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Need advice for a $ 350 build with no GPU. - Page 3

post #21 of 52
Pretty sure the GPU does the decoding. Since that xeon doesnt have a built in gpu it doesnt support decoding itself. If you have/get a GTX 1050 that would handle the decoding, you would need to check if it supports it (although id be surprised if it doesnt)

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/zc8hzM

Also, might put you a couple bucks above budget (add to my list whatever hdd, psu and case you want). You could cut upto like $20 bux off the mobo with a cheaper option and ~$10 off the ram for slower ram. B350 will let you overclock the CPU though, no reason you cant get upper 3GHz to almost 4Ghz overclock. Gives you 4 cores vs 2, a platform thats not already dead (upgrade path for years, or so they claim...AMD has a good track record on that). The CPU doesnt have a gpu so you would need to add one, if you decide CPU must have graphics built in right now your best bet is a cheaper Intel, however I think their new lineup is supposed to be much better price/performance. I think the i3-8100 is slated to be a 4c/4t 3.6Ghz for about $117 and would have graphics built in. Would have to be on a 300 series mobo though and not sure what they plan to come out with to start.

If storage space isnt a concern and you can extend the budget $50-$100 you can replace the HDD with a SSD (sata or m.2). I think the EVO 960 250GB is like $117 and is crazy fast and only $10 more than a sata m.2 850. The HDD is by far the most limiting factor as its mechanical.

About a year back I did a build for my inlaws. i5-7400, mobo, 16GB RAM (before prices doubled), EVO 960 250GB m.2 (reused $25 case and $30 PSU) and I think price came out to about $400-450. Due to RAM pricing doing 8GB 3200 would likely push you to about $500 for the same build and the Ryzen 1200 is likely as good if not better.

Hope this helps
post #22 of 52
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zer0CoolX View Post

Pretty sure the GPU does the decoding. Since that xeon doesnt have a built in gpu it doesnt support decoding itself. If you have/get a GTX 1050 that would handle the decoding, you would need to check if it supports it (although id be surprised if it doesnt)

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/zc8hzM

Also, might put you a couple bucks above budget (add to my list whatever hdd, psu and case you want). You could cut upto like $20 bux off the mobo with a cheaper option and ~$10 off the ram for slower ram. B350 will let you overclock the CPU though, no reason you cant get upper 3GHz to almost 4Ghz overclock. Gives you 4 cores vs 2, a platform thats not already dead (upgrade path for years, or so they claim...AMD has a good track record on that). The CPU doesnt have a gpu so you would need to add one, if you decide CPU must have graphics built in right now your best bet is a cheaper Intel, however I think their new lineup is supposed to be much better price/performance. I think the i3-8100 is slated to be a 4c/4t 3.6Ghz for about $117 and would have graphics built in. Would have to be on a 300 series mobo though and not sure what they plan to come out with to start.

If storage space isnt a concern and you can extend the budget $50-$100 you can replace the HDD with a SSD (sata or m.2). I think the EVO 960 250GB is like $117 and is crazy fast and only $10 more than a sata m.2 850. The HDD is by far the most limiting factor as its mechanical.

About a year back I did a build for my inlaws. i5-7400, mobo, 16GB RAM (before prices doubled), EVO 960 250GB m.2 (reused $25 case and $30 PSU) and I think price came out to about $400-450. Due to RAM pricing doing 8GB 3200 would likely push you to about $500 for the same build and the Ryzen 1200 is likely as good if not better.

Hope this helps

Thanks this Xeon comes with a built in GPU P530 it seems:

https://ark.intel.com/products/88168/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E3-1225-v5-8M-Cache-3_30-GHz

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/processors/xeon/e3-processors/e3-1225-v5.html

IDK if it's really true that it's built into the CPU or just the motherboard.
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post #23 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubers View Post

Hmm

https://ark.intel.com/products/88168/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E3-1225-v5-8M-Cache-3_30-GHz

Isn't this Xeon 4C/4T? Or is Intel mixing up their product pages?
https://ark.intel.com/products/88168/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E3-1225-v5-8M-Cache-3_30-GHz

Is intel lying about their chip launch dates? It says there Q4 2015.

There was also a video review on the net that said it's roughly the same as the i5 6600.

I'm confused.
Ah, I see what I did wrong. I was looking at the v1 version on the Xeon, not the v5.

This chip is indeed from 2015. The iGPU is located on the CPU die not the motherboard, and can do partial 4K (8 bit instead of 10 bit decode if the data I've gathered is right, and also only 4Kx30hz instead of 4kx60hz over HDMI). You can probably fix the 4kx30 issue with an active DP to HDMI adapter.

The Xeon is a solid option. The new i3 is also a good option, but the motherboard may cost a few bucks more. It's probably worth the wait as it will have a better GPU with better hardware decoding.

As others have mentioned, going the AMD route may also be a good choice. Their upgrade paths tend to be quite generous and performance is pretty good.
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post #24 of 52
I'd wait for the new CFL CPU's. (Or buy Ryzen)
Edited by Lass3 - 9/27/17 at 12:31am
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post #25 of 52
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SavantStrike View Post

Ah, I see what I did wrong. I was looking at the v1 version on the Xeon, not the v5.

This chip is indeed from 2015. The iGPU is located on the CPU die not the motherboard, and can do partial 4K (8 bit instead of 10 bit decode if the data I've gathered is right, and also only 4Kx30hz instead of 4kx60hz over HDMI). You can probably fix the 4kx30 issue with an active DP to HDMI adapter.

The Xeon is a solid option. The new i3 is also a good option, but the motherboard may cost a few bucks more. It's probably worth the wait as it will have a better GPU with better hardware decoding.

As others have mentioned, going the AMD route may also be a good choice. Their upgrade paths tend to be quite generous and performance is pretty good.

Rep'd. Yeah I'm open to any AMD options as long as it can sound compelling.

Would you happen to know if I can install Windows 7 on this Xeon?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lass3 View Post

I'd wait for the new CFL CPU's.

Noted.

@thread:

BTW, the i3 is a rebadged i5 Kaby Lake right?
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post #26 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubers View Post

Rep'd. Yeah I'm open to any AMD options as long as it can sound compelling.

Would you happen to know if I can install Windows 7 on this Xeon?
Noted.

@thread:

BTW, the i3 is a rebadged i5 Kaby Lake right?

I think the new i3 is a kaby/coffee hybrid. They are both 14nm parts so they only thing really changing is the socket.

The Xeon is your best bet for windows 7 as kaby lake onward aren't officially supported. A user created patch allows you to get windows updates on kaby lake and ryzen, but the default behavior of windows is to block you from updates.

Who knows what coffee lake will be like on Windows 7, or if drivers will even be available.
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post #27 of 52
The new i3's are not a hybrid. They are Coffee Lake, which is the second optimization of Skylake. The primary differences between Kaby Lake and Coffee Lake are the socket and core count. Either Intel could not get Coffee Lake to work with 100- and 200-series chipsets or they did not want them to work, so they used a different socket. Coffee Lake is basically Kaby Lake with more cores. Still not sure why Intel bothered with Kaby Lake.
post #28 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by chessmyantidrug View Post

The new i3's are not a hybrid. They are Coffee Lake, which is the second optimization of Skylake. The primary differences between Kaby Lake and Coffee Lake are the socket and core count. Either Intel could not get Coffee Lake to work with 100- and 200-series chipsets or they did not want them to work, so they used a different socket. Coffee Lake is basically Kaby Lake with more cores. Still not sure why Intel bothered with Kaby Lake.

Hybrid was the wrong term, but they are the same process node and appear to be very similar aside from the core count and new socket (which as you have mentioned is awfully similar). It looks a lot like a tick-tock-tock cycle where the second tock has been artificially locked out of existing sockets.
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post #29 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubers View Post

Thanks this Xeon comes with a built in GPU P530 it seems:

https://ark.intel.com/products/88168/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E3-1225-v5-8M-Cache-3_30-GHz

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/processors/xeon/e3-processors/e3-1225-v5.html

IDK if it's really true that it's built into the CPU or just the motherboard.

Ah yes my mistake. That product line has a couple with gpu peppered in. Its not on the mobo, built into CPU then.

What I mentioned is still valid none-the-less. I think a Ryzen 3 or 8 series i3 is a much better pick than a G4600. Both would bring you to current plaforms. Both would give 4 physical cores vs 2c/4t.

If you can wait and are unsure if you want to add a GPU then the i3 is likely a btter choice depending on its price at release and available mobo's. If you cant wait and can add a GPU, then the Ryzen 3 is likely the way to go.

Lastly, if storage space isnt an issue, if you can squeeze a SSD (sata or m.2) that will be a big boost in performance. In all honesty, a SSD over an HDD is likely going to offer more noticeable performance gains for every day use vs small differences in CPU selection.
post #30 of 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by SavantStrike View Post

Hybrid was the wrong term, but they are the same process node and appear to be very similar aside from the core count and new socket (which as you have mentioned is awfully similar). It looks a lot like a tick-tock-tock cycle where the second tock has been artificially locked out of existing sockets.
It's more like tock-tock-tock since "tick" was the die shrink and "tock" was the new architecture. Broadwell was the last "tick" as it was the die shrink of Haswell, then Skylake was the "tock" as it introduced new architecture. Kaby Lake was an optimization, which only meant slightly higher clock speeds and absolutely no IPC gain. Early indications for Coffee Lake suggest a minor IPC boost, but it's the fourth "generation" of processors they have made using the 14nm process.
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