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[Various] Preview of AMD "Naples" server CPU - Page 10

post #91 of 147
I'd love to build an AMD server but most of my clients' vendors say they "don't support" AMD systems. Makes the clients not want any AMD even if they're good/better. Bunch of crap mad.gif
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post #92 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liranan View Post

Intel differentiate consumer and server parts is through ECC and the ability to have 2P configurations. AMD do not disable ECC in the IMC of their consumer chips so unless you absolutely must have higher core count than 8C/16T and need two CPU's you are just as well off with a consumer grade chip.

APU's are different as they are 'FirePro's' and I haven't heard of APU's being flashed from consumer chips to professional grade hardware after firmware flash.
Yeah that's how it looks to me. The only thing is whether the actual server grade boards will have support, which imho, is how it should be anyway.
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post #93 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by CynicalUnicorn View Post

Any leaked specs? Does it look like an actual server chip, or a consumer chip with a server label?

Not really sure how to phrase it. It's sort of like how my Xeon, while sold as a server chip, is basically nothing more than an i5 as far as specs go. I think some Kabini and Kaveri "Opterons" were sold similarly.
>Implying Netburst didn't exist

wink.gif

It will be a server chip if what I saw is correct. 16 Zen cores, 512GB/s HBM2 and a 4+ TFLOP "Greenland"/Vega GPU.
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post #94 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liranan View Post

Intel differentiate consumer and server parts is through ECC and the ability to have 2P configurations. AMD do not disable ECC in the IMC of their consumer chips so unless you absolutely must have higher core count than 8C/16T and need two CPU's you are just as well off with a consumer grade chip.

APU's are different as they are 'FirePro's' and I haven't heard of APU's being flashed from consumer chips to professional grade hardware after firmware flash.

Well yes, but I mean it's the same piece of silicon. Features like vPro and ECC are enabled, but those do exist within the i5s' and i7s' circuits. I was honestly surprised the first time I learned AM3+ CPUs supported ECC. I figured they, like Intel, would lock it to Opterons.

Well, remember, outside of Nvidia's GP100, there really aren't any dedicated server/workstation GPUs. They're mostly just clones of existing gaming GPUs. (Alternatively, the gaming GPUs are clones of the ones for servers/workstations.) APUs are probably just reporting a different GPU ID, running a FirePro rather than a Radeon R7, but the actual processor is unchanged.

Quote:
Originally Posted by budgetgamer120 View Post

What do you mean?

You know how AMD made Bulldozer and, while it was slower than its predecessor, was supposed to make up for that with extremely high clockspeeds? Well, Intel beat AMD to that concept by about a decade when they launched Netburst.

Intel had cash to throw at illegal rebates to keep AMD and their objectively superior CPUs out of OEM systems however, while AMD and Bulldozer just suffered. But we've got Zen now and they aren't bankrupt, so that's somethin'. thumb.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyX2 View Post

It will be a server chip if what I saw is correct. 16 Zen cores, 512GB/s HBM2 and a 4+ TFLOP "Greenland"/Vega GPU.

4+ TFLOP implies something around RX 480 tier.

Hmm, I wonder how that will be configured? If they aren't using a monolithic die for Naples I can't imagine they'll cram two Zen CPUs and a Polaris-tier GPU into a single die. That's about 600mm2 worth of processor. Maybe the APUs this gen will have one core complex (4C/8T, like an i7) plus a reasonably powerful GPU (about RX 460 tier) plus support for a stack of HBM. For their big server chip, four of those dies hooked to one HBM stack each would get you those specs.

Of course, I'm just speculating, but it does make some degree of sense based on what we've seen.

Also Dr. Su said we're going to see HBM APUs at some point in the future and I want them now dangit!
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post #95 of 147
I'm very skeptical about this CPU. I read speculations that it will be actually 4x Ryzens in a single package which means many problems with some cores trying to access "external" memory or external PCIe as they will be unable to access it from their own CCX. This means overloaded infinity fabric and a serious drop in performance for non optimized software. So it could be a very narrowly specialized CPU.

Skylake-EX in LGA 3647 may have just 6 channel memory support, but if all cores can use the whole memory without additional performance penalty it may be a better solution overall, except for very few optimized algorithms that will be able to use Naples correctly.
Edited by wildhorse - 4/29/17 at 7:35am
post #96 of 147
So funny how AMD keep comparing its 8 cores chips (and now Naples) to broadwell when they know their real competition is Skylake-X/E.
post #97 of 147
Neither of which exist for AMD to make comparisons to.
post #98 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkBlade6 View Post

So funny how AMD keep comparing its 8 cores chips (and now Naples) to broadwell when they know their real competition is Skylake-X/E.

Uh those haven't been released yet, so actually this is a proper comparison. wink.gif
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post #99 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhorse View Post

I'm very skeptical about this CPU. I read speculations that it will be actually 4x Ryzens in a single package which means many problems with some cores trying to access "external" memory or external PCIe as they will be unable to access it from their own CCX. This means overloaded infinity fabric and a serious drop in performance for non optimized software. So it could be a very narrowly specialized CPU.

Skylake-EX in LGA 3647 may have just 6 channel memory support, but if all cores can use the whole memory without additional performance penalty it may be a better solution overall, except for very few optimized algorithms that will be able to use Naples correctly.
Well for one, a dual 32-core CPU server is not going to be running "non-optimized" software, and secondly, multi-CPU systems have functioned in the way you described for decades.
post #100 of 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by AmericanLoco View Post

Well for one, a dual 32-core CPU server is not going to be running "non-optimized" software, and secondly, multi-CPU systems have functioned in the way you described for decades.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Naples will be 16-32 core CPU, not necessarily for just multi CPU servers. The way Broadwell-E works http://www.anandtech.com/show/10158/the-intel-xeon-e5-v4-review/4 is that L3 cache and memory controllers are shared, so they do not suffer from problems I pointed out in single CPU configuration. Shared L3 cache it may be a serious downside for QoS though for applications where it is necessary. But this monolithic architecture allows Intel CPUs to be used also for non-optimized software.

AMD Naples looks like an interesting choice for optimized software, but a really bad choice for non-optimized. What I'm getting at is that Naples will be nowhere as good as people expect it to be.

It seems AMD will have no solution for high end desktops, the area of X99 and X299.
Edited by wildhorse - 4/29/17 at 9:42am
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