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[universityherald] NVIDIA Will Unleash Volta-Based GPU (GTX 2080 Series) Soon to Counter AMD Radeon Vega [VIDEO] - Page 9

post #81 of 198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

The Radeons are not that much cheaper to justify such negative side affects. If consumers have to buy the next better PSU or invest more into cooling inside their case or the cards itself, it is not acceptable. The metric "best bang for the buck" is for cheapscates. Cheap buyers buy twice is a motto here. Should Volta even bring a few low- to mid-end cards into the race, AMD will have nothing to fight against this threat.

You do realize that any one of those will run on a 400-450w psu? No one will have to buy a new psu just for AMD cards. The only ones buying better psu's will be doing so regardless of amd/nvidia. I could be wrong ofc.....all of us could be running 250-300w psu's that came with our passive i3 dells.
post #82 of 198
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Originally Posted by ssgwright View Post

milking? if you want the best it's gonna cost you. You can go and buy a decent card that will play anything right now for under $300...

but nvidia is still milking and price gouging their customers, i don't see how you or anybody else can deny this... it's so blatant:rolleyes:
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post #83 of 198
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Originally Posted by maltamonk View Post

You do realize that any one of those will run on a 400-450w psu? No one will have to buy a new psu just for AMD cards. The only ones buying better psu's will be doing so regardless of amd/nvidia. I could be wrong ofc.....all of us could be running 250-300w psu's that came with our passive i3 dells.

I have seen enough overheating PCs in my life from users that got advice like yours. You would seriously attach a card like a RX580 with 180 to 250W power consumption (not TDP!) to a 400-450W PSU? This is seriously dangerous. The rest of your components would have no powerroom left, resulting in said PC to shut down at higher load or worse start to burn. This is even insane with 80+ quality PSU in this category. Most Computers out there have cheap China components built in.

The only category where it could work is with cards under 75 power consumpiton (=no power connector) like the GTX 750 Ti / 950 / 1050 Ti or RX460.

If you don't believe me, look it up at AMD themselves. They reccommend a 450W PSU for a new RX560(!).
https://www.amd.com/en/products/graphics/radeon-rx-560

Should Volta improve the efficiency more than Maxwell and Pascal did before, this could widen the difference between the Geforce and Radeons further. Playing on a i3 is not even working in newer games. Most of them are just Dual-Cores. Modern games will not even start there. In case it does the playing experience will be a stuttering hell. Ask all the notebook gamers how bad this feels. Lowest settings are no fun at all.

Get real hardware or invest your money into a console.
post #84 of 198
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Originally Posted by rcfc89 View Post

Does it? You clearly haven't played on a PS4 Pro on a good 4k TV. It's shockingly good. Uncharted 4 and Zero Dawn in 4k are the best looking games I've ever played. It makes a huge difference when things are properly optimized. I purchased the setup to hold me off a few month's until X299 dropped. Now I have no plans in the near future to build another PC. Have the games really gotten better graphically on PC the last couple years? No. But yet we have to have expensive rigs to max out these poorly optimized games for PC that were developed for Console. Keep telling yourself its worth all the money. You're being played.

I kind of agree with you, because I'm not someone that games with high refresh rate or even more than 60 fps, so a PS4 Pro with a 4K HDR TV to me can be pretty stunning and fills most of all my needs. But I have my PC to play Total War, Dawn of War 3 etc.

So I think people are being completely bent-over with this marketing that now says you should aim for a 1080 Ti if you're a hardcore PC gamer an, unbelievably, it's catching on. There's a gigantic thread on the 1080 Ti whichever forums I visit, it's mind-boggling as the cards cost £800 here in UK. EIGHT HUNDRED POUNDS. Yet somehow Nvidia marketing has convinced people spending that money on a card is justified.

At launch you could buy a 980 Ti for £550, and I thought that was way too expensive...
post #85 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

I have seen enough overheating PCs in my life from users that got advice like yours. You would seriously attach a card like a RX580 with 180 to 250W power consumption (not TDP!) to a 400-450W PSU? This is seriously dangerous. The rest of your components would have no powerroom left, resulting in said PC to shut down at higher load or worse start to burn. This is even insane with 80+ quality PSU in this category. Most Computers out there have cheap China components built in.

The only category where it could work is with cards under 75 power consumpiton (=no power connector) like the GTX 750 Ti / 950 / 1050 Ti or RX460.

If you don't believe me, look it up at AMD themselves. They reccommend a 450W PSU for a new RX560(!).
https://www.amd.com/en/products/graphics/radeon-rx-560

Should Volta improve the efficiency more than Maxwell and Pascal did before, this could widen the difference between the Geforce and Radeons further. Playing on a i3 is not even working in newer games. Most of them are just Dual-Cores. Modern games will not even start there. In case it does the playing experience will be a stuttering hell. Ask all the notebook gamers how bad this feels. Lowest settings are no fun at all.

Get real hardware or invest your money into a console.

Umm yeah. Some of those cards might be hitting 250w running Furmark, but not in normal use. If you looked into the reviews, total system power was well within a good 450w psu's capabilities. Remember we are no longer running power hungry systems. Systems have become remarkable in terms of efficiency. The recommendation of 1000+w monsters are gone with very few exceptions. Psu's availability has gone from 80+ to 80+ titanium. We are not stuck in the past where it was more of an issue. Besides AMD is notorious for over speccing recommended wattage. Everyone here should know that by now.

You should also look into the reviews about what happens with undervolting these cards. I doubt you will, but I thought I'd throw it out there
post #86 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascii Aficionado View Post

This means 1080 Ti prices will go down considerably, nice.

Volta cards should have such a high jump in Vram it won't be an issue for a long time considering the 1080 Ti has 11GB.


Volta first generation should have around 12GB G5X and 16GB for Titan. Dont expect too much.
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post #87 of 198
Why are we thinking we're gonna get yet another vram jump? We literally just got 8gb from Nvidia, I would expect 8gb again but faster, 12 again for the next titan, putting more vram on the cards is manufacturing waste, not even 4k uses more than 8gb vram yet
post #88 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shatun-Bear View Post


So I think people are being completely bent-over with this marketing that now says you should aim for a 1080 Ti if you're a hardcore PC gamer an, unbelievably, it's catching on. There's a gigantic thread on the 1080 Ti whichever forums I visit, it's mind-boggling as the cards cost £800 here in UK. EIGHT HUNDRED POUNDS. Yet somehow Nvidia marketing has convinced people spending that money on a card is justified.

At launch you could buy a 980 Ti for £550, and I thought that was way too expensive...

Fury X launched at the same price as the 980 Ti, they were both too expensive.

The 1080 Ti launched at $50 more than the 980 Ti. So about 8% more expensive in US dollars. Not sure why it would 45% more expensive over there unless currency fluctuation plays the biggest part.
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post #89 of 198
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Originally Posted by stealth80 View Post

Why are we thinking we're gonna get yet another vram jump? We literally just got 8gb from Nvidia, I would expect 8gb again but faster, 12 again for the next titan, putting more vram on the cards is manufacturing waste, not even 4k uses more than 8gb vram yet


Nope, I thought about 8 GB configuration and is just not possible unless Micron have some really big fast G5X coming out (I am talking about 16 gbps those standard). But no.


As of now, if they want to slap a 384 bits configuration just fast enough to feed all the hungry CUDA cores, 12GB has to be tied to it. Also there is only so much Nvidia can squeeze with memory compression.



Of cos 8GB configuration is possible with HBM in 512GB/s configuration. But nah, they arent coming to consumer space in Geforce yet when they haven show up in Titan.


Anyway for the past 3 generation, the next gen card always have more memory than the previous Ti. So its still a safe bet it will be 12 at least.
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post #90 of 198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

Are you kidding me? Those low- to mid-range cards consume more than the high- to enthusiast segment of both Nvidia or AMD. Yet they are way weaker. The RX400 series was already outsold many-times by Pascal and the 500-series is going to be worse than that. If you don't call that bad, you must be seriously downplay the actual situation. Looking at statistics only every 4th sold card is an AMD model. If we take it worse ever 5th. When we count Maxwell into the stats, Radeons are not even in the first 10th places anywhere.
The Radeons are not that much cheaper to justify such negative side affects. If consumers have to buy the next better PSU or invest more into cooling inside their case or the cards itself, it is not acceptable. The metric "best bang for the buck" is for cheapscates. Cheap buyers buy twice is a motto here. Should Volta even bring a few low- to mid-end cards into the race, AMD will have nothing to fight against this threat.

In case AMD dares to even rebrand Polaris again after their RX500-series stunt, even the hardcore AMD fans will leave their side.
No, 10-20% difference for almost the same price is not acceptable. I would say AMd sucks because they often fail to deliver at the right time. God only knows when the new Radeon cards will be even available. Every generation it takes them 2-3 months for available hardware after each paperlaunch. I doubt Vega is good enough to cover so much performance territory to fight the Pascal 1000 and upcoming Volta 2000-series. If AMD tries to attempt it, there will be huge gaps between Polaris and Vega.

I must admit, I am not happy with all the GP102 nonsense going on right now. Not even the richest idiots buy 2-3 Titan / TI class cards in such a short time period. To me it seems like Nvidia is clearing everything they have left of Pascal to make room for Volta. I also doubt there will be anything Volta related until Q4 2017 up to Q1 2018. Then Micron is said to have their GDDR6 in mass-production ready and we go from now 11Gbps GDDR5X to 16Gbps GDDR6. That alone is a huge jump, not to speak of the underlaying architecture.

Polaris is already running on fumes and HBM won't save Vega too. Hasn't worked with Fiji either. When the rumors about the 4GB / 8GB HBM2 Vega models are true, AMD can be ready for another generation of duds only absolute fanboys love to defend.
\

I think you're just considering the wrong segment... The RX 480 has a pretty fine value vs the GTX 1060.
This was the only review I could find:
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/73945-gtx-1060-vs-rx-480-updated-review-23.html
Things might have moved since but both card are pretty pretty much on par with the RX 480 having 1 extra memory GB for the lower end model.

As for the power consumption, it's pretty much the same:

https://www.back2gaming.com/reviews/b2g-hardware/hw-components/gpus/amd-radeon-rx-480-vs-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1060-head-head-1080p-showdown/

The 1060 has the lead but not by much. AMD is not that far but sadly, they can't perform on par and especially not in the efficiency domain. They're not doing as bad as you describe however.
I'd like to remind the fact that if there was no AMD, Nvidia wouldn't push so fast new goodies. I am rather disappointed by the success that the TI & Titan got not because I am a dirty fanboy but because I know this success will push forward this business model on both side. It's also not in AMD's interest to start a price war.
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Overclock.net › Forums › Industry News › Rumors and Unconfirmed Articles › [universityherald] NVIDIA Will Unleash Volta-Based GPU (GTX 2080 Series) Soon to Counter AMD Radeon Vega [VIDEO]