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Yet another RAID question...

post #1 of 14
Thread Starter 
Hi, I'm going to overhaul my PC with a new graphics card, CPU, mobo and RAM, PSU and HDDs (Essentially a new machine) and wondered about HDDs. I've never had a SATA drive before, but from what I've read it's basically the same, except you might need a floppy to install your OS.

I want a smallish drive about 160gb to keep all my programs and OS on, and don't really want to spash out on a Raptor, but would consider putting two in a RAID0 array to increase the speed a bit. Would putting two 160Gb 7200RPM drives in a RAID0 array show much improvement over a single drive?

And I wanted to have about 800Gb to 1Tb of space to store movies and music on. So I thought I'd probably look at 4* 400Gb Samsung Spinpoint SATA2 drives and put them in a RAID. However, would a simple RAID1 be the best option to ensure everything is backed up correctly? Or would something like RAID5 or even RAID6 be better?

Also, is it possible to have two RAID arrays in one system? Are there any decent Core 2 Duo motherboards that support this?

Thanks for the time to read this, I really appriciate it,
A.
    
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post #2 of 14
RAID0+1 and RAID10 are not quite exactly the same. Their failure pattern is slight different. When one HD fails in RAID 0+1, it becomes RAID0. If one HD fails in RAID10, it becomes RAID1. Therefore, RAID10 is slightly better since it can survive two HD failures (but an unlikely scenario). In any case, either one is perfect for high performance with high redundency.


Don't bother with RAID5 unless you have a $200+ RAID card. It takes has too much overhead with parity calculations.

Why the Samsung Spinpoint? The Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 or the new 7200.11 perform better.
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post #3 of 14
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the quick response, but I changed my question slightly, as I realised that I want the array for just storage, so speed isn't a massive issue. And I didn't realise about the 7200.10 or 7200.11 drives, the Spinpoint just caught my eye as it was pretty cheap. What would you say is the best option for 4 drives where data redundancy is the main issue?
    
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Athlon 64 939 3200+ 2Ghz Can't remember! 7900GT 256Mb 1.5Gb Generic PC3200 
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Logitech standard Generic 400w (Hiper 550w Died) akasa Zen in black Logitech MX518 
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post #4 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aar0n View Post
Thanks for the quick response, but I changed my question slightly, as I realised that I want the array for just storage, so speed isn't a massive issue. And I didn't realise about the 7200.10 or 7200.11 drives, the Spinpoint just caught my eye as it was pretty cheap. What would you say is the best option for 4 drives where data redundancy is the main issue?
It is very very very unlikly that a desktop user will ever suffer multiple HD failure within a month (time for your to RMA) with just 4 HDs.

RAID10 or 0+1 is your best option for high redundancy.

Another option is just to get two 400-500MB HDs in RAID1. Then get an external 1TB HD to do occassional manual back ups. HD failure isn't the only way to loss your data.
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post #5 of 14
Thread Starter 
So even with speed not being an issue at all, RAID10 is better than RAID1? Or would I have to use RAID10 with 4 disks rather than just RAID1? If I had say 4 500Gb drives with RAID10, how much space would I actually be able to store stuff on? Just 500Gb?
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Athlon 64 939 3200+ 2Ghz Can't remember! 7900GT 256Mb 1.5Gb Generic PC3200 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
750Gb in total, one day >1Tb NEC DVD+-RW *2 Vista x86, tuned, stripped down Samsung SyncMaster 940BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech standard Generic 400w (Hiper 550w Died) akasa Zen in black Logitech MX518 
Mouse Pad
Entire desk 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Athlon 64 939 3200+ 2Ghz Can't remember! 7900GT 256Mb 1.5Gb Generic PC3200 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
750Gb in total, one day >1Tb NEC DVD+-RW *2 Vista x86, tuned, stripped down Samsung SyncMaster 940BW 
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post #6 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aar0n View Post
So even with speed not being an issue at all, RAID10 is better than RAID1? Or would I have to use RAID10 with 4 disks rather than just RAID1? If I had say 4 500Gb drives with RAID10, how much space would I actually be able to store stuff on? Just 500Gb?
No, 4xHD in RAID1 is still more redundent. However, it is really not need since it would be extremely rare for multiple HDs failure at about the same time. Also, the cost-benefit doesn't make sense.

(assuming 4x 500GB HDs)
RAID10: Can survive two HD failures, noticable performance increase, 1TB of storage
RAID1: Can survive three HD failures, 500MB of storage
RAID0+1: Can survive one (sometimes two) HD failure, noticable performance increase, 1TB of storage
RAID5: Can survive one HD failure, slight performance increase, 1.5TB of storage


Again, RAID1 and an external backup is your best bet if data is very important to you. Data can be loss in more than one way. If your PC is stolen or an electrical surge destroys your PC, RAID won't save you.
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i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
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Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
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post #7 of 14
Thread Starter 
I'm really looking for the most storage AND the best redundancy and I doubt more than one drive will fail in the time it takes to get a new one. So assuming that the only way I'll loose my data is with a drive failure, would RAID5 be the best way to go? I don't need it to survive anything other than drive failure, and don't need any extra speed.

Or would it be worth while using RAID10 and also having my OS on the same set of drives? Would I be able to partition the drives if I was using RAID10, and again, is there a particular motherboard that offers much better performance whilst using RAID10?

Thanks so much for your time taken to answer,
A.
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Athlon 64 939 3200+ 2Ghz Can't remember! 7900GT 256Mb 1.5Gb Generic PC3200 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
750Gb in total, one day >1Tb NEC DVD+-RW *2 Vista x86, tuned, stripped down Samsung SyncMaster 940BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech standard Generic 400w (Hiper 550w Died) akasa Zen in black Logitech MX518 
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Entire desk 
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Athlon 64 939 3200+ 2Ghz Can't remember! 7900GT 256Mb 1.5Gb Generic PC3200 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
750Gb in total, one day >1Tb NEC DVD+-RW *2 Vista x86, tuned, stripped down Samsung SyncMaster 940BW 
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post #8 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aar0n View Post
I'm really looking for the most storage AND the best redundancy and I doubt more than one drive will fail in the time it takes to get a new one. So assuming that the only way I'll loose my data is with a drive failure, would RAID5 be the best way to go? I don't need it to survive anything other than drive failure, and don't need any extra speed.

Or would it be worth while using RAID10 and also having my OS on the same set of drives? Would I be able to partition the drives if I was using RAID10, and again, is there a particular motherboard that offers much better performance whilst using RAID10?

Thanks so much for your time taken to answer,
A.

RAID5 performance varies greatly so I tend to be wary of it without a smart controller. For your needs, it might be ok. However, do realize that restoration of a bad disk takes longer. With RAID1, the bad HD is replaced and the backup data is a straight copy. With RAID5, the bad HD is replaced and the backup data has to be calculated with data from the other HDs.

Yes, you can partition any RAID. Your OS will see it as just one big disk. You can do everything to it like any other disk. OS on it would be fine.

All motherboard are generally software RAID. For what I have seen, the Intel chipsets are better at RAID than nVidia ones.
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Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
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Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
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post #9 of 14
Thread Starter 
So, in your opinion, what solution would be best? If I'm going to use 4* 500Gb for both music, movies AND the OS and programs?

Would RAID10 be the best? Or should I use RAID5? Thanks again.
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Athlon 64 939 3200+ 2Ghz Can't remember! 7900GT 256Mb 1.5Gb Generic PC3200 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
750Gb in total, one day >1Tb NEC DVD+-RW *2 Vista x86, tuned, stripped down Samsung SyncMaster 940BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech standard Generic 400w (Hiper 550w Died) akasa Zen in black Logitech MX518 
Mouse Pad
Entire desk 
  hide details  
Reply
    
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Athlon 64 939 3200+ 2Ghz Can't remember! 7900GT 256Mb 1.5Gb Generic PC3200 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
750Gb in total, one day >1Tb NEC DVD+-RW *2 Vista x86, tuned, stripped down Samsung SyncMaster 940BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Logitech standard Generic 400w (Hiper 550w Died) akasa Zen in black Logitech MX518 
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post #10 of 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aar0n View Post
So, in your opinion, what solution would be best? If I'm going to use 4* 500Gb for both music, movies AND the OS and programs?

Would RAID10 be the best? Or should I use RAID5? Thanks again.
RAID5 would probably be best if you don't care about performance and complexity
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7 920 [4.28GHz, HT] Asus P6T + Broadcom NetXtreme II VisionTek HD5850 [900/1200] + Galaxy GT240 2x4GB G.Skill Ripjaw X [1632 MHz] 
Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
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Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
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Hard DriveOSMonitorKeyboard
Intel X25-M 160GB + 3xRAID0 500GB 7200.12 Window 7 Pro 64 Acer H243H + Samsung 226BW XARMOR-U9BL  
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Antec Truepower New 750W Li Lian PC-V2100 [10x120mm fans] Logitech G9 X-Trac Pro 
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