Overclock.net › Forums › Cooling › Water Cooling › Moving From ITX to ATX for Better Temps - Worth It & Case Suggestions?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Moving From ITX to ATX for Better Temps - Worth It & Case Suggestions?

post #1 of 9
Thread Starter 
I currently have a CPU only loop in a Fractal Design Define Nano S and have finally decided to keep the 4790k and rebuild for fun instead of a full blown Ryzen upgrade. I know it's kind of a waste, but I haven't done a full rebuild in years and the itch is too strong. I've been kind of spinning my wheels the last 2 weeks trying to plan this out, trying to decide on a case first and then fill in the rest of the blanks.

So I'm planning to move to ATX or mATX, I still don't want a huge huge case dimension-wise but I'm looking forward to being able to fit more rads and build for more aesthetics than just cramming stuff into a smaller ITX build. I'm looking for some feedback on:
  • Rad Space vs Temps
  • mATX vs ATX
  • Case Suggestions

Rad Space vs Temperature

Currently I have a slight overclock on my i7-4790k @ 4.6 (1.19v) in a CPU only loop with a 240mm XSPC radiator. With the XSPC Raystorm block it's giving me temps of 70-74 while rendering in Adobe Premiere. I'd like to bring those temps down so I can either run cooler or up the OC. I will be adding in an RX 480 (or 580, tbd) to the loop for aesthetic/silence purposes, and hoping to find a case that can fit at the bare minimum 2x240mm radiators, ideally probably 1x360 and 1x240. Will just adding this extra rad space give me greatly lower temps.. What-ish can be expected (ik there's a million other variables and will probably go for a new CPU block bc I don't like the look of the Raystorm).

mATX vs ATX

I have zero intentions of ever going SLI/crossfire, but will be grabbing a used Z97 board which should help OC a bit better than my Z87 ITX. I don't like enormous cases, but definitely want to try a build here where I don't need to worry too much about space, clearances, etc. I was thinking mATX would be better space-wise, but since I'm buying used they are harder to come by and generally less examples to go by. Any pros/cons I need to be aware about on this decision aside from the obvious PCI slots/size?

Case Suggestions

Leaning a few ways here; Essentially I want at least 2x240mm radiators, space for (1) HDD, 1 SSD, and for once I'd like to not worry about "this fits when dremeling out 'x'", PSU extension cables cause bulge in side panel, etc. I've been thinking about some of these cases:
  • Phanteks Evolv - mATX version seems perfect but finicky about fitting 2x240mm radiators, otherwise ATX works but on the large/expensive side
  • Corsair 350D - Seems to be a great fit for mATX, nice compact size but not sure if other limitations?
  • inWin 303 - Can fit 2x360 rads if using mATX but not sure I like the way the PSU/rad portion takes up the top half.. looks kinda goofy
post #2 of 9
Negative for evolve is airflow... it is pretty restrictive.

I do like the matx form factor. I built in the fractal arc mini r2, and its a good case. Although a little small for fitting a lot of radiator. I used a thick 56mm 240 push/pull, and a 200mm rad in the front with a 180 Silverstone fan. This let me keep the 5.25 bays which I mounted a bay res/d5 pump combo.

The 200 on front required drilling some screw holes, and minor clearancing for a shroud between the case and 180 fan.

If you remove the 5.25 bays, you can fit a 360 on top with a 240 in front. The airflow is good in the case, with much less restriction than done cases.

As for smaller atx cases, I like the phanteks enthoo pro-m and thermaltake x31. They offer good flexibility and airflow at a decent budget without being very large.

I just finished a build in the thermaltake v21 cube which I used to replace my fractal arc mini that I felt was a little small. I had purchased another 200mm radiator on eBay for cheap and wanted to use it instead of the 240, which I couldn't fit in the fractal.

The x31 is very wide for a mid tower, which will give good clearance for 140mm based radiators. People epithet like or hate the styling, but I like it for a utility purpose.

The pro-m shares many features with the evolve, but has better airflow different styling.

There are many cases that will easily fit 2x240 radiators without modification.
post #3 of 9
Thread Starter 
Thanks for that good response man! Really wish microcenter carried Phanteks stuff, would be nice to see in person before I decide but oo well.

Was cruising around reddit and somebody literally just pointed out the Phanteks Pro-M.. Seems like a great deal for $80 bucks and I believe they even have a tempered glass version out (been wanting to try that). I really don't love it's look, but I mean I guess I don't really ever stare at the front panel of a case biggrin.gif. Kinda looks similar to the way a Corsair 350D is layed out.

The damn Evolv just looks so nice, I love the aluminum but if for $180+ I'd still be sacrificing with it then I'll have to fall out of love with it's design. Saving almost $100 on the case would allow me to not feel guilty about chasing custom bracket / riser prices and mounting the GPU vertically too.
post #4 of 9
I'm moving from ITX to mATX myself over the next few days. Switching from a Raven RVZ02 case to a Fractal Design Define Mini C. I'd strongly suggest checking out that case. can support 2 240mm rads easily. I'm actually going with a 280mm rad in the case (EVGA CLC 280mm).

Reason for my switching from ITX - While the GPU itself gets cooled fairly well, the backplate and rest of the card gets fairly toasty. CPU is pretty much a furnace and runs up against (but doesnt quite hit) throttling temps. I'm actually keeping my ITX motherboard, dont see the reason in switching if it works perfectly fine, don't see why this wouldnt work in your situation too.

http://www.fractal-design.com/home/product/cases/define-series/define-mini-c
Console Killer
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 6700k @ 4.5GHz Asus Z170i Pro Gaming ITX MSI Gaming X GTX 1080 TI 16GB Corsair DDR4-3000MHz 15-17-17-35 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Samsung 950 Pro M.2 512GB Samsung 840 Evo 1TB Samsung 840 Evo 750GB Thermalright AXP-100 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 10 Home Acer XB271HU 165Hz GSYNC Logitech G710+ Corsair SF600 
CaseMouseAudioAudio
SilverStone RVZ02 Roccat Kone XTD Sennheiser Game-Zero Headset Klipsch R-15PM 2.0 Speakers 
  hide details  
Reply
Console Killer
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 6700k @ 4.5GHz Asus Z170i Pro Gaming ITX MSI Gaming X GTX 1080 TI 16GB Corsair DDR4-3000MHz 15-17-17-35 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Samsung 950 Pro M.2 512GB Samsung 840 Evo 1TB Samsung 840 Evo 750GB Thermalright AXP-100 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 10 Home Acer XB271HU 165Hz GSYNC Logitech G710+ Corsair SF600 
CaseMouseAudioAudio
SilverStone RVZ02 Roccat Kone XTD Sennheiser Game-Zero Headset Klipsch R-15PM 2.0 Speakers 
  hide details  
Reply
post #5 of 9
Here's the list from my research for water cooling candidates that are specifically mATX.. it has case dimensions + radiator support and how many slots it has in mATX. The ones with ** I have actually build in.

MATX Case: (HxDxW)
* In Win 301 (380x370x188) 2x240 ITX Only - else 1x240 (4 slot, probably not optimal airflow - great HTPC case)
** Air 240 (397x260x320) 2x240 in ITX Only (4slot)
* Node 804: (307x389x344) 3 x 240 (5slot, older design)
* Define C Mini (399x399x210) 280 front, 240 top, 120 rear
* Corsair 350D mATX (440x450x210) - 2x280 front+top (5slot)
* Thermaltake Core V21 (336x424x320) 3x240 (5slot, cheap looking, horizontal motherboard is great)
* Fractal Design Arc Mini R2 (405x484x210) - 240 front, 360 top (4slot, old design)
* Phanteks Evolv mATX (450x400x230) - front 240, top 280 (top airflow restricted)

Compact ATX but very suitable for mATX
** In Win 303 (500x480x215) - top 420, bottom 420/360, rear 120 (White/Black)
* Air 540 (458x415x332) - front 360/280, top 280, bottom 280?, 120 rear (yuk drive bays)

And with these you might as well go ATX motherboard but still not large:
* Define R5 (451x521x231) - top 420, front 360, 240 bottom (White/Black/Titanium)
** Define S (451x520x233) - top 420, front 360/280, 140 rear
* Corsair 450D (497x494x210) - front+top 360/280, bottom 240, rear 120 ! Open Front, 60-80mm clearance until memory
* Corsair 400C or 400Q (464x425x215) - 280 or 360 front + squeeze top 240 (quite ugly really)
* Define C (440x399x210) - 360/280 front, 240 top, 120 rear
* Phanteks P400S (465x470x210) - 360 front, 240 top - poor airflow from front
     
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
5820K @ 4.4Ghz MSI X99A SLI Plus EVGA Geforce 1080 SC Kingston HyperX Fury 4x8Gb 2666Ghz 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Samsung 950 Pro 256Gb Samsung 840 Evo 250Gb Sandisk Ultra II 960Gb EK XRES 14​0 Revo D5 ​PWM pump +​ res 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK X99 Supremacy EVO waterblock (Full Nickel) 5x EK 140mm Vardar F1 fans 3x EK 120mm Vardar F1 fans Hardware Labs GTS X-Flow 420 Radiator 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Hardware Labs GTS 360 White Radiator Aquaero 6LT pump / fan controller EK 1080 Full Cover Block (Nickel / Acetal) Windows 10 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Asus PG279Q ROG Swift 27.0" Corsair K70 RGB Corsair RM650x In Win 303 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
Zowie FK2 Zowie P-SR Dragonfly DAC Oppo PM3 Planar Closed Headphone 
Other
NZXT Hue+ RGB controller / LEDs 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4690K @ 4.5Ghz Gigabyte GA Z97N Wifi (ITX) EVGA Geforce 1060 SC 3Gb G.Skill Ripjaws 2x8Gb DDR3-2400 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 840 EVO 250Gb Seagate Barracuda 1TB 7200RPM 2x EK 120mm Vardar F1 (radiator) fans 2x 140mm Silent Wings 3 (case) fans 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Aquaero 5LT pump/fan controller & sensors Hardware Labs GTS 240 Radiator EK D5+140 Pump/Reservoir EK Supremacy EVO CPU waterblock 
CoolingCoolingOSKeyboard
EK Thermosphere Generic GPU waterblock EK Duraclear tubing & fittings Windows 10 Logitech K400 Plus Wireless Keyboard 
PowerCaseAudio
Silverstone Strider Platinum 750W Fractal Design Define Nano S Arcam IrDac 
  hide details  
Reply
     
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
5820K @ 4.4Ghz MSI X99A SLI Plus EVGA Geforce 1080 SC Kingston HyperX Fury 4x8Gb 2666Ghz 
Hard DriveHard DriveHard DriveCooling
Samsung 950 Pro 256Gb Samsung 840 Evo 250Gb Sandisk Ultra II 960Gb EK XRES 14​0 Revo D5 ​PWM pump +​ res 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
EK X99 Supremacy EVO waterblock (Full Nickel) 5x EK 140mm Vardar F1 fans 3x EK 120mm Vardar F1 fans Hardware Labs GTS X-Flow 420 Radiator 
CoolingCoolingCoolingOS
Hardware Labs GTS 360 White Radiator Aquaero 6LT pump / fan controller EK 1080 Full Cover Block (Nickel / Acetal) Windows 10 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Asus PG279Q ROG Swift 27.0" Corsair K70 RGB Corsair RM650x In Win 303 
MouseMouse PadAudioAudio
Zowie FK2 Zowie P-SR Dragonfly DAC Oppo PM3 Planar Closed Headphone 
Other
NZXT Hue+ RGB controller / LEDs 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4690K @ 4.5Ghz Gigabyte GA Z97N Wifi (ITX) EVGA Geforce 1060 SC 3Gb G.Skill Ripjaws 2x8Gb DDR3-2400 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingCooling
Samsung 840 EVO 250Gb Seagate Barracuda 1TB 7200RPM 2x EK 120mm Vardar F1 (radiator) fans 2x 140mm Silent Wings 3 (case) fans 
CoolingCoolingCoolingCooling
Aquaero 5LT pump/fan controller & sensors Hardware Labs GTS 240 Radiator EK D5+140 Pump/Reservoir EK Supremacy EVO CPU waterblock 
CoolingCoolingOSKeyboard
EK Thermosphere Generic GPU waterblock EK Duraclear tubing & fittings Windows 10 Logitech K400 Plus Wireless Keyboard 
PowerCaseAudio
Silverstone Strider Platinum 750W Fractal Design Define Nano S Arcam IrDac 
  hide details  
Reply
post #6 of 9
You do know the Nano S can support more radiators.
http://www.fractal-design.com/home/product/cases/define-series/define-nano-s-window
Quote:
Water cooling compatibility - Radiators

Front – 120/240mm, 140/280mm (max width 147, length 312; some radiators extend beyond the screw holes)
Top – 120/240mm (max component height on motherboard 35mm. Big heatsinks on RAM or power regulators around CPU could conflict with this restriction)
Bottom – 120mm (max thickness & length: 85mm x 160mm)

Some have had success with a 120mm rad on the rear exhaust.

Then again, someone else had a similar issue as you with temps and dual radiators:
https://www.reddit.com/r/watercooling/comments/5ykcjg/first_custom_loop_done_nano_s_w_240280_rad/deriyli/

If I were to go ATX, I would go with the Define C (360 + 240) or Mini C (280 + 240)
post #7 of 9
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by equilni View Post

You do know the Nano S can support more radiators.
http://www.fractal-design.com/home/product/cases/define-series/define-nano-s-window

If I were to go ATX, I would go with the Define C (360 + 240) or Mini C (280 + 240)

Yea I know an additional 240 rad can fit up on the top as long as the memory is somewhat low profile (which mine is), but this is mostly coming from wanting to build a new build... I wanted to build entirely new and go Ryzen, but the 4790k is still top tier and I decided to keep it and just rebuild into a new larger case mainly for 'fun'.

The Mini C was my very first idea, as I really do love the Fractal Design Define series, couldn't recommend it enough. But I think I want to try something new, maybe a little different than the sleek black typical box that the Define series runs.

I think I've slowly convinced myself that I want to give the InWin 303 a try. Either going 420 on top (with modding) or 2x 360mm radiators for overkill and silence. I usually don't enjoy the flashy builds, but it grew on me and is a cheap way to try out a nice tempered glass case for like $80-$90.

Thanks everybody though, great recommendations on here!
post #8 of 9
My memory wasn't low profile enough, I had to notch the fan housings a bit and run those two fans in pull configuration - no way to get the fans above the radiator and the radiator definitely hit the ram. So it was either notch the fans a bit or take the Dremel to the heatspreaders on a set of $200+ RAM. Fans lost. I'd rather not run the fans in pull, but that's what I have. Black Ice Nemesis 240 GTS FWIW, 280 GTS in the front. And that rad was too wide, had to drill the rivets out holding that divider plate in there and move it over about 1/2" and re-rivet.
X-Rig
(14 items)
 
Death Bomb
(9 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
I7-5960X Asus Rampage V Extreme 1502 EVGA Titan X EVGA Titan X 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
G.Skill F4-3000C15Q-32GRK Samsung SM951 M.2 Samsung 850 Pro 512GB Pioneer BDR-2209 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
EKWB Blocks, Fans, and Pumps, HW Labs Black Ice... Windows 10 Pro Retail BenQ BL3201PH Max Keyboard Nighthawk X8 
PowerMouse
EVGA 220-P2-1200-X1 Roccat Kone Pure Optical 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
I7-7700K De-lidded @ 5GHz Asus Strix Z270i Nvidia Titan Xp G. Skill F4-3600C15D-16GTZ 
Hard DriveCoolingOSPower
2X Samsung 690 Pro 512GB M.2 EK Supremacy EVO CPU. Titan Xp Full Cover w/Ba... Windows 10 Pro 64 Bit SeaSonic X750 
Case
Fractal Nano S 
  hide details  
Reply
X-Rig
(14 items)
 
Death Bomb
(9 items)
 
 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsGraphics
I7-5960X Asus Rampage V Extreme 1502 EVGA Titan X EVGA Titan X 
RAMHard DriveHard DriveOptical Drive
G.Skill F4-3000C15Q-32GRK Samsung SM951 M.2 Samsung 850 Pro 512GB Pioneer BDR-2209 
CoolingOSMonitorKeyboard
EKWB Blocks, Fans, and Pumps, HW Labs Black Ice... Windows 10 Pro Retail BenQ BL3201PH Max Keyboard Nighthawk X8 
PowerMouse
EVGA 220-P2-1200-X1 Roccat Kone Pure Optical 
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
I7-7700K De-lidded @ 5GHz Asus Strix Z270i Nvidia Titan Xp G. Skill F4-3600C15D-16GTZ 
Hard DriveCoolingOSPower
2X Samsung 690 Pro 512GB M.2 EK Supremacy EVO CPU. Titan Xp Full Cover w/Ba... Windows 10 Pro 64 Bit SeaSonic X750 
Case
Fractal Nano S 
  hide details  
Reply
post #9 of 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by pmarascal View Post

Yea I know an additional 240 rad can fit up on the top as long as the memory is somewhat low profile (which mine is), but this is mostly coming from wanting to build a new build... I wanted to build entirely new and go Ryzen, but the 4790k is still top tier and I decided to keep it and just rebuild into a new larger case mainly for 'fun'.

The Mini C was my very first idea, as I really do love the Fractal Design Define series, couldn't recommend it enough. But I think I want to try something new, maybe a little different than the sleek black typical box that the Define series runs.

I think I've slowly convinced myself that I want to give the InWin 303 a try. Either going 420 on top (with modding) or 2x 360mm radiators for overkill and silence. I usually don't enjoy the flashy builds, but it grew on me and is a cheap way to try out a nice tempered glass case for like $80-$90.

Thanks everybody though, great recommendations on here!
Yeah I hear you on wanting something new. I went from a CM Elite 130 to the Nano (before that were Macs and Antecs on the PC side).

Too bad you missed out on the 303 sale, if you had Prime... It's no longer available.
https://www.reddit.com/r/watercooling/comments/65weik/prime_members_can_get_the_in_win_303_for_5999/
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Water Cooling
Overclock.net › Forums › Cooling › Water Cooling › Moving From ITX to ATX for Better Temps - Worth It & Case Suggestions?