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[PCGamesN]AMD RX Vega’s pricing was “not just for launch, but ongoing”

9K views 172 replies 58 participants last post by  mdd1986 
#1 ·
Quote:
I spoke to AMD's Gerald Youngblood on the showfloor of Gamescom today about the struggles with both stock and pricing of Radeon graphics cards, and specifically about whether we were ever going to see Vega at its original launch price. So, how much does Vega really cost?

"Our SEPs, and the price tag that we announced," Youngblood says, "is our full intention of where we would suggest the product be priced. Not just for launch, but ongoing."

What happened, though, was we launched the product and the demand was really huge. Now we're focused on replenishing so that there is plenty of stock so we can encourage our partners to hit the SEPs that we announced."

It's primarily this filling of retailers inventory which AMD sees as key to getting the prices of Vega down to their original pre-launch levels.

"First of all we just need to drive as much stock as we can," Youngblood says, "because inventory is really important in everybody being able to hit those prices. Then it's just working with our partners to enable it, but we don't set the price of their product. But we will drive, and do everything that we can, to get those prices to where we suggested when we launched them earlier."

AMD Radeon RX Vega graphics cards

AMD also need to up their GPU production game for their older cards too, especially because they're set to launch a new Quake Champions bundle.

"We're going to be bundling Quake Champions with the Champions pack," he says, "which unlocks all the champions in the game, with all our Ryzen 7 and Ryzen 5 processors, and with all RX 580, 570, and 560 graphics cards as added value for our customers."

That's great for CPUs with lots of stock, but it's practically impossible to buy any 500-series Radeon graphics card right now.

"We're very focused on delivering increased supply out to the market," explains Youngblood. "And that's both to meet all the demands that are out there and, yes, we're trying to catch up and get more stock out there. And you'll see more stock available very soon."

Fingers crossed it's very soon 'cos those e-shelves look like the GPU locusts have just swarmed through.
Source https://www.pcgamesn.com/amd/amd-rx-vega-launch-price-reduction
 
#3 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRichard View Post

That's a lot of word salad responding for a guy that never actually answered the question he was asked.
I think he answered
Quote:
Our SEPs, and the price tag that we announced is our full intention of where we would suggest the product be priced. Not just for launch, but ongoing.What happened, though, was we launched the product and the demand was really huge. Now we're focused on replenishing so that there is plenty of stock so we can encourage our partners to hit the SEPs that we announced.
It's primarily this filling of retailers inventory which AMD sees as key to getting the prices of Vega down to their original pre-launch levels.

"First of all we just need to drive as much stock as we can," Youngblood says, "because inventory is really important in everybody being able to hit those prices. Then it's just working with our partners to enable it, but we don't set the price of their product. But we will drive, and do everything that we can, to get those prices to where we suggested when we launched them earlier
Basically Retailers will control price based on supply/demand
 
#4 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by PontiacGTX View Post

I think he answered
Basically Retailers will control price based on supply/demand
This isn't a fight, and I'm not trying to start anything, this is a good faith question. I do appreciate you posting this information.

If that truly is how AMD feels about current pricing (it's not our fault, it's just supply and demand, retailers set the actual prices)

Why not just send out cards and tell everybody Vega will be available for $199 and $299 with a disclaimer that those are just suggestions, we "AMD" can't control what retailers charge.

Again, I appreciate you posting this (it's a good read). I just don't buy AMD's stance on this whole thing.
 
#5 ·
but but but jay2twocents.......

rolleyes.gif
 
#6 ·
This is not rocket science. AMD cards continue to be sold out from the early spring 2017 through now. No one should be shocked that prices are higher in any sense, old gen cards or new.

And asking AMD about their charity in this case is another IQ test.

Regardless if Vega is seen as Late, or a competitive Fail in some person's "Lense that they look through", sold out is an AMD success from their perspective. They are happy as hell that mining took off. Basically saved the GPU side of the house. Their pride may be hurt, but their wallets are full.
 
#9 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

sicksmiley.png


Vega seems to be doing better than we initially attributed it...

I'm still waiting for Volta. Apparenty it is even better in performance per watt than Pascal, which is exactly what I wanted of Vega.
Better performance per watt than 7970. Perfect
 
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#10 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by PontiacGTX View Post

I think he answered
While he answered the specific question he was given, he was not asked nor answer whether the actual MSPR for 399/499 is going to stay or it was just for launch as it was also said to several sites by AMD officials and posted earlier several times.

Retailers controlling the price is not rocket science. It was pretty expected. But if AMD also increase the none bundle price, it also mean that retailers will not give us 399/499 prices any time soon.

And that is what I want to know. What is the real MSPR price.
The title "hints" that MSPR didn't chance, but it doesn't back it up by asking that question.
 
#12 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by ilmazzo View Post

but but but jay2twocents.......

rolleyes.gif
you mean DramaQueentwocentz?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Defoler View Post

While he answered the specific question he was given, he was not asked nor answer whether the actual MSPR for 399/499 is going to stay or it was just for launch as it was also said to several sites by AMD officials and posted earlier several times.

Retailers controlling the price is not rocket science. It was pretty expected. But if AMD also increase the none bundle price, it also mean that retailers will not give us 399/499 prices any time soon.

And that is what I want to know. What is the real MSPR price.
The title "hints" that MSPR didn't chance, but it doesn't back it up by asking that question.
I think that was implicit here
Quote:
Now we're focused on replenishing so that there is plenty of stock so we can encourage our partners to hit the SEPs that we announced.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarhell View Post

Better performance per watt than 7970. Perfect
Give us a 4Hi 4 Stack HBM Based card with a 20-35% performance increase over the old Generation for =<350usd and similar power draw and Undervolt ability to R9 Fury or better and that is the best deal mainstream users could get, or drop price on RX VEGA 56 a bit
tongue.gif
 
#13 ·
AMD's gpu marketing division needs to be fired (preferably from a cannon
tongue.gif
). This whole launch has been a train wreck from the word go. I think if they had been honest with the community from the start the backlash would not have been anywhere near as bad... instead they all the clickbait sites all the content they could ever ask for.
 
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#14 ·
what's wrong with jz2c?

he gives his honest opinion on the matter which I appreciate. Linus and Jay are jepordizing their sponsorship by providing us the truth and mocking the the hand that feeds them.

If POS rebate really did expire a week into launch then that's a crummy move on RTG.

how the tables have turned...Nvidia are the lesser of the evil this gen.
 
#16 ·
So it IS a supply/demand thing.............. like always during a launch........... So why has there been any "confusion" around this to begin with? AMD's probably in the back of their minds going "it's MSRP. This is nothing new. Why are yall spinning this this way? RARR!!!

Yeah the miner boom was a thing to be worried about on all sides but apparently any miner worth their salt doesn't wanna touch Vega with a 50 foot pole. Literally leaving the tried and old issue as the culprit.

I mean, yeah I wasn't present the minute the news dropped at launch so if there editions to the slides and info hours later when I could jump into launch details IDK. It all seemed quite straight forward to me yet everywhere people seem to be muddling info on this side of things

IDK. I juts want my Sapphire Vega 64s already
 
#17 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by twitchyzero View Post

what's wrong with jz2c?

he gives his honest opinion on the matter which I appreciate. Linus and Jay are jepordizing their sponsorship by providing us the truth and mocking the the hand that feeds them.

If POS rebate really did expire a week into launch then that's a crummy move on RTG.

how the tables have turned...Nvidia are the lesser of the evil this gen.
Still Nvidia launched Titan X Pascal and then released a even faster Titan X"p" Pascal for same price making a joke on those who spent 1200usd for their flagship GPU and then released the Ti version which outperformed Titan X price/performance while keeping most of vram

Nvidia dev partners are stil using code into their games that optimize nvidia architecture and cripple AMD *cough*

Still Nvidia was selling reference models over what the non reference models which had much better cooling
Quote:
Originally Posted by JakdMan View Post

So it IS a supply/demand thing.............. like always during a launch........... So why has there been any "confusion" around this to begin with? AMD's probably in the back of their minds going "it's MSRP. This is nothing new. Why are yall spinning this this way? RARR!!!

Yeah the miner boom was a thing to be worried about on all sides but apparently any miner worth their salt doesn't wanna touch Vega with a 50 foot pole. Literally leaving the tried and old issue as the culprit.

I mean, yeah I wasn't present the minute the news dropped at launch so if there editions to the slides and info hours later when I could jump into launch details IDK. It all seemed quite straight forward to me yet everywhere people seem to be muddling info on this side of things

IDK. I juts want my Sapphire Vega 64s already
I see mining being a problem because the only GPU besides 1080Ti that performs quite good in mining is VEGA 64 and it is 100-150usd cheaper

and if you want a chance to get a VEGA GPU get VEGA 56
 
#19 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRichard View Post

That's a lot of word salad responding for a guy that never actually answered the question he was asked.
Bingo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Defoler View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by PontiacGTX View Post

I think he answered
While he answered the specific question he was given, he was not asked nor answer whether the actual MSPR for 399/499 is going to stay or it was just for launch as it was also said to several sites by AMD officials and posted earlier several times.

Retailers controlling the price is not rocket science. It was pretty expected. But if AMD also increase the none bundle price, it also mean that retailers will not give us 399/499 prices any time soon.

And that is what I want to know. What is the real MSPR price.
The title "hints" that MSPR didn't chance, but it doesn't back it up by asking that question.
Exactly.

It's a very cleverly arranged statement, I'll give them that, but you can't really take away from what he said what sites like Eteknix, quoted in another thread based on the source in the OP, that they are denying an RX Vega launch price discount.

What seems to be the case is that they are hoping to hit volume as time goes by, thus being able to lower the manufacturing costs (it should help that SK Hynix is also coming into the mix for the slower 1.6 Gbps HBM2 as they are ramping up mass production during this month) and then they will "encourage" and 'work with their partners' to reach the SEP - aka rebates are still on the table as necessary.

Interesting quotes from the article:
Quote:
Our SEPs, and the price tag that we announced," Youngblood says, "is our full intention of where we would suggest the product be priced. Not just for launch, but ongoing.
As they say, hell is a place filled with good intentions. The SEP is either realistic out of the gate or it isn't. If it isn't, AMD has to know it and thus has to either raise it to meet reality, or, as is the case, pretend to the public that it's all good and rebate.

Quote:
Now we're focused on replenishing so that there is plenty of stock so we can encourage our partners to hit the SEPs that we announced
Quote:
First of all we just need to drive as much stock as we can," Youngblood says, "because inventory is really important in everybody being able to hit those prices.
"everybody", as in, AMD too. Clever wording.

The most telling however is this one:
Quote:
Then it's just working with our partners to enable it, but we don't set the price of their product. But we will drive, and do everything that we can, to get those prices to where we suggested when we launched them earlier."
It's their "intention", "encourage", 'work with partners' to hit SEP. PR language is a lot of fun, the acrobatics that these people need to employ to not admit to the rebates. Oh well, they probably reached the conclusion that it's better to keep rebating as necessary than to admit that they misrepresented the reference Vega 64 as the GPU king under $499.

And again, this is separate from the other part, which is surely also happening, that is retailers increasing prices in addition.
 
#20 ·
TPI you are huge into this?

I think sometimes you over analyse for the sake of it.

It's not like that almost on every single gpu release the last 5 years we didn't have gpus costing way over the MSRP, right? Do you remember the 900 bucks 290x?

I will keep my judgement for 1-2 months, if Vega does not hit the original MSRP then I will just not buy it.
 
#21 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarhell View Post

TPI you are huge into this?

I think sometimes you over analyse for the sake of it.

It's not like that almost on every single gpu release the last 5 years we didn't have gpus costing way over the MSRP, right? Do you remember the 900 bucks 290x?

I will keep my judgement for 1-2 months, if Vega does not hit the original MSRP then I will just not buy it.
He makes really good points though.
thumb.gif
 
#22 ·
I mean, it's a suggested retail price, emphasis on the suggested part. There are many times when retailers/etailers will blame the vendor instead of taking responsibility for jacking up the price. If it's expensive, then don't carry it, that way vendors will realize they need to reduce their price. I will add, that we don't still know whose fault it totally is, but maybe other vendors will also reevaluate how to meet that price they set before launch.
 
#23 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarhell View Post

TPI you are huge into this?

I think sometimes you over analyse for the sake of it.

It's not like that almost on every single gpu release the last 5 years we didn't have gpus costing way over the MSRP, right? Do you remember the 900 bucks 290x?

I will keep my judgement for 1-2 months, if Vega does not hit the original MSRP then I will just not buy it.
It's just that it's unfair to let AMD get away with the retailers taking the hit for the whole portion of the price hikes when in reality they are responsible for part of it if they don't rebate. Why would I let go if I was here back in January of 2015 criticizing Nvidia for the 3.5 GB + 512 MB VRAM, ROPs and L2 cache problem? AMD gets a discount (pun intended) for being the underdog or something?

Quote:
Originally Posted by criminal View Post

He makes really good points though.
thumb.gif
thumb.gif
 
#24 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post

It's just that it's unfair to let AMD get away with the retailers talking the hit for the whole portion of the price hike when in reality they are responsible for part of it if they don't rebate. Why would I let go if I was here back in January 2015 criticizing Nvidia for the 3.5 GB + 512 MB VRAM, ROPs and L2 cache problem? AMD gets a discount (pun intended) for being the underdog or something?
We are so sure about that? We don't have facts just rumors and opinions.

Gibbo said that thing about the rebates but one week ago he said that Vega can do 100 mh/s.

Either way, I will not trust a retailer or AMD. Soon enough we will learn the truth.

From all this story when we should blame both parties AMD gets all the negativity.
 
#25 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sin0822 View Post

I mean, it's a suggested retail price, emphasis on the suggested part. There are many times when retailers/etailers will blame the vendor instead of taking responsibility for jacking up the price. If it's expensive, then don't carry it, that way vendors will realize they need to reduce their price. I will add, that we don't still know whose fault it totally is, but maybe other vendors will also reevaluate how to meet that price they set before launch.
Maybe vendors/retailers/distirbuitor have evaluated the market and seen that due to the surge of a demand for high end and mid range GPU they would increase price since it was the trend for other products and it is really a suggested price and like the acronym says Suggested Etailer Price,the Etailer can change price as they wish,specially with high demand and low stocks
 
#26 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by sugarhell View Post

We are so sure about that? We don't have facts just rumors and opinions.

Gibbo said that thing about the rebates but one week ago he said that Vega can do 100 mh/s.

Either way, I will not trust a retailer or AMD. Soon enough we will learn the truth.

From all this story when we should blame both parties AMD gets all the negativity.
It's not one retailer, it's several, it's that Norwegian one, komplett.no, it's the sources that GamersNexus contacted and the source that Jayz contacted. They all point in the same direction.

As to the mining capabilities of Vega, he explained it in the same thread:

https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/threads/vega-is-finally-here-its-in-stock-along-with-some-epic-bundles-freesync-deals.18789696/page-6#post-31060742
Quote:
Ah gotta love review sites that quote one of my post out of context with later replies from me. More fool the idiots who read press sites and believe what they say, when they select just the snippets they want to select. I said an AIB has rumoured 70-100 hash rate, not confirmed. Funny how the press made it look like 70-100 was dead cert. People who read all my replies here would no that to be rumour but as always certain sites post up just parts of my replies here and take as gospel.

Thankfully we sold in single units but will be interesting to hear if our RMA team get calls from miners trying to return.
https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/threads/vega-is-finally-here-its-in-stock-along-with-some-epic-bundles-freesync-deals.18789696/page-7#post-31060782
Quote:
Members here can see the post, I post here, if news sites want to pickup on what I post that is fine. But then if people want to kick off because they read it out of context that is their own fault. They should join these forums and read the full story, not snippets chosen by others. I share what I can with customers whilst trying to stay within NDA parameters set by manufacturers.
 
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