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[FB/BR] Tesla Becomes Most Valuable US Automaker. You Can't Afford To Ignore This Stock. - Page 27

post #261 of 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avonosac View Post

/s
You're right, I don't think I could refute any of your claims at all.
/s
Since you don't know, the batteries in Tesla's are over provisioned. They do degrade, but considering the available capacity is digitally controlled you don't experience the loss as perceptibly. There is also a much larger margin for error, as some cells degrade at different rates, so in the case of a phone a particularly bad battery would degrade much faster giving you the impression that is the overall degradation rate for the technology. Additionally, since the circuits are all managed you get wear leveling on the cells themselves originally developed for the car storage, this is how the power walls and infrastructure storage can extend the life of the cells with no chemistry changes.
I explained the degradation above, but to address the second point, the solution to the extended life is not possible on cell phones because the circuits battery management systems are too primitive. This is compounded by the fact that there is one battery with 1 or perhaps a small single digit number of cells to wear level across, meaning even a 2% discharge does roughly the same damage as a 80% discharge between charges.
We are aware. However, as with the above posts you seem to want everything to make sense anecdotally instead of scientifically. Unfortunately, that isn't how technology and engineering work.

Just because every solution doesn't scale (down in this case) to your desired level, or the place you believe is foundational to the concept doesn't mean its invalid, it just means you made an error in an assumption for your hypothesis or your anecdotal understanding of the process is flawed.

People have been showing you links to read and understand, you however have just been ramping up the ad hominem attacks and metaphorically sticking your head in the sand screaming "I CAN'T HEAR YOU, I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!".

I don't like making these direct statements towards individuals, but you don't have an open or inquisitive enough mind to follow up and try to learn from these discussions, you're just looking for a pulpit from which to broadcast your world view, factually incorrect statements be damned. This is not helpful in the discourse.

Tell you what, I'll help you out. Since you don't find any value in my comments (and obviously simply can't accept any other POV than your own) why don't you simply click my name, scroll down, and click "Block User" and do us both a favor? I've already laid out plenty of reasons why I believe EV's are not anywhere near ready to replace ICE cars in the near future (poor range, long recharge times, infrastructural inadequacies, issues with cold weather, expense, etc) but you seem to be the one sticking your head in the sand and ignoring any of those things. This conversation is going no where so we should just agree to disagree and leave it at that. We both have a right to our own opinions no matter how much we might think the other is wrong, but that's just how forums work.

For the record, I am not interested in shutting down the progression of EV's and I think there are many people that can and do benefit from them. All I said was that they are not for me, and that they are still a very niche part of the vast automotive market. How can you deny either of those opinions? I'll quote sierraclub.org for you here:
Quote:
Despite their strong sales momentum, EVs still make up only about 1 percent of total U.S. auto sales, and there have been challenges bringing EVs into the mainstream.
http://www.sierraclub.org/compass/2017/01/2016-us-electric-vehicle-sales-soar-jumping-80-percent-over-previous-december-and-37
post #262 of 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

Tell you what, I'll help you out. Since you don't find any value in my comments (and obviously simply can't accept any other POV than your own) why don't you simply click my name, scroll down, and click "Block User" and do us both a favor? I've already laid out plenty of reasons why I believe EV's are not anywhere near ready to replace ICE cars in the near future (poor range, long recharge times, infrastructural inadequacies, issues with cold weather, expense, etc) but you seem to be the one sticking your head in the sand and ignoring any of those things. This conversation is going no where so we should just agree to disagree and leave it at that. We both have a right to our own opinions no matter how much we might think the other is wrong, but that's just how forums work.

For the record, I am not interested in shutting down the progression of EV's and I think there are many people that can and do benefit from them. All I said was that they are not for me, and that they are still a very niche part of the vast automotive market. How can you deny either of those opinions? I'll quote sierraclub.org for you here:
http://www.sierraclub.org/compass/2017/01/2016-us-electric-vehicle-sales-soar-jumping-80-percent-over-previous-december-and-37

1% is alot... Wouldn't think that they would have gaing so much so fast.
post #263 of 270
1% IS great for a fledgling technology fraught with disadvantages (and that number is helped significantly by outside factors that have nothing to do with the cars themselves like government incentives and "eco-awareness" etc). But ICE still holds 99% and that advantage won't be evaporating in just ten years like you seem to think (unless we get much more government intrusion into the market). Let the technology stand on its own merits and we'll see how things go. But governments and ideologues can never seem to just let the markets sort themselves out; they simply have to stick their hands into everything...
post #264 of 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

1% IS great for a fledgling technology fraught with disadvantages (and that number is helped significantly by outside factors that have nothing to do with the cars themselves like government incentives and "eco-awareness" etc). But ICE still holds 99% and that advantage won't be evaporating in just ten years like you seem to think (unless we get much more government intrusion into the market). Let the technology stand on its own merits and we'll see how things go. But governments and ideologues can never seem to just let the markets sort themselves out; they simply have to stick their hands into everything...

More will evaporate when those model 3s start being delivered lol.

They are gonna evaporate from Germany very fast too lol
post #265 of 270
I'm just glad we still appear to be living in a renaissance of ICE greatness today. 300hp midsize sedans have become the norm and you can now buy Mustangs and Camaros with well over 400hp for around $30k! Turbo technology has become flawless with twin scroll designs (and better computer management) that allow cars to achieve high hp with smaller engines that can get great mileage when driven sedately. And diesels are now very easy to live with, eschewing the horrid reputation they earned back in the 80's and 90's. Today is truly a great time to be in the market for a new car as you have so many choices still available to you, from heavy duty pickups with 800 ft/lbs of torque, to 300hp family sedans that can get 30mpg, to 400+hp muscle cars that actually can handle, to (yes) intriguing EV's like the Tesla's, which have rewritten the record books in terms of acceleration times.

You see, I like CHOICE, and today we have it in abundance. I just don't want that to come to an end.
post #266 of 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

Fair enough. But here's a hypothetical for you: Suppose the EV crowd's wet dream of EV's for everyone came true and Tesla led the way like Apple and Samsung do. Do you think they'd give any more of a darn about longevity than Apple or Samsung do now? Something to ponder.

You're absolutely right and I think a lot of people are PART blindly throwing their money towards Tesla. They can put their money where they want though, many believe investing and purchasing Tesla means taking a step towards sustainability and renewable energy. Nothing will ever change or improve if nobody takes action & nobody invests into something promising.

As for longevity, that article and others hint that longevity is one of their goals. At the very least we already know these cars do not have as much routine maintenance to deal with. Using Apple and Samsung as example, when they first became popular, they released some very sturdy products that had the longevity. I still have an iPod video from 2007 that will play audio for about 12 hours. Considering the spinning drive and even older rechargeable battery tech, it just shows that longevity is one of those things companies end up creating as a side effect of bursting into the market. They wanted to ensure these products did not fail because they wanted to make a name for themselves, so they put extra time into quality control. Tesla has to prove a lot with the Model 3, I have no reason to believe quality control & longevity will not be of utmost importance to them.
post #267 of 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

Fair enough. But here's a hypothetical for you: Suppose the EV crowd's wet dream of EV's for everyone came true and Tesla led the way like Apple and Samsung do. Do you think they'd give any more of a darn about longevity than Apple or Samsung do now? Something to ponder.

Yes they would or else their 8 year warranty on batteries will cost them millions in replacement.

I have heard Ev owners suggesting other people get Evs. You might want to stop making things up. I am interested in EVs and never suggested anyone to get an Ev.
My brother is not interested in Evs and I have never tried to convince him otherwise.
post #268 of 270
Figured I would descend back into the madness to share this link.

If you are into cars, you know who this is.



EDIT:

I think what Christian says in the interview is nearly perfect for at least myself and how I feel about driving.
Edited by PostalTwinkie - 4/28/17 at 12:45pm
    
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post #269 of 270
Telsa stock has matured too much without a new market entry. I don't see the company growing in profit unless it expands it's market and becomes more accessible.

Yes they've always sold solar panels and system, but they need a new market to enter.
Edited by SpeedyVT - 4/28/17 at 5:11pm
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post #270 of 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by budgetgamer120 View Post

Yes they would or else their 8 year warranty on batteries will cost them millions in replacement.

I have heard Ev owners suggesting other people get Evs. You might want to stop making things up. I am interested in EVs and never suggested anyone to get an Ev.
My brother is not interested in Evs and I have never tried to convince him otherwise.

Not in any way attempting to talk you out of buying a Tesla. From what you've said about how you intend to use it I can only assume that you will be very happy with it. Don't get me wrong, there are absolutely positives to owning an EV (especially a Tesla with their outrageous speed) including not needing to buy gas, convenience of charging at home, massive tax incentives, and other ancillary positives such as being allowed to use HOV lanes in urban areas (would be really nice in my hometown of the A-T-L). That said, the negatives (for me) are simply non-starters and that's all I've been trying to say, but you and others have spent the whole thread trying to convince me that those negatives do not exist and that my opinion about EV's is wrong. As I said earlier, let's just agree to disagree and leave it at that. I truly hope you enjoy your Tesla and that it proves to be just as reliable and convenient for you as you expect it to be. I've already said that it is absolutely a technologically impressive vehicle that I'd absolutely love to own as a secondary car if I were rich (the Model S anyway) and that I love the styling and performance, but as an only car I just couldn't accept the limitations inherent with EV technology in its current state.

That, and the the politics of EV's and the attempts to force them down our throats (by agenda driven ideologues, not you personally) really aggravates me...
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