Summary: Remarkable new admission from the former head of Microsoft Office development, who makes it no secret that the war over file formats (trying to pass off proprietary formats as a 'standard') was "a critical competitive moat" (denying the competition access to the desktop)
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The final decision to build the "Word Web App" rather than "a new web-based word processor from Microsoft that is not fully compatible with Word" (and similarly for Excel, PowerPoint and OneNote) was strongly driven by the belief that the file formats continued to serve as a critical competitive moat with immensely strong network effects. In fact, an argument can be made that the Office file formats represent one of the most significant network-based moats in business history (with Win32 and the iOS APIs as two others). Even applications like OpenOffice that were specifically designed to be clones have struggled with compatibility for decades. By embracing that complexity, and the costs, we would deliver something that we knew was fundamentally hard to match, especially if there was any confusion or hesitancy about the commitment required to compete.
I've said before that even Microsoft couldn't re-implement MS Office file formats in another product with perfect compatibility, and here they admit it!
Yet in 2004, another Office dev-manager talks about how precisely reverse-engineering WordPerfect's file format gave Microsoft an advantage in converting WordPerfect users to Microsoft's products:
Other moves were tactical. The Word planning team discovered that the WordPerfect sales force was going around to customers and showing Word opening a complex WordPerfect file (printer.tst) to show how bad the conversion was, and therefore how pointless it would be to try to switch to Word. So the Word team organized a special dev team that focused entirely on WordPerfect document import, "reverse-engineering" the WordPerfect file format (documentation for which was jealously guarded, as was the norm back then). Their goal was to make any WordPerfect doc open flawlessly in Word, but in particular their goal was to have no errors at all on printer.tst. Later the Word sales force used that same file when talking to customers as proof that Word 6.0 could open WordPerfect files flawlessly.
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That's why when you install newer versions of Office you get to choose if you want it to default to Open Document XML or Office XML - one is standard, the other one isn't.
Wanna take a guess at which one is selected by default?
Everyone always sits here and blames MS. Sure, they are not exactly guilt free by any stretch but it's 2017 and Linux is still in infancy. Besides Ubuntu (which has it's own spyware and bloat issues) what could even hope to compete with Windows?
Linux has a million different heads bickering back and forth about which is best and no sign of ever changing. If the linux community wants it to do better then they need to get behind a single product and support it. Even on the most well known distro's support is just not there for a lot of products and this needs to change. There is to much work for the simple things. AMD/Nvidia drivers are still a joke in Linux, etc.
Aka, there is a lot more besides MS holding linux back.
Everyone always sits here and blames MS. Sure, they are not exactly guilt free by any stretch but it's 2017 and Linux is still in infancy. Besides Ubuntu (which has it's own spyware and bloat issues) what could even hope to compete with Windows?
Are you even real? Linux is present in every single critical point where Windows simply doesn't cut it. You will have a hard time finding a supercomputer running Windows and an overwhelming majority of servers around the world run under Linux. If you knew what you're talking about you'd knew that Ubuntu has a thousand distros based on it without the bloat and spyware.
It is a problem of perception and habits. People think that Linux is hard and it really is but not to the extent in their minds. For browsing Facebook, writing a few mails or browse Pornhub on a VM it is more than enough. Otherwise, it is just Microsoft and its ecosystem stronghold.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloCamo
Linux has a million different heads bickering back and forth about which is best and no sign of ever changing. If the linux community wants it to do better then they need to get behind a single product and support it. Even on the most well known distro's support is just not there for a lot of products and this needs to change. There is to much work for the simple things. AMD/Nvidia drivers are still a joke in Linux, etc.
The coolest thing about Linux is that you will find a distro for your needs and if there is none you can build it. Wanna something easy? Try Mint. Something for your quite old computer? Try Lubuntu. Bleeding edge? Try Debian unstable or Arch.
You should also update your sources. Nvidia driver is on par with its Windows counterpart minus the bloat. In fact it beats it in CUDA workloads.
The latest update (5.3) makes it far easier for those who've never stepped out of Office. Now it's more similar than ever in terms of general functionality.
I started using it one time I had to write a huge paper and didn't have Office at hand. I gave it a go... and it did the job. My parents also started using it around the same time, and so did my brother. None of us has really had any issues.
Saves money, saves hassle, and it does the job.
Though I suppose if you get Office through your job (I also used to, but never used it in my personal computers), you may as well use that.
Everyone always sits here and blames MS. Sure, they are not exactly guilt free by any stretch but it's 2017 and Linux is still in infancy. Besides Ubuntu (which has it's own spyware and bloat issues) what could even hope to compete with Windows?
That is pretty much what hinders Linux overall.
Instead of having a strong base leading version with a strong development team, we have hundreds of small teams, each pushing to their own direction.
This is why we have so many versions of Linux available, none really 100% compatible to each other, some too complex.
If a company emerge as a mirror of Microsoft, only promoting Linux and their own strong products to it, we could today have a great alternative to windows.
If their intention was to give users option to search the web then there is nothing to worry about. What we should worry about is if they intended to force such function on users. And it does not seem like they had plans to do so.
Are you even real? Linux is present in every single critical point where Windows simply doesn't cut it. You will have a hard time finding a supercomputer running Windows and an overwhelming majority of servers around the world run under Linux. If you knew what you're talking about you'd knew that Ubuntu has a thousand distros based on it without the bloat and spyware.
It is a problem of perception and habits. People think that Linux is hard and it really is but not to the extent in their minds. For browsing Facebook, writing a few mails or browse Pornhub on a VM it is more than enough. Otherwise, it is just Microsoft and its ecosystem stronghold.
The coolest thing about Linux is that you will find a distro for your needs and if there is none you can build it. Wanna something easy? Try Mint. Something for your quite old computer? Try Lubuntu. Bleeding edge? Try Debian unstable or Arch.
You should also update your sources. Nvidia driver is on par with its Windows counterpart minus the bloat. In fact it beats it in CUDA workloads.
You proved my point. Look at it from a consumer perspective - not server, not government, not supercomputers / R&D, etc.
Is there a central go to Linux for the masses that has anywhere near the support Windows does? The answer is no. The programs on them are "almost" as good, and that simply doesn't cut it for many people. Sure there are a million distros based off ubuntu and I do regularly use Lubuntu myself but do not kid yourself and ignore that the sheer lack of support & direction is what kills Linux from ever having a chance of taking mass market share in the consumer space.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defoler
That is pretty much what hinders Linux overall.
Instead of having a strong base leading version with a strong development team, we have hundreds of small teams, each pushing to their own direction.
This is why we have so many versions of Linux available, none really 100% compatible to each other, some too complex.
If a company emerge as a mirror of Microsoft, only promoting Linux and their own strong products to it, we could today have a great alternative to windows.
I'd love to see Linux as a whole compete as an actual alternative but it's going to take a lot of changes in the linux community itself. Ever since I've started using a PC I've heard how Linux will be beating out Windows, etc. I've been hearing it for so many, many years and while they've made progress it's got a long way to go. The fact that even Valve couldn't get linux gaming really off the ground just goes to show the resistance to people moving to the platform.
In fact, an argument can be made that the Office file formats represent one of the most significant network-based moats in business history (with Win32 and the iOS APIs as two others)
Lets not forget DiectX. As I've said for years M$ has stifled the industry , the reasons are many and varied but all those years of trying to get a monopoly with an inferior product paid off for them but cost the industry as a whole decades of innovation. And put alot of great products out of business.
ADDED:
BTW EdgeOf Blade I think you meant Oblivious.
Quote:
*The average human being had a normal day obvious to the anti-Microsoft knee jerking.
My biggest problem is games and adobe products not supporting linux, mostly adobe products which if they did I would have no issue using linux as my daily driver again but ever since my dive into photoshop (which "works" but not really in wine) Ive stuck to windows with linux in a VM.
I absolutely love ubuntu gnome, and my family has it on their systems but i simply cant use it as my daily.
I'd love to see Linux as a whole compete as an actual alternative but it's going to take a lot of changes in the linux community itself. Ever since I've started using a PC I've heard how Linux will be beating out Windows, etc. I've been hearing it for so many, many years and while they've made progress it's got a long way to go. The fact that even Valve couldn't get linux gaming really off the ground just goes to show the resistance to people moving to the platform.
Office file formats + DirectX, those two can fill up pages of behind the scenes machinations.
And when it comes to Linux, its biggest asset is also its biggest problem. But it has come a long way in the past ten years even with that.
As to the Ubuntu + Amazon partnership, that was a despicable thing to do. And here comes the community's biggest asset working: they can just leave and use another distro, problem solved. That's probably why they have since turned that option off by default, because another distro is gaining widespread recognition - Linux Mint. Now compare that with Microsoft's arrogance and lack of options in Windows 10.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hueristic
ADDED:
BTW EdgeOf Blade I think you meant Oblivious.
Quote:
*The average human being had a normal day obvious to the anti-Microsoft knee jerking.
You proved my point. Look at it from a consumer perspective - not server, not government, not supercomputers / R&D, etc.
Is there a central go to Linux for the masses that has anywhere near the support Windows does? The answer is no. The programs on them are "almost" as good, and that simply doesn't cut it for many people. Sure there are a million distros based off ubuntu and I do regularly use Lubuntu myself but do not kid yourself and ignore that the sheer lack of support & direction is what kills Linux from ever having a chance of taking mass market share in the consumer space.
Exactly.
I'd love to see Linux as a whole compete as an actual alternative but it's going to take a lot of changes in the linux community itself. Ever since I've started using a PC I've heard how Linux will be beating out Windows, etc. I've been hearing it for so many, many years and while they've made progress it's got a long way to go. The fact that even Valve couldn't get linux gaming really off the ground just goes to show the resistance to people moving to the platform.
Debian. Some hate it, but the stable branch gets something like 5 years of support and updates. Its the base for many other distros, it works with Steam, it has broad hardware/driver support.
Need a fast/light UI? Pick LXDE for a Windows XP like GUI and minimal memory footprint.
Want a modern UI? Use Gnome or KDE.
Thank you for calling that out. A little pissed that I missed that.
I'm sorry, how does my list fail to illustrate how people dogpile when it comes to Microsoft. Hell, if I wanted to see a dogpile of irrelevant opinions, I'd read an Amazon review for a Tom Cruise movie.
Or I could just come to Overclock.net and read self-righteous partisans type "Micro$oft, har har har" and pat themselves on the back all day.
Have you guys actually read the source article on hackernoon. It's not at all about how Microsoft tries to make it harder by making overly complex software.
Its really all about how adding features to software gets harder and harder the bigger your software gets. This is what causes office to be so hard to imitate.
Its a piece of software that has grown very complex over its life and is thus pretty hard to build compatibility with.
As for the part that has been quoted above the context of it is that if Microsoft where to build a new webapp from scratch it would be almost impossible to achieve full compatibility with word and the infrastructure they support. Lets be honest here what company would willingly throw away their whole business model to just be an inferior version of google docs.
I am not saying that Microsoft is the nicest company in the world or anything like that but I still have to disagree with pulling an article out of context like this.
Everyone always sits here and blames MS. Sure, they are not exactly guilt free by any stretch but it's 2017 and Linux is still in infancy. Besides Ubuntu (which has it's own spyware and bloat issues) what could even hope to compete with Windows?
Linux has a million different heads bickering back and forth about which is best and no sign of ever changing. If the linux community wants it to do better then they need to get behind a single product and support it. Even on the most well known distro's support is just not there for a lot of products and this needs to change. There is to much work for the simple things. AMD/Nvidia drivers are still a joke in Linux, etc.
Aka, there is a lot more besides MS holding linux back.
Phones, routers, switches, servers, supercomputers, TV's, microwaves, fridges, ebook readers, ATM's all run Linux. The list of products that run Linux is endless, whereas Windows is limited to mostly PC's (home and office) and relatively small servers (compared with the supercomputers that run Linux).
I agree that Linux is no Windows replacement but the way M$py are going about Windows the sooner Linux finally takes over the better it will be for all of us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KarathKasun
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoloCamo
You proved my point. Look at it from a consumer perspective - not server, not government, not supercomputers / R&D, etc.
Is there a central go to Linux for the masses that has anywhere near the support Windows does? The answer is no. The programs on them are "almost" as good, and that simply doesn't cut it for many people. Sure there are a million distros based off ubuntu and I do regularly use Lubuntu myself but do not kid yourself and ignore that the sheer lack of support & direction is what kills Linux from ever having a chance of taking mass market share in the consumer space.
Exactly.
I'd love to see Linux as a whole compete as an actual alternative but it's going to take a lot of changes in the linux community itself. Ever since I've started using a PC I've heard how Linux will be beating out Windows, etc. I've been hearing it for so many, many years and while they've made progress it's got a long way to go. The fact that even Valve couldn't get linux gaming really off the ground just goes to show the resistance to people moving to the platform.
Debian. Some hate it, but the stable branch gets something like 5 years of support and updates. Its the base for many other distros, it works with Steam, it has broad hardware/driver support.
Need a fast/light UI? Pick LXDE for a Windows XP like GUI and minimal memory footprint.
Want a modern UI? Use Gnome or KDE.
Everyone always sits here and blames MS. Sure, they are not exactly guilt free by any stretch but it's 2017 and Linux is still in infancy. Besides Ubuntu (which has it's own spyware and bloat issues) what could even hope to compete with Windows?
Linux has a million different heads bickering back and forth about which is best and no sign of ever changing. If the linux community wants it to do better then they need to get behind a single product and support it. Even on the most well known distro's support is just not there for a lot of products and this needs to change. There is to much work for the simple things. AMD/Nvidia drivers are still a joke in Linux, etc.
Aka, there is a lot more besides MS holding linux back.
Don't know of any spyware in Linux, but I refuse to use linux Mint because of how they added their own custom search plugin and removed the Google search engine from Firefox. I also don't like forks because it mostly ends up being just another polished turd.
On the other hand I hope to see the Android desktop operating system replace Linux for the home user. and I'm almost 100% certain it will happen in the next few years, with RemixOS and PheonixOS gaining popularity. At least no one can fk with Google Play apps and create 10 different package managers and 20 variations of the play store. In fact I plan to replace my Windows/Linux dual boot laptop with Android x86 once it's matured enough and hopefully I will never have to look back at Linux ever again.
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