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Txmstrjoe's Push-Pull Experiments with a Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme - Page 2

post #11 of 18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post
Thanks!
    
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post #12 of 18
One of the moderators posted a push-pull experiment a while back as well... Basically, it can help a bit but huge diminishing returns.
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post #13 of 18
Wouldn't it be noisy if the fan that pushes is more powerful than the one that pulls?
    
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post #14 of 18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weltall View Post
Wouldn't it be noisy if the fan that pushes is more powerful than the one that pulls?
That was my finding, yes.

But that was also at least partly because the less powerful fan (the SilenX 120mm x 38mm) was overwhelmed by a long way compared to the pushing Thermaltake A2018 Blue LED fan with which it was paired.

Generally speaking, though, two fans are always louder and noisier than just one.
    
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post #15 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by txtmstrjoe View Post
That was my finding, yes.

But that was also at least partly because the less powerful fan (the SilenX 120mm x 38mm) was overwhelmed by a long way compared to the pushing Thermaltake A2018 Blue LED fan with which it was paired.

Generally speaking, though, two fans are always louder and noisier than just one.
Two fans will always be louder than one of the same fan. However, the additional noise is not linear.
dB Adding Program here: www.cpemma.co.uk/decibels.zip


However, you can get two fans that run quieter than one loud fan and performance can be the same.
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post #16 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Duke View Post
How about dedicating the pull side directly ducted to the case exhaust fan. A couple cut up and glued 2 liter pop bottles work wonders
I may try this someday, actually.

I must confess to some feelings of vanity, however. My case has a window.

Silly, I know, to have such feelings of vanity, but I'd be dishonest if I didn't admit to them. On the other hand, the failed engineer in me has long been intrigued by this solution, so I may make this mod someday, if only to try it out.
    
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post #17 of 18
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post
Temperature is always dependent on ambient (when using passive cooling).

The issue then is that the HSF is not efficent enough. I posted a push-pull experiment a few weeks ago using a quad 120mm heatercore. Temperatures varied by 1-3C.
I wonder if these same principles apply to HSFs as they do to radiators?

I mean, my instinct is that they do, because all we're really dealing with here is a difference in media when it comes to heat transference. Obviously, with HSFs the carrier is whatever substance is inside the heatpipes; with radiators, the liquid transfers the heat. The fins on the HSF and the radiators serve exactly the same purpose, yes? (A means to spread the surface area, to facilitate heat transference from the media to the airflow.)

But, as you say, air cooling is much less efficient than water-cooling. Could this (at least partly) explain why there was no improvement in cooling performance with push-pull in my experiment?

Thanks so much for lending your expertise in this!
    
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post #18 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by txtmstrjoe View Post
For the past couple of weeks, I've been conducting some cooling experiments, just to see if some ideas work better than others.

One of these ideas is using two 120mm x 25mm fans on a Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme in a push-pull arrangement.

I experimented with various pairs of fans with varying CFM ratings. Moreover, I also experimented with differing fan speeds, with one fan on constant speed (basically full speed, plugged into a motherboard fan header) and its partner hooked up to a fan controller, to both fans in the pair controlled by the fan controller on one channel (spin-ups and spin-downs synchronized).

My informal testing revealed that no matter which fans were paired, and no matter how much CFMs were moving through the fins, the temperature readings were more dependent on the ambient temperatures than anything else. The hotter the ambients were, the higher the core temperatures.

There was one obvious effect and advantage to a push-pull setup, though: Cool downs were substantially accelerated. Within three seconds of terminating a full-load stress test program, the temperature readings settled down onto "idle" conditions.

Here are the various fans and configurations tested:
Silverstone FM121 120mm x 25mm (paired) - By far, the noisiest pairing
Thermaltake Blue LED A2018 120mm x 25mm (paired) - Very effective
Thermaltake Blue LED A2018 120mm x 25mm (push) + Silenx Ixtrema 120mm x 38mm (pull) - Noisy because the Thermaltake at full-tilt is quite loud
Silenx Ixtrema 120mm x 38mm (push) + Thermaltake Blue LED A2018 120mm x 25mm (pull) - Not very effective in terms of temperatures
Thermaltake A2029 120mm x 25mm (paired) - A little whiny, but is the most effective by a shade over its Blue LED sisters

I've included some pictures, which show how to transform a single-fan Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme to accept two fans: Zip-ties!

Hope someone finds this useful.
This is your test bed--and if someone was looking to use a fan on that partiuclar heatsink you have provided valuable data. How the fans work in other applications is not tested and remains an unknown.

I do find this useful and think it is someting we need more of here on the Forum.
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