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Xbox 360 Price Cut Due Aug. 1st! $199 Core - Page 6

post #51 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterKromm View Post
http://www.overclock.net/news-overcl...xbox-360s.html

They have a fatal design flaw, that doesn't mean it crap hardware necessarily, just flawed. Considering ALL units have the potential to up and die I'd be pissed too. A 33% failure rate is garbage, if this were a car or any other product there would most assuredly be a recall. This is M$ though and they want to minimize the losses over this design flaw.
Ok why does everyone believe the 33% BS? Id like to see some real numbers. Someone just says it and everyone believes it. Theres no way theres been 3 million RMAs...thats like having every single person in greater Phoenix have their 360 break on them. Theres no way its that big of a number.
Very nice!
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Very nice!
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post #52 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by J3r3my View Post
Ok why does everyone believe the 33% BS? Id like to see some real numbers. Someone just says it and everyone believes it. Theres no way theres been 3 million RMAs...thats like having every single person in greater Phoenix have their 360 break on them. Theres no way its that big of a number.
http://www.crn.com.au/story.aspx?CII...&src=site-marq

Quote:
Microsoft has admitted that every one of the 11.6 million Xbox 360 consoles sold in the past 19 months suffers from a design flaw that could cause the device to fail.
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,13...s/article.html

Quote:
Anecdotal evidence suggests the Xbox 360 failure rate may be as high as one of every three machines according to retailers.

"The real number [of Xbox 360 failure rates] is between 30 to 33 percent," said one former EB Games employee. An anonymous Best Buy employee said the failure rate for the console was "between a quarter to a third" of all units sold.

An EB Games current employee claimed a 1 in 4 failure rate when speaking to GamePro.

Many stores have revised warranty policies in addition to increasing the price of in-store warranties "solely due to the failure rate of the Xbox 360" says Daily Tech. In addition, the report states that EB Games nearly doubled the price of its one-year, over-the-counter warranty.

By comparison, one EB Games retailer said the single store failure rate of PS3s was less than one per cent and conceded that "in the hundreds of Wii units sold at that location thus far, zero have come back as defective."

Microsoft has said before that its Xbox 360 failure rate is "well within industry standards" of 3-5%, but decline to disclose the actual number even in light of recent media and consumer scrutiny.
Maybe the 33% number isn't completely accurate, in actuality the number could be higher or lower... One would imagine it would be in a company's best interest to discredit/dispel any misconceptions regarding a product they offer. Sure it would be nice to know the real numbers, but who would you imagine is privy to such information? I doubt M$ will let the real figure ever see the light of day, especially if its as high 25%-33%.

Hey instead of speculating I'll toss in some empirical data. I happen to have ten good friends who have at some point over the last 19 months bought a xbox 360. Of the ten, six have thoroughly enjoyed their xbox 360 and to date have yet to suffer from the dreaded "red ring of death". The other four aren't so lucky infact 1 of them is now on his 3rd xbox 360.

But until M$ comes out and releases the real figures we simply won't know... I believe a strong message was sent when Microsoft set aside in excess of 1bn usd to address the problem. Do the math thats roughly $100 per console so if 1/3 of consoles will only be in need of repairs that then becomes $300 M$ has set aside. I'm guessing $300 per console is about right for the production cost. So is 33% that much of a stretch when in truth M$ has set aside the exact amount of money to cover such a failure rate?

OT- I don't own a xbox 360 or PS3. Don't assume I'm some fanboi regurgitating whatever I may happen upon.
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post #53 of 61
There's no use in trying to come up with figures yourself by using Microsoft's statement that they're putting aside $ 1 billion to $ 1.5 billion because many things have to be put into account. Microsoft had to identify the problem, update all their production lines, put money into their repair and replacement centers, pay for shipping to and from, reimburse previous RMAs, fix current consoles being sent it, etc.

You can't just eye ball the numbers to a certain range so I wouldn't even bother until we see hard proof of this entire situation, which I doubt we will.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterKromm View Post
OT- I don't own a xbox 360 or PS3. Don't assume I'm some fanboi regurgitating whatever I may happen upon.
See? This is how said it has become on this site. When you have to put a disclaimer on your posts, you know there are too many idiots trolling.
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post #54 of 61
Where i live, the recent price drop of the ps3 really looks inviting, $499.99 (CAD) X360, vs 549.99 PS3 at futureshop, 50 bucks for a b-ray player sounds like a good deal, lol
    
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post #55 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by thenut View Post
There's no use in trying to come up with figures yourself by using Microsoft's statement that they're putting aside $ 1 billion to $ 1.5 billion because many things have to be put into account. Microsoft had to identify the problem, update all their production lines, put money into their repair and replacement centers, pay for shipping to and from, reimburse previous RMAs, fix current consoles being sent it, etc.

You can't just eye ball the numbers to a certain range so I wouldn't even bother until we see hard proof of this entire situation, which I doubt we will.
I quasi agreed with what you stated in my OP, in that we won't know the accurate spot on % until some sort of reliable source comes forward. That source can only be M$, any (r)etailer that would dare come out and publicly state for the record the failure rates they're seeing would be tantamount to suicide(If the % is high). It may not be completely fair to "eye ball the #s" but its all we have to go on at the moment, and only Microsoft can change that.

I am curious... I gave an empirical account of xbox 360s failures. Surely you have some similar personal experiences to support or deny the ~33% failure rate?

Quote:
See? This is how said it has become on this site. When you have to put a disclaimer on your posts, you know there are too many idiots trolling.
I'm not trying to troll, although I do enjoy playing devils advocate at times...
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Calculon Ω
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post #56 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterKromm View Post
I quasi agreed with what you stated in my OP, in that we won't know the accurate spot on % until some sort of reliable source comes forward. That source can only be M$, any (r)etailer that would dare come out and publicly state for the record the failure rates they're seeing would be tantamount to suicide(If the % is high). It may not be completely fair to "eye ball the #s" but its all we have to go on at the moment, and only Microsoft can change that.
I believe that it's a waste of time, that's all I was saying. Trying to look at how much money Microsoft is putting behind this issue and the rumored number of failure rates will get you nowhere. We don't know how much any of this stuff costs. Not just individual console repairs but production line changes, design revisions, etc.

Feel free to delve into the topic and come up with something you feel is accurate but I think it's a wasted effort.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterKromm View Post
I am curious... I gave an empirical account of xbox 360s failures. Surely you have some similar personal experiences to support or deny the ~33% failure rate?
I wouldn't consider anything we've seen empirical at this point, not in the overall sense. Individual experience yes but not across the entire market. Don't get me wrong, I'm on my 5th 360. However they were all for different reasons, one not even related to an actual problem, one just because I'm anal and one most likely related employee handling of stock. Everyone has their own experience but it can vary so widely that it just isn't going to give us a decent overall picture.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterKromm View Post
I'm not trying to troll, although I do enjoy playing devils advocate at times...
FYI, I wasn't calling you a troll. I was saying that it is sad that people have to put a disclaimer on their posts just because it may put a negative or positive light on a company.
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post #57 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by thenut View Post
I believe that it's a waste of time, that's all I was saying. Trying to look at how much money Microsoft is putting behind this issue and the rumored number of failure rates will get you nowhere. We don't know how much any of this stuff costs. Not just individual console repairs but production line changes, design revisions, etc.

Feel free to delve into the topic and come up with something you feel is accurate but I think it's a wasted effort.



I wouldn't consider anything we've seen empirical at this point, not in the overall sense. Individual experience yes but not across the entire market. Don't get me wrong, I'm on my 5th 360. However they were all for different reasons, one not even related to an actual problem, one just because I'm anal and one most likely related employee handling of stock. Everyone has their own experience but it can vary so widely that it just isn't going to give us a decent overall picture.
As I see it your reasoning is fallacious, you are appealing to ignorance in the form:
There is no evidence for p. Therefore not-p.

The burden of proof lies with microsoft, otherwise they are simply suppressing the data, something they would/should readily have too.

Although I too am appealing to ignorance in the form:
There is no evidence against p. therefore p.

Though in this case there is a lot of evidence to support a greater than avg. failure rate... But I can't help myself I'm a contrarian . I just enjoy arguing.

Quote:
FYI, I wasn't calling you a troll. I was saying that it is sad that people have to put a disclaimer on their posts just because it may put a negative or positive light on a company.
Oh I gathered that much. I was simply affirming that for anyone else who might chime in and think otherwise.

Gnite all, I'm tired its 2:45am and I need to be up @ 5:55am...

*OT* I just joined carforum.net, if anyone has any experience w/ 95 v6 3.4L Camaro come and give me some advice!
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post #58 of 61
I don't think either of us is seriously considering pure accuracy with our reasoning, just giving in to speculation. Which is fine and actually amusing, but just keep in mind that both views could be completely wrong.

At long last someone agrees with me. Being able to contradict yourself is an amazing thing. It opens your world up to so many more possibilities.
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post #59 of 61
Wow...finally. Any more credible sources for this info?
     
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post #60 of 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by thenut View Post
At long last someone agrees with me. Being able to contradict yourself is an amazing thing. It opens your world up to so many more possibilities.
Oh contradiction is truly remarkable, it allows for transcendent cynicism. I thoroughly enjoy arguing/debating a position whether I agree with it or not, and once some agrees with my assertion I'll flip around and admit I was merely playing devils advocate and actually agreed with their original assertion. The look of simultaneous anger and confusion is incredibly amusing.

It is humorous seeing people(here on OCN) defending their positions so adamantly. Its as if someone has compromised their core values/core beliefs and they're defending their own self worth which has in one way or another become intertwined with a seemingly unrelated product or company.

*On topic*

If these price drops are real I will probably buy a xbox 360 in the fall when I have some discretionary income and the 65nm process is introduced.

*EDIT* This post was more a rhetorical than anything else.
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