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[KitGuru] AMD Radeon RX Vega caught hiding in plain sight - Page 44

post #431 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickyvida View Post

Isn't it the only way to stop the Nvidia milking as you suggested? Since many people are buying Nvidia by the truckloads and AMD's stuff don't sell and thus have less money to pour into creating a competent GPU? rolleyes.gif

And you shouldn't blame customers for choosing what suits them. People buy Nvidia because they're the only ones capable of creating a gpu that performs at the forefront. biggrin.gif

Uninformed customers, which is vast majority, always bought NV more even when AMD was clearly the better choice. No difference now with Polaris vs 1060/1050ti. But I think things are changing slowly as more ppl are becoming aware of how things really stand. Hope it's not a little too late.
post #432 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ha-Nocri View Post

Uninformed customers, which is vast majority, always bought NV more even when AMD was clearly the better choice. No difference now with Polaris vs 1060/1050ti. But I think things are changing slowly as more ppl are becoming aware of how things really stand. Hope it's not a little too late.

There have been many times going back at least 5 years in which AMD wasn't clearly the better choice at product release. Sometimes it was only in hindsight that choosing AMD would have been the better choice.
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post #433 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ha-Nocri View Post

Uninformed customers, which is vast majority, always bought NV more even when AMD was clearly the better choice. No difference now with Polaris vs 1060/1050ti. But I think things are changing slowly as more ppl are becoming aware of how things really stand. Hope it's not a little too late.

Well, that was caused by AMD's bad reputation. Buying a product from a company with shaky image is not what the majority wants. Nvidia was more solid over the years and has earned some trust. Having a one-time wonder won't tip this for AMD. It needs continiuous good products to stay in the minds of the buyer.

Being the "cheaper alternativer almost as good" brand is not helping either. AMD wanted to get away from this image years ago, but are trapped in a vicious cycle. Their main purpose was to keep prices low with thier low-budget offerings. Now that their products are missing prices went up for a while.

Vega hopefully has at least the impact to normalize prices again. But with Nvidia's Volta already spoken about, the Sword of Damocles hangs dangerously above AMD's heads.

If Volta is even remotely a success as the 8800-generation was, price does not matter to many buyers.
post #434 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by CasualCat View Post

There have been many times going back at least 5 years in which AMD wasn't clearly the better choice at product release. Sometimes it was only in hindsight that choosing AMD would have been the better choice.

^

For Example the 680 vs 7970.

At Launch the 680 was faster than a 7970.

The 7970 wasn't even using GCN optimized drivers till a year later.

Now the 7970 compares to a gtx780 and the gtx680 can hardly keep up with a 7870.

Man do times change.

One of Nvidia's biggest problems back then was not putting enough vram in their cards. But i'm sure that they did it on purpose. Can't get people to upgrade their hardware if it just keeps working flawlessly.


Hell even the 290x didn't have perfect drivers at launch, but it was far from the 7970.


Problem with AMD now is their drivers are so solid for the most part. I actually have more problems with my current Nvidia card than I did with my old 290x. So Nvidia could learn a few things (one being update the ugly UI).



AMD Cards just age too well. They need to do what Nvidia does. Stop Optimizing for their old cards when a new series drops. Otherwise people will be too happy with their old cards.
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post #435 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ha-Nocri View Post

Uninformed customers, which is vast majority, always bought NV more even when AMD was clearly the better choice. No difference now with Polaris vs 1060/1050ti. But I think things are changing slowly as more ppl are becoming aware of how things really stand. Hope it's not a little too late.

Yes this is the case. And before the AMD fanboys call me out again, i preordered Ryzen, because it's performance was good enough to justify a purchase and because i support the underdog and want to see it take more marketshare.rolleyes.gif

Same goes for Vega. If it is competitive, i will buy it. but that doesn't mean i should blindly buy it because i support the underdog if it's performance is not worth justifying a purchase.
post #436 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hardware Hoshi View Post

Ok, so what? AMD didn't even admit Bulldozer was a failure until many years after its release.

Looking at the latest AMD financial results Polaris was a total failure. How else can you explain them to having lost high double digit millions again? The stocks had a massive 20% decline too because of this. Now please tell me how you want to sugarcoat this for AMD not being bad?

Did you even read AMD's earning results? The operating loss of their graphics group has decreased significantly since they launched Polaris. Granted I doubt the margins on Polaris are as stellar as nVidia's milking of the high end, but Polaris is slowing the bleeding while they continue to spend on R&D. This is why Vega is important for AMD (although not as important as Rysen).
post #437 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickyvida View Post

Isn't it the only way to stop the Nvidia milking as you suggested? Since many people are buying Nvidia by the truckloads and AMD's stuff don't sell and thus have less money to pour into creating a competent GPU? rolleyes.gif

And you shouldn't blame customers for choosing what suits them. People buy Nvidia because they're the only ones capable of creating a gpu that performs at the forefront. biggrin.gif

Don't blame another company after you spend money on what suits you.

Blame yourselves for pricing. I buy when something is worth buying. So I don't have the issues you big money spenders have.

I'm not buying Nvidias overpriced stuff and I'm not buying AMDs rebranded stuff.
post #438 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by budgetgamer120 View Post

Don't blame another company after you spend money on what suits you.

Blame yourselves for pricing. I buy when something is worth buying. So I don't have the issues you big money spenders have.

I'm not buying Nvidias overpriced stuff and I'm not buying AMDs rebranded stuff.

Yes yes, customers should be blamed for the high pricing and milking from Nvidia because of AMD's inability to create a gpu that can take away marketshare from Nvidia.

We hear you.
post #439 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by DzillaXx View Post

^

For Example the 680 vs 7970.

At Launch the 680 was faster than a 7970.

The 7970 wasn't even using GCN optimized drivers till a year later.

Now the 7970 compares to a gtx780 and the gtx680 can hardly keep up with a 7870.

Man do times change.

One of Nvidia's biggest problems back then was not putting enough vram in their cards. But i'm sure that they did it on purpose. Can't get people to upgrade their hardware if it just keeps working flawlessly.


Hell even the 290x didn't have perfect drivers at launch, but it was far from the 7970.


Problem with AMD now is their drivers are so solid for the most part. I actually have more problems with my current Nvidia card than I did with my old 290x. So Nvidia could learn a few things (one being update the ugly UI).



AMD Cards just age too well. They need to do what Nvidia does. Stop Optimizing for their old cards when a new series drops. Otherwise people will be too happy with their old cards.

Same thing will happen with RX 480 and GTX 1060, AMD card has more VRAM, it's priced well, and has better Vulcan / DX12 performance.
post #440 of 664
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nickyvida View Post

Yes yes, customers should be blamed for the high pricing and milking from Nvidia because of AMD's inability to create a gpu that can take away marketshare from Nvidia.

We hear you.

It makes sense. nVidia will price their product depending on the market. We are part of the market. As long as people are willing to pay 1200$ for X FPS more than the next card, they'll price their high end at 1200$. Don't expect AMD to always undercut nVidia. If Vega (pure fiction here) is 50% faster than Titan XP, expect AMD to price vega at or above 1200$ as well.
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