart.

Laws of thermodynamics, simplified: You can't win; you can't break even; you can't get out of the game.

True, but a copper rad with more fins and better fans will do a lot better then a aio with its aluminum rad. Then again the issue with AIOs is you can't expand. I have a 240/360 and its plenty for my 130w 1700x and 215w r9 390, water temp never goes above 10°C case temp and ZERO leaks in the past 2years.
    
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R7 1700X asus crosshair 6 Sapphire R9 390 Nitro CMK16GX4M2B3200C16 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
Kingston HyperX 3K Seagate ST2000DM006 EKWB Supremacy Evo EK-XRES 100 Revo D5 - Acetal 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Alphacool GPX r9 390 m01 alphacool xt45 240 Alphacool xt45 360 Alphacool D5 PWM 
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post #11618 of 17677
I'm not using bios OC with Pstates, tbh I don't have experience to do that. Becouse of this I love zenstates but also I want to do blck OC too and lack of downclocking is a real problem for me frown.gif
post #11619 of 17677
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaseki View Post




There are two issues here related to liquid cooling. The first is the damage that can occur if it leaks, which depends on the user's case location. This is sufficiently obvious that it need not be addressed in detail.

The second issue is that thermodynamics limits what non-refrigerated coolant can do. In steady state for a given CPU power level, the heat being removed from the CPU is the same with air and with coolant. In order for a liquid-cooled CPU to be slightly cooler, the heat exchanger and fans have to be more efficient transferring heat to air than the air system at the CPU is. To be more efficient requires the liquid-to-air thermal resistance be significantly lower than for the heat pipe vapor to air thermal resistance at the air cooler over the CPU. This generally requires the liquid cooler to have more fin area and more air flow velocity at the heat exchanger; something easier done away from the CPU.

Note that for the CPU to be cooler, the liquid has to be cooler, and the heat transfer to the fins at the heat exchanger will be thereby reduced, everything else being equal. Fortunately for the successful comparison of the liquid system to the air system, the heat pipe schemes in air coolers are less effective at transferring heat to the fins than radiator-style heat exchangers are in liquid-cooled systems. Thermodynamics is thus the reason for the very modest increase in temperatures shown by the large Noctua units in the chart.

Laws of thermodynamics, simplified: You can't win; you can't break even; you can't get out of the game.

This is where mad science comes into play.

Get a mini freezer unit, take it apart to the point where the evaporator is exposed and theres no useless enclosure in the way, extend the liquid lines for to and from the radiator so that it can leave the case and reach the altered freezer unit, do some magic and attach radiator to the outlet side of evaporator. Also can leave the useless enclosure but make the alteration so the radiator can be inserted inside and sufficiently sealed.

WIN! The advanced ice bucket challenge. Now it depends on of the liquid for liquid cooling systems will end up freezing solid smile.gif tho maybe not with a constant supply of heated liquud coming from the cpu/whatever your radiator is attatched to.

Can go even further and custom build an AC/freezer unit specifically to slide radiators into, some capability to supply cooled air for the rest of PC cooling needs biggrin.gif
Edited by Reikoji - 4/26/17 at 9:50am
post #11620 of 17677
I got my 4.0 + 3300-CL14 power draw down to 50 W during idle. Unfortunately I might have to increase some voltage (SOC or VDDP) again, because I see loss of P-state setting over reboot. Still a nice basis while waiting for future BIOS updates.
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