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[KitGuru] AMD Radeon RX Vega caught hiding in plain sight - Page 42

post #411 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lass3 View Post

Technically it's a refresh biggrin.gif

Worst refresh I've ever seen.

Thats quite a strong statement. Care to add any context?
post #412 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lass3 View Post

Technically it's a refresh biggrin.gif

Worst refresh I've ever seen.

It doesnt even deserve the refresh tag, thats how bad it is. Reflash is more like it.

1080 and 1060 at least had higher clocked memory.
post #413 of 664
RX 580 is LPP
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post #414 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by guttheslayer View Post

Polaris was the reason why titan could afford to go from $1000 to $1200. That indirectly also means all Nvidia lineup will scale up as well

By releasing a high end card every 2 years to me is a fail.

Of course this is one way to see it. For me it was the horrible power consumption and need for good coolers of the Rx500-series. Some posts in this very thread mentioned Polaris wouldn't compete with the high-end. Excuse me, but if small middle-class cards like the RX580 consumes as much power as an almost double as fast card like a 1080 Ti, then it is seriously a fail.

If you of course neclect such important point like many AMD fans usually do, anything can be considered not a fail. Yet then I expect to take the same methods for all brands and products, not just the favorite one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HanSomPa View Post

Also note that it's a failure to customers, not to AMD the company. The goals of AMD are different than their customers'.

Nice way to weasel around the issue. Hello .. Hello , anybody home. Think McFly, think!

If a company does not align to the wishes of th customers, they are not entitled to complain when the customers buy something else instead. Ironicall both the AMD management and the AMD fanboys claim it is the fault of the customer then. mad.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by AmericanLoco View Post

You're strawmanning my argument. I never said they wouldn't be influenced. I said products being released in 2017 will be the first products that could possibly be released totally under the current management - from conception to being on the store shelves. Any products AMD released prior to 2017 (Zen, Fiji, Polaris, APUs) would have been conceived under previous management.

AMD only changes the heads of their leadership. The rest of the higher positions are practically the same. Although there is a strange changing in positions going on there. In the end it is the same personal with a new title. Simple difference is what part of AMD they favor.

I tell you what. The CPU division was fighting for more power when the GPU side was somehow keeping the boat afloat for years. There was already a paradigm shift in the way AMD works. The managment still wanted to get their failes "future is fusion" dream going. They then had the glorious idea to go with HBM for both GPUs and CPUs / APUs.

That is the main budget what was going on for the RTG division and barely had crumbs left. The CPU side profits massively and invested the rest in Ryzen. Decisions like this were never in the last managements agenda. Rory Read wanted to heavily go into servers because he is a former IBM person. You can never plan 5-years ahead. Not in a fast changing environment like the IT-sector. As a company you have to always adapt to new situation. AMD right now is not able to react and hope they can skip some developments entirely. Let's see how this works out in the long run.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AmericanLoco View Post

I have not spoken of any "light". 3-4 years is NOT a lot of time to turn things around in the semiconductor industry, especially when your entire product portfolio is bad. Like I said, it takes 3-5 years for a brand new processor design to see the light of day. The reason why companies like Intel, Apple, Samsung, etc... can release new chips every 8-12 months is because they have multiple teams working on multiple products concurrently.
That's a nice theory, but the reality is the whole company was suffering long before that. Fiji and Hawaii both took ~2 years to come to market, and they were both released before the formation of RTG.

Go back to your comment and see for yourself what your "light" meant. Like I said, Bulldozer wanted to be more than it actually could accomplish. AMD often has this big pipedreams that burst in comparison with the more way on earh competion. Don't even dare to compare AMD with big-shots like Apple or Samsung. Their pocket money is bigger than AMD as a whole.

AMD has ever been a chaos company. In their long history they burned so much money, it is inexcusable. If they were back in the 90's in the same position they were today, AMD would have died the same death many other CPU/GPU manufacturers had at that time. However their strange position of underdog / no monopoly company brings them in cash they wouldn't deserve on their own.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

Believe me, there are armchair "experts" on every single subject you can think of on this board.

Indeed. I get so tired of all those "idiots" who don't even know what a fiscal year is, but every new financial result complain about the year would be wrong.

Thos are the same experts lecturing you on how to run a company or how you would not be more qualified than them. I did not spend over 12 years in business eductation to be lectured by infants like that.
post #415 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by caswow View Post


Sorry if i'm a bit late, but this score is clearly fabricated. According to the 3DMark Technical Guide (http://s3.amazonaws.com/download-aws.futuremark.com/3DMark_Technical_Guide.pdf), Time Spy scores are calculated as follows: Score=1/((0.85/Graphics Score) + (0.15/CPU Score)). Notice that 1/((0.85/10158)+(0.15/8233)) = 9813.8, which is nowhere near the score shown in the image (9753). Also, notice that the Vega result that is in the database is consistent with the way the score is calculated (1/((0.85/5721)+(0.15/7699)) = 5950.3, which rounds to the score in the image (5950)).
post #416 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

Nice way to weasel around the issue. Hello .. Hello , anybody home. Think McFly, think!

I don't think you understand how business works.
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post #417 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by HanSomPa View Post

I don't think you understand how business works.

Maybe I should remind you of the phrase:
The customer is boss..!

So, no matter what you think someone like me understands about business, this general rule always counts. And I am sad to say it, but AMD wasn't really great at satisfying customer demands as of late. Polaris was somewhere sub-par to OK-ish, yet not any bit faster than the 3-year old 290X. Everything above isn't really for sale anymore.

For the high-end missing for a year is not what customers want. If Vega is "just" as good as Pascal, it is not good enough either. 'Too little too late' could be the motto here.

All AMD had going for them was the price. Though I wonder how they want to pull this off this time when HBM2 is pulling their legs on the costs. If Nvidia engages in a priceware, it is unlikely seeing AMD able to do too. There would be a real good marketing stunt to sell customers hardware which performance wise could be had for roughly 6-12 months already.
Edited by Hardware Hoshi - 5/4/17 at 5:12am
post #418 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slomo4shO View Post

Welcome to Nvidia's product cycle post Fermi...

At least Nvidia is at the forefront of performance. rolleyes.gif although thier pricing is regretful and outright milking.
post #419 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

Maybe I should remind you of the phrase:
The customer is boss..!

You're not the only customer AMD has. Just because the Rx400 series does not meet the standards we are expecting here on overclock.net does not mean Polaris was a failure for AMD.
post #420 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majin SSJ Eric View Post

Vega was always designed to compete against Pascal, not Vega, otherwise they'd be releasing it late this year or early next year to match Volta's launch. Its been known for, oh, a year and a half that AMD was flipping their release schedule to bring mid range out first this generation and flag ship last which is why Polaris is the only thing we've gotten from them thus far. To be fair I don't think they expected Vega to take this long after Polaris but priority was obviously given to Ryzen and for good reason. If you assume Vega is competing with Volta then you are saying they simply decided to skip a flag ship release this generation which is silly. They are aiming for the product that is around now, not the one that won't be out until next year.

Yeah i didn't realise they called out Pascal on the Poor Volta ad rather than Volta which we all saw. :rolleyes:The truth is they skipped a flagship because they had nothing to offer on top of Polaris. And before you call me out on saying Nvidia has done it too, releasing mid range gpus before high end dies it's because they have no competition on the high end market hence they can bring out the mid range to milk before bringing out the high guns. With no competitor in the high end market, they have no incentive to bring out the big guns early. Vega was late and is late no matter the tacked up Q2 release date. In terms of GPU performance,If it's going up against ,and offering 1080Ti and below performance(minimum to compete with Volta), i'm sorry to say, it's a milestone that Nvidia has already passed last year on it's way to Volta. The only thing Vega might have on Nvidia then is pricing, assuming if it delivers that level of performance.
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