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[Guru3D] ASUS Radeon RX 580 STRIX review - Page 10

post #91 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tobiman View Post

Your 1060 is at 1860mhz stock. A 2100mhz OC puts it at slight over 10%. You aren't destroying any 580 unless it's a gameworks ridden game. Way too many of those around nowadays.
Duh, it's reaching far higher clocks than the average 480. This isn't the first time that considerably more power draw is needed for higher clocks. Polaris sweet spot is in the 1100 - 1200mhz range, after that it's exponential gains in power consumption for clock speed. Pascal would exhibit this as well if it weren't hard locked.
What you won't see is that the 580 multimedia and idle power consumption matches that of the 1060. Easy to forget that the 390 just last gen was consuming 120 more watts than a 970 on average and 20 more watts in multimedia.

What do you mean MY 1060, if you're referring to Zotac AMP, it boosts to 1771MHz (stock clocks) from there to 2050/2100MHz it's somewhere around 300MHz increase, not talking about memory which is 4GHz and can be clocked pretty easily to 4,5GHz, a 10% improvement you say? I don't know, but i'm pretty sure you'll end up on par with a 580, probably better in some cases, with far lower consumption and probably overall better temps, not to mention prices, 580s to match that overclocked 1060 will probably be at the very least 260€.
Edited by oxidized - 4/18/17 at 7:46pm
post #92 of 129
It is in line with what we expected.

I bet if overclocked more aggressively the power consumption will reach 290X levels.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post

With 32 ROPs, that was inevitable.
ATI was able to compete on more even footing with NVIDIA in those days than AMD is now.
They almost certainly did not have the yields to clock the 480s this high out of the gate, no matter what level of power consumption they were willing to accept. Most 580s are also almost certainly going to be more power efficient than most 480s at the same clocks.

Since the RX 480 is only 10% less expensive than the RX 580, I can't imagine recommending the former over the latter.


The last time they were in this situation was probably the 2900XT. GDDR4 had been unsuccessful. With GDDR5 they were able to pull it together with the 4850 and 4870, which were able to fight Nvidia's GTX 280 and 260 pretty well. They had a much smaller die size and could be almost as fast.

I suppose with Vega they could turn this around with HBM2 and the HBCC, but that depends on it being competitive.


The more I think about it, the more I think that the Fury X must have had 64 ROPS on purpose - this RX 480/580 with 2304 SP had 32 ROPs, versus 2816 SP and 64 ROP on the 290X/390X versus 4096 SP and 64 ROPs on the Fury X. I'm wondering with 96 ROPs if the Fury X might have turned out better - maybe even 128 ROPS. At the very least it may have helped at 4k it beat the 980Ti, which could be very useful.

It seems a "fixed" Fury X might have had:
  • A much better Hardware Scheduler (They didn't upgrade compared to the 290X)
  • Double the RBEs (at 128 ROPS rather than 64 and double the Z/Stencil ROPs)
  • Increase the triangle output compared to the 290X (Fury X saw no increase)
  • They should have gone with 8 stacks on the Fury X, which would have made it 8 GB (that's plenty)
  • The CUs themselves needed to be fixed to address GCN's Occupancy flaws

Vega won't have 8 high stacks, but with HBM2, 8 GB is going to be standard. I think that 8GB will be adequate, especially factoring in how Vega might be able to double effective VRAM on games that support it. WE may see a refresh with 16GB just like how they doubled VRAM on the 390X compared to the 290X.






Quote:
Originally Posted by LancerVI View Post

I'm tired of waiting.

I've been saying for months that I was waiting for Vega; but I'm getting tired of waiting. The performance is here now with a 1080ti. I don't want to buy it, but AMD is taking entirely too long.

Patience you say??? This is a hobby for me. You're essentially telling me to put my hobby on hold. It's not a need, it's a want. My patience for a "want" is limited and somewhat irrational, but again....it's a hobby.

I want to build now!!!

AMD better release some worth while information quick, fast and in a hurry or people like me are going to say screw it, hold their noses and buy nVidia.


We're expecting information next month. We may see a release in late May or June.







Quote:
Originally Posted by Mahigan View Post

Not a rebadge. It's able to hit 1400MHz to 1500MHz. It's been re-engineered. Same GPU, made slightly better.

That's not a rebadge.

I just wish they had done something like the 4870 > 4890, which saw improved design, a retimed chip, and modifications to the ASIC power distribution. I think that had they done this, we would have seen perhaps another 15% without too much more power consumption.
Edited by CrazyElf - 4/19/17 at 8:35am
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post #93 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by iRUSH View Post

For some reason Tech Of Tomorrow on YouTube said first quarter 2018.

Wasn't sure if he knew something else.


From the Q4 2016 conference transcript:
Quote:
Lisa Su - Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. - President and CEO

We provided our first performance preview of Vega GPUs earlier in the quarter in advance of the launch planned for the second quarter of this
year.

Yes, if you look at our product lineup in the first half of the year, I think we have Ryzen launching in early March, and then we will have Vega, our
enthusiast GPU, launching in the second quarter. And so as we go through the year, I think we are quite pleased with the performance that we are
seeing on both of those products.
And so we should see Ryzen doing very well in the high end as well as Vega. And by nature, since both of those high-end markets are markets that
we don't have significant presence today, there will be an opportunity to both gain share as well as increase attach rates in those markets.

As we go forward in the year, I think the expectations are that the product launches tend to be faster in the CG segment. In other words, from
launch to revenue ramp is faster because it's more consumer-based. So as we launch Ryzen in first quarter and Vega in second quarter, but then
the notebook and embedded in the second half, you would expect to see that reflected.

Q1 2017 earnings report and conference is scheduled for May 1, 2019
Edited by Slomo4shO - 4/18/17 at 11:44pm
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post #94 of 129
Reason why we havent given our money to Nvidia yet is to see if AMD can deliver. I certainly do not want to give Nvidia my money but if Vega fails and Nvidia's left with the only competitor who can match what we want, what other choice do we have?[/quote]
Unfortunately it seems most want vega just to bring down the price of pascal and if we look how taking 10% of intels server business would net amd more profits than 100% of the gaming gpu markets its easy to see were Lisa Su should put all the effort and has been. They should leave nvidia to the high end of gaming gpus and put all resources into apus/cpus and mid range gpus imo.
post #95 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by delboy67 View Post
Unfortunately it seems most want vega just to bring down the price of pascal and if we look how taking 10% of intels server business would net amd more profits than 100% of the gaming gpu markets its easy to see were Lisa Su should put all the effort and has been. They should leave nvidia to the high end of gaming gpus and put all resources into apus/cpus and mid range gpus imo.

Zen is a server part that is meant to compete directly with Intel's best and greatest at a much lower cost (performance of Intel's 1000 USD chip for a third of the price is amazing) but, sadly, you are right. There are many who just want AMD to compete so they can buy nVidia's next best for less (and make HJH's wardrobe very happy).

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post #96 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaC View Post

Consumes more than a GTX 1070 , GTX 1080, R9 380X, HD7970, or just under a 3 generation old GTX 780



Midrange card should be ~ 120-150W

The problem is that it is clocked beyond the efficiency point of GCN (i.e. past 1100MHz).

The six IR3555 are > 90% efficient up until 45A so it's not the VRM's fault.

----

Also see

http://www.legitreviews.com/amd-radeon-rx-480-undervolting-performance_183699

Polaris appears to be most efficient around 1.05V , typically around 1050-1100MHz.

This is a pretty big disadvantage, even a deal breaker, imo, but most reviewers glossed over this fact and barely mentioned it. Maybe reviewers think people buying mid-range GPUs have free electricity or something. Or maybe they are afraid of rabid AMD fanbase DDoSing their servers in the event of less than positive review.
post #97 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kokin View Post

Except no hard earned cash was paid in the first place. If money was put down on a pre-order and it failed to deliver on time, then sure he can be entitled all he wants. However, that's not the case. Nvidia products have been available for the past year, yet he "threatens" to buy Nvidia because his patience has run thin. What else would you call that?

With any hobby, it's always "pay to play". Nothing changes that and if he can't afford to buy 1080 or 1080Ti performance now, he's definitely not going to afford a Vega at launch price. It's not like AMD is going to release a holy grail product that will significantly lower Nvidia prices. It will be priced appropriately according to the performance offered and expecting otherwise is setting yourself up for disappointment.


That's where you're wrong. We earn $, money out of our pay pockets to spend on something. I am in the same situation as him. No desire to give Nvidia any of my money but if Vega doesnt deliver then i'll have no choice but to go Nvidia now. AMD has no suitable products meeting my expectations so who else do we go to? And going for a 1080Ti now, at least to me, is dumb when Volta is on the horizon.

Its not about choosing not affording the cheapest option like you insinuate but its about getting the maxima performance.
post #98 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickyvida View Post

That's where you're wrong. We earn $, money out of our pay pockets to spend on something. I am in the same situation as him. No desire to give Nvidia any of my money but if Vega doesnt deliver then i'll have no choice but to go Nvidia now. AMD has no suitable products meeting my expectations so who else do we go to? And going for a 1080Ti now, at least to me, is dumb when Volta is on the horizon.

Its not about choosing not affording the cheapest option like you insinuate but its about getting the maxima performance.

You do have a choice though , you could just not buy either
post #99 of 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by daviejams View Post

You do have a choice though , you could just not buy either

Oh yes, GPU life is infinite as well as performance too. i should just stay on my 390 from 2, coming to 3 years and watch it get bogged down as newer, stressing games come out and tax it. Or in the event of it going down i should just sit and stare at my Ryzen 1800x as though it will output video, too. rolleyes.gif
post #100 of 129
Seems like they made the RX480 worse. Yes, its slightly faster but the efficiency is lost...

My GTX 780 is about the same performance and same power efficiency and it was released in 2013.

The RX480, while performing similar, uses 80 watts less. If you want that performance on a budget, just look for a 780ti used. They go for under $300. If you want the efficiency, go for the 480. I don't see why anyone would want the 580 over it.
Edited by Slaughtahouse - 4/19/17 at 3:41am
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