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post #31 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melcar View Post
Content manipulation? I honestly don't know how one can rationalize such claims. All businesses fall under a sort of "fair business practices". Market pressure, consumer protection groups, and ultimately the consumer will force said corporations to be "honest".
Anyways, ISPs want a fair return on their investments. Wouldn't you want a fair return on your investments? Companies that make their living from the internet (google, yahoo, etc) are the lying thieves here, and they are playing everyone like a fool.
1. The worlds wealthiest individual is no longer Bill Gates, it is actually Mexican Telecom Giant, Carlos Helu...who made his fortune supplying internet access to almost all of central and south America if I am not mistaken (among other savvy investments) ----- suffice it to say, the ISPs are making enough money to choke Roman Abramovich

2. Consumer protection groups and the consumers are forcing corps. to be honest???? I mean, that is just downright naive. To wit: Bhopal, Woburn, MCI Worldcom, ENRON, Anderson Scandal, Ford/Firestone...to name just a few failings

I just don't see how there are any beneficiaries to Fee For Bandwidth other than the ISPs...

...hopefully I am wrong
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post #32 of 78
I agree, Corporations by law are obliged to turn a proft. This is where the idea of efficiency over government regulation comes from. Let's not get the two confused, efficiency doesn't necessarily mean that the corporation is doing the right thing, it's simply performing that task at the highest percieved productive output. Sometimes a corporation may introduce policies that streamline their product while government regulation struggles to keep up. For example, Gene-transfer technologies already are being used to transfer human genes into farm animals such as sheep and goats for the purpose of generating large quantities of expensive human proteins for use as pharmaceuticals. (Denise K. Casey - GENES, DREAMS, AND REALITY The promises and risks of the NEW GENETICS) There exists evidence that some of these animals have entered into our food chain (I hope tht wasn't lamb chops you had for dinner, you canabal!). Now decide, where does your moral compass guide you. You may think that the above example is unrelated, but it does illustrate a point about the questionable moral corruption present in 'the corporation'.
    
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post #33 of 78
Stuff Like this makes me wish I was Canadian. Corrupt Coperation Bastards
    
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post #34 of 78
Who are the biggest losers if net neutrality fails and why? Answer me this. Hint: It's not the consumer, not by a long shot. Who gains the most if net neutrality succeeds? Again, it's not the consumer. If you can answer those questions then you can understand "net neutrality". The consumer is just stuck in the middle of two giants fighting for ever bigger profit margins.

As for corporate scandals/corruption... who is the one that ends up uncovering these nefarious acts? Isn't ultimately the "end-user" that unveils the truth? Or is it that these same corporations, overwhelmed by guilt, incriminate themselves? The market, with the help of limited regulation, takes care of itself.
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post #35 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melcar View Post
Who are the biggest losers if net neutrality fails and why? Answer me this. Hint: It's not the consumer, not by a long shot. Who gains the most if net neutrality succeeds? Again, it's not the consumer. If you can answer those questions then you can understand "net neutrality". The consumer is just stuck in the middle of two giants fighting for ever bigger profit margins.

As for corporate scandals/corruption... who is the one that ends up uncovering these nefarious acts? Isn't ultimately the "end-user" that unveils the truth? Or is it that these same corporations, overwhelmed by guilt, incriminate themselves? The market, with the help of limited regulation, takes care of itself.
Come again? Sorry but I'm only from Wyoming and those der wordsare to confusin. (JK ) But seriously, what?
    
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post #36 of 78
I say we just start a new interweb

Oh well, I guess we'll just have to see what happens. And hopefully there will be net neutrality legislation put into effect, otherwise we Americans haven't elected our officials properly
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post #37 of 78
I know what you're saying Melcar, that Content Providers are battling to prevent from paying Service Providers for a service that they enjoy freely, however the importance in disallowing ISP's from determining just who gets priority bandwidth is that the ISP's don't really care who pays them, as long as they get paid. Now is there not something inherantly dangerous in that? Perhaps susceptibility to interest groups?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Burn View Post
I say we just start a new interweb
oh boy, me thinks we're gonna need a whole lotta 'tubes' fer this new interweb!
    
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post #38 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Burn View Post
I say we just start a new interweb

Oh well, I guess we'll just have to see what happens. And hopefully there will be net neutrality legislation put into effect, otherwise we Americans haven't elected our officials properly
lol haven't Elected officials properly! Realy....
    
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post #39 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noble Savage View Post
I know what you're saying Melcar, that Content Providers are battling to prevent from paying Service Providers for a service that they enjoy freely, however the importance in disallowing ISP's from determining just who gets priority bandwidth is that the ISP's don't really care who pays them, as long as they get paid. Now is there not something inherantly dangerous in that? Perhaps susceptibility to interest groups?



oh boy, me thinks we're gonna need a whole lotta 'tubes' fer this new interweb!

I really don't see where everyone gets the idea of illegal content censoring and/or favouritism. Content providers will be required to pay whatever fee is established for a certain service. Said services will still be affordable since we are in an open market (ISPs want to make money anyways). If favouritism does occur, content providers can make use of the fabulous American legal system.
And as for the "little man"... why would ISPs hike up their prices so as to not allow their costumers affordable access? The fear of competition always keeps the big guys in check.
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post #40 of 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melcar View Post
I really don't see where everyone gets the idea of illegal content censoring and/or favouritism. Content providers will be required to pay whatever fee is established for a certain service. Said services will still be affordable since we are in an open market (ISPs want to make money anyways). If favouritism does occur, content providers can make use of the fabulous American legal system.
And as for the "little man"... why would ISPs hike up their prices so as to not allow their costumers affordable access? The fear of competition always keeps the big guys in check.
Dude, the reason why ISP are lobbying for a tiered 'Internets' is so that they can expedite service to those companies who decide to pay for priority access for their customers - ie. favoritism.

The whole concept is marked by $$$. Right now every member of the 'internets' enjoy a level playing field. A tiered system will considerably disrupt access to content. What "little man" will be able to afford these legal fees, then again why should they have to? The way you're explaining it, it sounds like we'll be double charged - for content and service!?!

Now, imagine that a Government Administration decides to conduct an illegal war in a far off country for the sake of securing energy resources to fuel it's unstable economy, however an unregulated source of information pertaining to said conflict would potentially have a damaging effect on morale and domestic support for said war. The Administration, being responsible will not stand by idly and allow this content to disrupt their strategy, any and all tools available that conform to their percieved level of censorship is fair game...Ya, you guessed it, I'm taking a cue from present day where news media had to catch up with what was being brodcast on the internet, finally providing some semblence of parity in war coverage, now imagine if we didn't have that counter balance like we do now.

Look at it this way, the 'internets' as it is now, provides us with an alternative that is free from 'manufactured consent' (Noam Chomsky). The government isn't trying impose regulation, it's trying to prevent corporate monopolistic domination tactics.
    
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