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ROG Crosshair VI overclocking thread - Page 927

post #9261 of 17298
BTW i leave this here my systems since Phenom times

post #9262 of 17298
I defected mad.gif really wanted an RX Vega in my machine, but since there isn't any I bought a 1080ti and waterblock. I feel happy and sad at the same time... redface.gif
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post #9263 of 17298
Quote:
Originally Posted by elmor View Post

It isn't, T_Offset is never used unless you set it manually.
Mouse-over help lists T_Offset's default as 63 and setting it to 0 changes Tctl behavior, so I did not think that Auto would disable it to prioritize MI Offset.
Quote:
Yes I saw it, but I'm not sure what you're getting at.
I am still suggesting that AMD's Tctl offset changes dynamically based on CPU instruction sets. 8 threads of 100% load running at 106 W cause a considerably lower Tctl reading than 1 (one!) thread of 100% load running at 15 W. The 8 threads use different CPU instructions to reach 100% load and thus only cause a +10 C jump, while the 1 thread uses a more taxing CPU instruction set on its single core and thus causes a +20 C jump.

In the past I also mentioned that while Heavyload taxes all 16 cores not less than Linpack in terms of power/current, it still only induces a 10 C lower offset compared to Linpack. That is at stock setting, though, heavily overclocked the behavior seems to change (Heavyload draws a lot more power and shoot up by +20 C straight away).
Quote:
Which values are used for calculating this offset you're showing? Tctl vs CPU Socket thermistor?
Tctl vs. Tctl. I can demonstrate straight +10/+20 C jumps from any value of base Tctl temperature below 95 C. Even switching Windows power profiles can cause these straight jumps, even though there is no practical difference in CPU load that would cause any real jump of head increase.

Generally speaking, I don't trust any straight full tilt +10/20 C jumps as coincidentally being the amount of temperature increase within milliseconds of starting a specific CPU workload, even less so when it happens from any base temperature and at any cooling setting. I also don't trust idle temperature to jump by +10 C regularly depending on which power profile is set (or on whether you happen to change power profiles at exactly the time of the jump).
Edited by Timur Born - 4/14/17 at 8:01am
post #9264 of 17298
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timur Born View Post

Are you using an old version of HWinfo?

5.50-3130
didn't try the beta yet, I could do that tonight, tho.

I'm wondering if overclocking makes sense at all with the temperatures being so weird...
Just booted up this morning.

Tctl 34.5°C
Socket 39°C

What's the difference between Tctl & CPU temp (the red ones)?


Because CPU in the lower section is always the same or lower than the socket (green) temperature, which from what I understand is how it should be, right?
post #9265 of 17298
CPU (Socket) should not mirror SIO CPU (the upper one in the CH6 section). Going by your motherboard temperature and assuming proper cooling it should be somewhere around 25 - 28 C.
post #9266 of 17298
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merboe View Post

5.50-3130
didn't try the beta yet, I could do that tonight, tho.

I'm wondering if overclocking makes sense at all with the temperatures being so weird...
Just booted up this morning.

Tctl 34.5°C
Socket 39°C

What's the difference between Tctl & CPU temp (the red ones)?


Because CPU in the lower section is always the same or lower than the socket (green) temperature...

The delta should be 5° until a certain point [from what I remember]; elmor posted when that changes recently but I cant recall exactly what it was.
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post #9267 of 17298
Quote:
Originally Posted by madweazl View Post

The delta should be 5° until a certain point; elmor posted when that changes recently but I cant recall exactly what it was.
That delta is for SIO CPU ("CPU" = Tctl + 5 C) and changes to "CPU" = "CPU (Socket)" + 30 C when Tctl increase a lot very quickly. Whichever of the two calculations is lower is the one used for (SIO) "CPU". But the problem he has is with "CPU (Socket)" seemingly mirroring "Tctl + 5C" instead of providing its own readings.

Try to reset HWInfo settings completely, maybe you are using an old ini file from before HWinfo changed the behavior of CPU (Socket) readings and thus gets confused.
Edited by Timur Born - 4/14/17 at 8:14am
post #9268 of 17298
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timur Born View Post

...
Generally speaking, I don't trust any straight full tilt +10/20 C jumps as coincidentally being the amount of temperature increase within milliseconds of starting a specific CPU workload, even less so when it happens from any base temperature and at any cooling setting. I also don't trust idle temperature to jump by +10 C regularly depending on which power profile is set (or on whether you happen to change power profiles at exactly the time of the jump).

Timur born: I think your testing results are beyond interesting, perhaps fascinating is a better descriptor. I am surprised that others are not also reporting these phenomena. Perhaps your CPU uniquely has an embedded thermo-electric cooler and embedded instant heater. wink.gif

In general, I think it offends good engineering practice to have temperatures reported as other than what are measured. The excuse of similar fan control across the Ryzen 7 line (or however AMD put it) is rather specious when the Ryzen 7 X series are not supplied with their own coolers for which the excuse might (!) have some merit. It would have been better in my view to enforce on the MB BIOSes some rules to be used within their fan control algorithms.
     
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post #9269 of 17298
Quote:
Originally Posted by kaseki View Post

Timur born: I think your testing results are beyond interesting, perhaps fascinating is a better descriptor. I am surprised that others are not also reporting these phenomena. Perhaps your CPU uniquely has an embedded thermo-electric cooler and embedded instant heater. wink.gif

In general, I think it offends good engineering practice to have temperatures reported as other than what are measured. The excuse of similar fan control across the Ryzen 7 line (or however AMD put it) is rather specious when the Ryzen 7 X series are not supplied with their own coolers for which the excuse might (!) have some merit. It would have been better in my view to enforce on the MB BIOSes some rules to be used within their fan control algorithms.

I think it boils down to the cheesey XFR so they can squeeze out a 4+ ghz number. Maybe these "features" will leave the microcode and we can have realistic fan profiles and temperatures. The whole implementation of temps right now is beyond frustrating. I gotten to the point I dont care what the temp is; I'll burn it to the ground if it's running properly.
Edited by madweazl - 4/14/17 at 8:44am
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post #9270 of 17298
On that regard I also like to remind you that the stock CPU does throttling of single cores even when temperatures and currents are reported as far below any dangerous threshold. This also only happens with specific CPU instructions load (one software does it, another does it not even when it seemingly taxed the CPU more).

I also don't think this is special to my CPU, but assume that all X (or at least 1800X) behave the way I observe it. That's the whole reason why people complain about jumping and nonsensical temperature readings to begin with. I just happen to analyze these things more in-depth while looking for better (or any) answers.
Edited by Timur Born - 4/14/17 at 8:31am
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