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[Pcgamesn] The Dutch Gaming Authority is investigating whether online loot boxes constitute gambling - Page 11

post #101 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by CynicalUnicorn View Post

Violent crimes and sex crimes are also rising among our youth. So we really do need government intervention in video games. thumb.gif
So because youth crimes are on the rise, we shouldn't establish laws that stop companies from predatory practices on children?
What exactly is this imaginary either/or scenario you have in mind?

If this is the game you want to play, there's children starving in Africa so I guess we should just completely do nothing about crime among youth, I mean it's not the worst problem and we can only focus on addressing one thing (according to you for some reason).
???

I haven't heard this type of argument since elementary school, most people get smarter.
Edited by Hunched - 11/18/17 at 4:19pm
post #102 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunched View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by HanSomPa View Post

Tossing the argument of regulations aside, in this particular case, I don't think that the Gov. needs to step in and stop loot boxes or in game gambling or whatever. It's ultimately up to the parents to educate their kids.
This is like saying the law shouldn't step in to stop people from touching kids, I mean its 100% on the parents if they step into the van right?
Child gambling is illegal and Star Wars Battlefront 2 is not rated 18+
The box tells parents its okay
First of all, that is a terrible analogy.

Secondly, you need an actual means of payment before purchasing boxes. It's not like the game knows the kid's parents' CC number. So, if someone who is not supposed to be buying loot boxes is buying loot boxes, someone gave the kid way too much information.

All arguments so far seem to circle back to how negligent parents can be with their kids.
    
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post #103 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultracarpet View Post

I already said this in another thread... but... the only people that I can see that would benefit from more regulations and open disclosure of odds for these dumb loot crates are people that absolutely cannot help themselves from spending money on them. So if you don't identify with that demographic, you are spending your time trying to protect someone that, quite frankly, doesn't care enough to protect themselves.

This was so when the lootboxes only gave cosmetics. Recently however they straight up have power in them. Now what happens when you hide power in random boxes which can be purchased with real money? They tweak the game so the lootboxes suddenly become a lot more attractive.

Just look at Shadow of War which hides it's true ending behind a grind unless you got items which might be in lootboxes or Battlefront where the progression is so broken and the hero's so expensive they couldn't make it more obvious they want you to buy those dammed boxes.

The time of lootboxes affecting only people with addictive personalities is over, they now affect whole games.
post #104 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunched View Post

So because youth crimes are on the rise, we shouldn't establish laws that stop companies from predatory practices on children?
What exactly is this imaginary either/or scenario you have in mind?

If this is the game you want to play, there's children starving in Africa so I guess we should just completely do nothing about crime among youth, I mean it's not the worst problem and we can only focus on addressing one thing (according to you for some reason).
???

I haven't heard this type of argument since elementary school, most people get smarter.

When did I say that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CynicalUnicorn View Post

I think we need to regulate gambling like this in video games to protect children. We also need to regulate violent and sexual content in games. To protect the children. thumb.gif

I think games need to be more tightly regulated across the board to protect children from many vices including gambling. I'm on your side here. tongue.gif
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post #105 of 203
Yes regulate everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunched View Post

So because youth crimes are on the rise, we shouldn't establish laws that stop companies from predatory practices on children?
What exactly is this imaginary either/or scenario you have in mind?

The great epidemic of our time. Child gambling in video games.
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post #106 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by ToTheSun! View Post

First of all, that is a terrible analogy.

Secondly, you need an actual means of payment before purchasing boxes. It's not like the game knows the kid's parents' CC number. So, if someone who is not supposed to be buying loot boxes is buying loot boxes, someone gave the kid way too much information.

All arguments so far seem to circle back to how negligent parents can be with their kids.
Yes, the person at fault for buying lootboxes is in fact the person who bought them.
That doesn't excuse what EA or anyone else is doing or what environment they're purposefully constructing.
Have you heard about the proposed Activision patents? Where they matchmake you with more skilled players with better items in hopes you will lose and buy said items to be as good as said players?
Bottom line is, this stuff isn't good for anybody regardless of age.

Anyone who buys lootboxes has successfully been manipulated to pull the slot machine lever no matter what they tell themselves to justify it, like gamblers.
It's all about cashing in on whales and trying to turn as many people into whales as you can without completely alienating and pissing off the rest of your customers that want no part of it, that's their game here.
And they have boardroom meetings on how to get the kids hooked too, targeted advertising for kids isn't a new science.

Pay to win, but it's now pay to gamble to maybe win or try again, or deal with an insufferable grind against players who gambled their way to an unfair advantage against you who in the future you may even be getting purposefully unfairly matched against to make it bother you even more.
In the game you paid full price for maybe even got the deluxe $150+ edition but pay more still please.

How much can we annoy you to try and make you give us more money without completely losing you as a paying customer?
Kids won't know what's happening, they'll just want to pay to be as good as the people they're losing against.
post #107 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by HanSomPa View Post

Yes regulate everything.
The great epidemic of our time. Child gambling in video games.
I don't see why people exaggerate as if that makes something no longer a problem that should be addressed.
What is your point?
There are worse things than child gambling in video games? Wow good point. Changes nothing going on here.
There's always a worse problem than whatever problem you're talking about.
Edited by Hunched - 11/18/17 at 5:54pm
post #108 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by HanSomPa View Post

Parents have to watch out for their kids, and the kids without a good parent figure likely don't have any money to gamble anyway. So the point is moot.

Many problem gamblers don't have any money to gamble. That doesn't stop them gambling.
    
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post #109 of 203
I love Belgium can do smth to EA to make them stop this pay to win nonsense.
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post #110 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunched View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by ToTheSun! View Post

First of all, that is a terrible analogy.

Secondly, you need an actual means of payment before purchasing boxes. It's not like the game knows the kid's parents' CC number. So, if someone who is not supposed to be buying loot boxes is buying loot boxes, someone gave the kid way too much information.

All arguments so far seem to circle back to how negligent parents can be with their kids.
Yes, the person at fault for buying lootboxes is in fact the person who bought them.
That doesn't excuse what EA or anyone else is doing or what environment they're purposefully constructing.
Have you heard about the proposed Activision patents? Where they matchmake you with more skilled players with better items in hopes you will lose and buy said items to be as good as said players?
Bottom line is, this stuff isn't good for anybody regardless of age.

Anyone who buys lootboxes has successfully been manipulated to pull the slot machine lever no matter what they tell themselves to justify it, like gamblers.
It's all about cashing in on whales and trying to turn as many people into whales as you can without completely alienating and pissing off the rest of your customers that want no part of it, that's their game here.
And they have boardroom meetings on how to get the kids hooked too, targeted advertising for kids isn't a new science.

Pay to win, but it's now pay to gamble to maybe win or try again, or deal with an insufferable grind against players who gambled their way to an unfair advantage against you who in the future you may even be getting purposefully unfairly matched against to make it bother you even more.
In the game you paid full price for maybe even got the deluxe $150+ edition but pay more still please.

How much can we annoy you to try and make you give us more money without completely losing you as a paying customer?
Kids won't know what's happening, they'll just want to pay to be as good as the people they're losing against.
I hear what you're saying (and yes, I did hear about Activision's patents). But the whole argument rests on kids with their parents' CC or helpless adults who bought a game they knew was p2w and couldn't avoid spending money on loot boxes. These are the two scenarios that people in this thread advocating for regulation think justify tighter control.

Firstly, it's important to be concise about the scope and manner of said regulation. What are we trying to achieve here? If games with loot boxes end up being classified as gambling, what did we accomplish? We protected the children with CC numbers, but we've done nothing for adults with gambling addiction. And I have a feeling the latter is the more relevant segment of the population.

If, otherwise, you think they should control how and to whom companies like EA target their products, I'm not sure anything can be done.
    
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