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post #851 of 1438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobotoo View Post

For now, anything but RAID0, you need the dongle, which is much cheaper if you get on ebay. YOu might already know, but there are two dongles, a "regular" and a "premium."

When I saw the P900 intel drives I thought, great, now we have a decent drive to use VROC . . . but from all I can see, there is no m.2 version, which is odd to say the least.

IN this article they use the Intel p600 drives and get almost 12,000 Seq Read numbers, but that is using TWO Hyper x16 (so 8 drives), which would not be practical on this particular motherboard, since we have two x16 Pcie slots and one would usually be populated by the GPU. https://www.pcworld.com/article/3199104/storage/intels-core-i9-and-x299-enable-crazy-raid-configurations-for-a-price.html

In the article that I provided, currently he was able to create ANY RAID without needing a Dongle, I even think he was able to create a bootable RAID 1 without the dongle. The article said RST would allow him to do so, but I'm thinking that would be a software rather than through the BIOS. He definitely was able to create a hardware RAID 0 array without any dongle as shown in the article. He was also able to create a VROC array using four Samsung 960 Pros using the Asus Hyper x16. My guess is that the Hyper 16 is basically a hardware RAID solution that the BIOS sees as a RAID device, which is why he had to install drivers for it. He even said that the RAID array he made was reporting as bootable.

The only thing I was not able to test was the following scenario and I would love to know if anyone can test this...

Load Windows into a normal SSD. Using the Asus Hyper x16, create a RAID 0 array using RST in Windows. It should report that it is bootable. Try to load windows using the F6 drivers to see if you can load windows 10 on to the newly formed RAID 0 drive and see if we can boot from it.

According to my article they were able to do so, tho there was 'issues". To me this is the ONLY way we MIGHT be able to create a VROC RAID 0 drive using non-intel drives that MIGHT be able to be used as a bootable drive. The key is the Asus Hyper x16, the BIOS identifying it as a VROC device and using the software RST to create the RAID 0 instead in the BIOS. If I can ever find a Hyper x16 at a reasonable price (not the $150 I'm seeing on amazon) I may give it a go, but if someone else gets one, let me know. smile.gif
post #852 of 1438
Quote:
Originally Posted by brighttail View Post

If you take a look at the VROC documentation provided you will see that it is based off XEON platform processors, not X299. I have two SM961s. I installed two via single m.2 to PCI-e cards and in BIOS chose Single SSD VROC. Doing so made these drives completely disappear in WIndows and in the BIOS I went to create a RAID0 array and it said these drives were UNSUPPORTED.



EDIT: **OOPS** someone already copied my post over on the ROG forums. smile.gif

Basically VROC should allow you to use any M.2s to create a non-bootable RAID array using non-intel NVMe, so long as all the M.2s are on the same card, IN a PCI-e lane. I do not believe you can do it using the DIMM.2 (at least I haven't found a way to do so in the BIOS). So it looks like people are going to have to get something like an Asus Hyper x16 card or other card that Asus motherboards will accept that has more than can accept more than 1 M.2. At the same time, as we have seen we should also be able to have more than one Asus X16 (up to 3) and run up to 12 NVMe drives using VROC.

Still left in the dark. I guess we won’t know until this is mainstream for awhile. Would love to see it before I get busy loading the OS and setting this all up but in the meantime I guess I will have to go ahead without then if I decide to go that route just back up what I have and restore to a bootable VROC array.

I’m the meantime been leak testing since last night. Going to leave the pumps running while I finish up with cables and wire management then drain it and refill with fresh DW and mayhem’s.



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post #853 of 1438
It's been noticed that a few posters in this thread are double posting quite a bit, I just wanted to jump in and let you know that OCN expects people to use the edit and multi quote buttons instead of double posting.
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post #854 of 1438
It's only been a working day so far after tuning yesterday, but no freezes so far in linux or windows with this kit (nor any problems whatsoever with setup - XMP with no other changes):


Worked with the 7xx bios that came on the board as well as with the 802 since last night. Not sure how long it takes for instability to be detected but I did run an hour of SAT last night under linux and more than an hour of RB.
7980xe OC is adaptive/auto but 4.5x4 4.4x8 4.2x18, 3.0 mesh @ 1.1v.
ram is a BWE tridentZ 128G 3200CAS14 kit running at 3200 BCLK=100 xmp, no other changes to memory or digi+ settings other than LLC5
Edited by cekim - 10/18/17 at 1:44pm
post #855 of 1438
Great to hear, this is the kit it I am aiming for too smile.gif

Tested the Hyper M.2 X16 card with my two Samsung EVO 960 1TB. I am not happy with what I am seeing. Getting much better numbers using the data mode and using just a software RAID0 under W10, than using the RSTe VROC CPU RAID0.

plain EVO

VROC RAID0 128K stripe size

DATA W10 Striping Volume

Edited by Aysberg - 10/18/17 at 3:06pm
post #856 of 1438
Those first set of numbers is very odd. For software RAID for my SM961s i was getting 5800/3000 for read/write. Not sure what is going on with yours. I think that first one had to go through the DMI as it looks like it throttled.

Very interesting that the VROC had lower numbers than the windows 10 striping. I'm curious what numbers you would get with VROC if you lowered that down to 16k stripe size? I know when I have done RAID arrays through BIOS it suggested 16k for M.2s. I'm not sure if that is accurate but with my RAMCache and other RAIDS, I don't use 128k but 16k. Just a thought.
post #857 of 1438
Quote:
Originally Posted by brighttail View Post

In the article that I provided, currently he was able to create ANY RAID without needing a Dongle, I even think he was able to create a bootable RAID 1 without the dongle. The article said RST would allow him to do so, but I'm thinking that would be a software rather than through the BIOS. He definitely was able to create a hardware RAID 0 array without any dongle as shown in the article. He was also able to create a VROC array using four Samsung 960 Pros using the Asus Hyper x16. My guess is that the Hyper 16 is basically a hardware RAID solution that the BIOS sees as a RAID device, which is why he had to install drivers for it. He even said that the RAID array he made was reporting as bootable.

The only thing I was not able to test was the following scenario and I would love to know if anyone can test this...

Load Windows into a normal SSD. Using the Asus Hyper x16, create a RAID 0 array using RST in Windows. It should report that it is bootable. Try to load windows using the F6 drivers to see if you can load windows 10 on to the newly formed RAID 0 drive and see if we can boot from it.

According to my article they were able to do so, tho there was 'issues". To me this is the ONLY way we MIGHT be able to create a VROC RAID 0 drive using non-intel drives that MIGHT be able to be used as a bootable drive. The key is the Asus Hyper x16, the BIOS identifying it as a VROC device and using the software RST to create the RAID 0 instead in the BIOS. If I can ever find a Hyper x16 at a reasonable price (not the $150 I'm seeing on amazon) I may give it a go, but if someone else gets one, let me know. smile.gif
Even if it says bootable, I have tried this already and it only works if you use Optane or Intel SSDs. The other RAID configs that you are referring to is possible without a dongle but in 90 days your data gone/locked because it's a trial.
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post #858 of 1438
Those first set of numbers is very odd. For software RAID for my SM961s i was getting 5800/3000 for read/write. Not sure what is going on with yours.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artah View Post

Even if it says bootable, I have tried this already and it only works if you use Optane or Intel SSDs. The other RAID configs that you are referring to is possible without a dongle but in 90 days your data gone/locked because it's a trial.

Yeah I was wondering if you could use the RST that isn't ENTERPRISE. To be honest I'm not even sure that the dongles are available.

Thanks for answering that, I was thinking that it would be a very odd work around to load up windows just to create a bootable array to reinstall windows on, but I have seen weirder work-arounds. smile.gif We probably just have to face the fact that while we may be able to appreciate VROC speeds on non-bootable drives using non-Intel drives, Intel's decision to lock down bootable VROC arrays is yet another poor decision from them and I think it will bite them in the arse when all is said and done. I would be happy to buy a dongle if I could use non-Intel drives. smile.gif

Actually, thinking about it, do you know if you can indeed use VROC for a non-bootable array for more than the 90 days? RAID 0 is supposed to be available with no dongle.
post #859 of 1438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jobotoo View Post

Ok, makes sense. Thanks for testing this out. I might just have to get me some Intel ones too.
Got an update... I was just able to do a RAID1 and I had the option to do RAID0 on Samsung 950 drives. There is a catch... You have to use the RSTe software from windows and you can not do it in the BIOS. I can't say for RAID0 with 3-4 drives since I only have 2 950 Pros and if I borrow my wife's drive and lose her data she will delid my 7980XE in half for me lol. I'm thinking it can work but I don't want to buy two more of those drives to test it. This is on the hyper m.2 x16 card.

Quote:
Originally Posted by brighttail View Post

Those first set of numbers is very odd. For software RAID for my SM961s i was getting 5800/3000 for read/write. Not sure what is going on with yours.
Yeah I was wondering if you could use the RST that isn't ENTERPRISE. To be honest I'm not even sure that the dongles are available.

Thanks for answering that, I was thinking that it would be a very odd work around to load up windows just to create a bootable array to reinstall windows on, but I have seen weirder work-arounds. smile.gif We probably just have to face the fact that while we may be able to appreciate VROC speeds on non-bootable drives using non-Intel drives, Intel's decision to lock down bootable VROC arrays is yet another poor decision from them and I think it will bite them in the arse when all is said and done. I would be happy to buy a dongle if I could use non-Intel drives. smile.gif

Actually, thinking about it, do you know if you can indeed use VROC for a non-bootable array for more than the 90 days? RAID 0 is supposed to be available with no dongle.
sadly we can't get a hold of dongles unless we are one of the elites that get an engineering sample so they can scratch and sniff it on a youtube video and not test everything to list it on the ROG forum like you nicely did.

The RAID1 that I just created does not say it's a trial of 90 days, I'm so confused lol the other day it said that. Maybe that was for RAID5 and 10. I would pay for a dongle to do RAID10 of SSDs in a heartbeat even if it cost me an extra $150-250 but my dissatisfaction with Intel will increase even further if I can't use faster M.2 drives..

By the way I stay away from software RAID, just not comfy with it. VROC has double fault protection aka write hole same as having a battery backup on controllers like the ones I have on my servers.
Edited by Artah - 10/18/17 at 9:18pm
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post #860 of 1438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artah View Post

Got an update... I was just able to do a RAID1 and I had the option to do RAID0 on Samsung 950 drives. There is a catch... You have to use the RSTe software from windows and you can not do it in the BIOS. I can't say for RAID0 with 3-4 drives since I only have 2 950 Pros and if I borrow my wife's drive and lose her data she will delid my 7980XE in half for me lol. I'm thinking it can work but I don't want to buy two more of those drives to test it. This is on the hyper m.2 x16 card.
sadly we can't get a hold of dongles unless we are one of the elites that get an engineering sample so they can scratch and sniff it on a youtube video and not test everything to list it on the ROG forum like you nicely did.

The RAID1 that I just created does not say it's a trial of 90 days, I'm so confused lol the other day it said that. Maybe that was for RAID5 and 10. I would pay for a dongle to do RAID10 of SSDs in a heartbeat even if it cost me an extra $150-250 but my dissatisfaction with Intel will increase even further.

I haven't been able to buy a reasonable Hyper X16 so I may be waiting for others. What RSTe drivers are you using for this? I can say with absolute certainty you won't be able to do it in BIOS as unless we get some BIOS hack, the Samsung drives will be considered unauthorized.

I have a 960 Pro and two SM961s and even an 950 Pro that I could do some testing with but I'm at a point as to do I want to? Honestly I don't need a bootable RAID 0 using VROC, unless as you said it is RAID 10, otherwise I'm good with a non-bootable array. I can't test VROC without the Asus x16 so some questions?

In the BIOS are you able to set the PCI-e lane as Asus Hyper x16 VROC data? Doing so should allow you to use your Samsung drives in whatever RAID you want using VROC (tho it may expire still?) The only purpose for me at this point, other than testing for the Asus Hyper X16 would be four drives in RAID 10 using VROC. Heck for fun I'd love to see four drives hitting 13000 seq read smile.gif

In the end my normal setup has been One 960 as boot drive and my Games/working drive was in RAID 0. If I can get VROC working on that drive it would be worth having 3 or 4 drives since I do video editing and move large files all over the place between that drive and my NAS 50-100gb files. As we saw with some test results windows striped gave better results than a VROC at 128k stripped. I think he might get better results moving that to 16k but we'll see.

In the end unless you got 3 or four drives VROC probably isn't going to do much good. Thus the Hyper x16 is only good if you:
1. are able to do RAID 5/10 or going to use them all for a speedy VROC RAID 0.
2. want to create a couple of RAID 0 drives
3. To play around with
4. not wanting to use the DIMM.2 and m.2 drive space already provided.

Of course adding all those drives is going add latency.. but it is still nice to have that raw speed to copy a 100gb file at 13000Mb/s! smile.gif
Edited by brighttail - 10/18/17 at 9:27pm
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