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[Pcgamesn] The Dutch Gaming Authority is investigating whether online loot boxes constitute gambling - Page 16

post #151 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by HanSomPa View Post

Much like controlled substances. Because we all know how well that worked out.

Lol. The outcome would be VERY different if loot boxes and all that got regulated as a controlled substance. In the real world you can do things like sell illegally in dark corners. In a game, you dont just get people who want to sell illicit goods and make some programs that have hooks into a game. It is either part of the game and distributed as such ore it isnt in the game. There wont be anyone spawning up a black market buying and selling illegal goods into "AAA" shooters.
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post #152 of 203
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Originally Posted by Ultracarpet View Post

Ok sure, but where do we draw the line in the definition? Wold of Warcraft was technically then a slot machine that you paid a rental fee to use, seeing as it had randomized loot tables for bosses that dropped gear which you needed to progress further into the content with.

Most of the reason why I don't want this regulation in the gaming industry is because it sets precedents and it can have a really bad effect on things. That and I think people can make the call on their own whether a game is good or bad. SWB2 is clearly a crappy game because it has lootboxes centered around the core of the gameplay(progression). No one should need the government to hold their hand so they don't overspend on the dumb game.


Random drops are different than paid random results. One is gambling and one is a time sink
 
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post #153 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by EniGma1987 View Post

Lol. The outcome would be VERY different if loot boxes and all that got regulated as a controlled substance. In the real world you can do things like sell illegally in dark corners. In a game, you dont just get people who want to sell illicit goods and make some programs that have hooks into a game. It is either part of the game and distributed as such ore it isnt in the game. There wont be anyone spawning up a black market buying and selling illegal goods into "AAA" shooters.

You know, that's a good point actually.
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post #154 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkpriest667 View Post

Random drops are different than paid random results. One is gambling and one is a time sink

What's the difference between buying time to obtain random results and buying random results? They both contain the same conditions.
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post #155 of 203
I think the substance of the conversation that we've been having in these pages alone clearly shows how these features suck all the fun out of games to the point of turning them into something else.

It's probably the 'next best thing' after actually being in an EA / DICE meeting where they plan on how many hours they are going to prevent players from earning credits in single player arcade mode so that they are encouraged to buy stuff.

'Yeah, let's do up to 14 hours cool down period, that way those $60 freeloaders won't be coming back the next day at the same time unless they have some cash.'
 
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post #156 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post

I think the substance of the conversation that we've been having in these pages alone clearly shows how these features suck all the fun out of games to the point of turning them into something else.

It's probably the 'next best thing' after actually being in an EA / DICE meeting where they plan on how many hours they are going to prevent players from earning credits in single player arcade mode so that they are encouraged to buy stuff.

'Yeah, let's do up to 14 hours cool down period, that way those $60 freeloaders won't be coming back the next day at the same time unless they have some cash.'
This is why anyone defending lootboxes having any less restrictions is akin to an idiot shooting themselves in the foot.
It's real stupid to want to defend lootboxes to any degree when the ONLY people not negatively impacted are the ones getting the money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HanSomPa View Post

You know, that's a good point actually.
People who do and are addicted to drugs also do so without negatively impacting your life, unless it happens to someone you know or something.
People who gamble and are addicted to gambling do so with negatively impacting your game, you can't avoid it and your experience and what you get for your money is worse because of it.
By defending this, you're telling me you want that to happen. That's really dumb because its not in your own best interest.
It makes about as much sense as defending what TWC and the FCC are doing.
Edited by Hunched - 11/20/17 at 10:03pm
post #157 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultracarpet View Post

Ok sure, but where do we draw the line in the definition? Wold of Warcraft was technically then a slot machine that you paid a rental fee to use, seeing as it had randomized loot tables for bosses that dropped gear which you needed to progress further into the content with.

Most of the reason why I don't want this regulation in the gaming industry is because it sets precedents and it can have a really bad effect on things. That and I think people can make the call on their own whether a game is good or bad. SWB2 is clearly a crappy game because it has lootboxes centered around the core of the gameplay(progression). No one should need the government to hold their hand so they don't overspend on the dumb game.

In WoW there was never a time that you had to spend money in order to roll a slot lever to get an item, like loot boxes are.
Spending time doing a dungeon, raid, kill some NPC or whatever consistency to get something was there to keep people playing, not to get their money.
In WoW you pay for a service, and everyone are equal in luck.

If you insist on comparing WoW to a casino, it is like paying 15$ an entry, and play on whatever card/slot game you want, but you don't pay any more to play, nor you gain any more money out of it. There is no payout for paying more, nor any advantage if you entered with 100$ or 15$, the results are always the same.
Edited by Defoler - 11/20/17 at 10:53pm
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post #158 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultracarpet View Post

Ok sure, but where do we draw the line in the definition? Wold of Warcraft was technically then a slot machine that you paid a rental fee to use, seeing as it had randomized loot tables for bosses that dropped gear which you needed to progress further into the content with.

Farming bosses isn't the same as using real cash to directly or indirectly buy gambling packs that have tradeable items that can be resold for cash. Yeah, I know that's basically every MMORPG ever created, but it's highly exploitative on so many different levels. Where do I draw the line? I dunno, I'm not a regulator or a politician. It shouldn't be allowed in games played by children. Way too many creepers abusing people.

Quote:
Most of the reason why I don't want this regulation in the gaming industry is because it sets precedents and it can have a really bad effect on things. That and I think people can make the call on their own whether a game is good or bad. SWB2 is clearly a crappy game because it has lootboxes centered around the core of the gameplay(progression). No one should need the government to hold their hand so they don't overspend on the dumb game.

I'm not a fan of government regulation. A child can't buy a pack of cigarettes or a walk out of a store with a bottle of vodka, they also can't walk into a casino and gamble. Opening packs is like electronic slots. So it's your avatar actually opening them up. It just doesn't belong in AAA gaming, IMO.


edit: FWIW, I'm not one of those people who get hooked on gambling but I've opened thousands of dollars worth of gambling packs. Yes, it's absolutely gambling.
Edited by xenophobe - 11/20/17 at 10:58pm
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post #159 of 203
While i dont mind them regulating lootboxes or plainly just making them ilegal, if purchased as its nothing wrong as a reward type system, i find it cery ironic that everyone is blaming big ol bad EA the devil company for their practises. Where was everyone when Blizzard announced it in Overwatch or Hearthstone? How abou Riot Games allowing tou to buy keys / chests or random champions / skins?

Lets take it another step. What about trading card games in general? Or half the mobile games.

Some games have had purchased loot boxes for cosmetics others game affecting rewards. Why is it any different that a loot box contains a skin vs the actual champion. Its still gambling as you hope tou get what you want.

But people like targetting EA. Everyone else is doing it for the gamers wink.gif
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post #160 of 203
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firann View Post

While i dont mind them regulating lootboxes or plainly just making them ilegal, if purchased as its nothing wrong as a reward type system, i find it cery ironic that everyone is blaming big ol bad EA the devil company for their practises. Where was everyone when Blizzard announced it in Overwatch or Hearthstone? How abou Riot Games allowing tou to buy keys / chests or random champions / skins?

Lets take it another step. What about trading card games in general? Or half the mobile games.

Some games have had purchased loot boxes for cosmetics others game affecting rewards. Why is it any different that a loot box contains a skin vs the actual champion. Its still gambling as you hope tou get what you want.

But people like targetting EA. Everyone else is doing it for the gamers wink.gif



People are targeting EA cause they are the first to get investigated ?
And because there system of cards etc gives players in game benefits over other people.

Skins do not do that.

I personally think lootboxes should be rewards for completing tasks in game,
Play one game = WD on first game here is a loot box (reward)
Kill first boss = WD on first boss kill, here is a lootbox (reward)

I do not think that any game that you pay for, should ask you for more money in game,
F2P sure, go for it.



Again i say, the only games that should have any kind of in game currency are RPG,
Because you spend this while you play on items, potions etc.
Battlefront only has an ingame currency to buy things when not in game
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