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post #2001 of 2014
Thread Starter 
The max FSB will hold you back. The X48 chipset is only able to push the FSB so far, and it is a little more difficult with quad cores. You will find you need a lot of voltage to the northbridge to get a FSB above 470. With the latest Rampage Formula (bios can be cross flashed to the P5E Deluxe) I was able to push 490 FSB, but it still took a lot of voltage to the NB. The P45 was the magic chipset that really allowed high FSB speeds for quad core OCing. The Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3 series is an example of a great quad core OCing motherboard. You will see 525+ FSB OCs with it.

As for the DDR2 1000 memory, yes it will help you OC. They will allow you to thoretically reach 500 FSB.
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post #2002 of 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericeod View Post

The max FSB will hold you back. The X48 chipset is only able to push the FSB so far, and it is a little more difficult with quad cores. You will find you need a lot of voltage to the northbridge to get a FSB above 470. With the latest Rampage Formula (bios can be cross flashed to the P5E Deluxe) I was able to push 490 FSB, but it still took a lot of voltage to the NB. The P45 was the magic chipset that really allowed high FSB speeds for quad core OCing. The Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3 series is an example of a great quad core OCing motherboard. You will see 525+ FSB OCs with it.
As for the DDR2 1000 memory, yes it will help you OC. They will allow you to thoretically reach 500 FSB.

Thanks for the reply. What was the maximum safe NB Voltage again? And I mean for an aircooled 24/7 setup obviously, and the Fortress FT02 should provide really good cooling for the northbridge, don't you think?

But I'm surprised at your claim that the chipset will be the limting factor. Now I know I only use an old 65nm dual core and 45nm quads puts a much higher load on the chipset, but I can reach 500FSB with stock NB Voltage (1.25V), maybe even higher but that's something I can't verify because my memory doesn't go higher than 1000 MHz. Gonna try aiming higher tonight though, so we'll see but I doubt it will go any higher than that.

One last thing, how much higher can I go on the FSB if I flash in the RF BIOS?
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post #2003 of 2014
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frozenclock View Post

Thanks for the reply. What was the maximum safe NB Voltage again? And I mean for an aircooled 24/7 setup obviously, and the Fortress FT02 should provide really good cooling for the northbridge, don't you think?
But I'm surprised at your claim that the chipset will be the limting factor. Now I know I only use an old 65nm dual core and 45nm quads puts a much higher load on the chipset, but I can reach 500FSB with stock NB Voltage (1.25V), maybe even higher but that's something I can't verify because my memory doesn't go higher than 1000 MHz. Gonna try aiming higher tonight though, so we'll see but I doubt it will go any higher than that.
One last thing, how much higher can I go on the FSB if I flash in the RF BIOS?

Dual core OCing and quad core OCing are 2 different animals. I used to believe the same as you that if a dual core could do 500+ FSB, so could a quad core. But it makes a huge difference. As for the NB voltage, I wouldnt try and push it past 1.55v with air. I think 1.65v is good for WCing though.

As for flashing to the RF bios, you will be able to tweak the ram much more, and you will have finer tunning of your bios settings.
Edited by ericeod - 4/6/12 at 6:46am
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post #2004 of 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericeod View Post

Dual coreOCing and quad core OCing are 2 different animals. I used to believe the same as you that id a dual core could do 500+ FSB, so could a quad core. But it makes a huge difference. As for the NB voltage, I wouldnt try and push it past 1.55v with air. I think 1.65v is good for WCing though.
As for flasjing to the RF bios, you will be able to tweak the ram much more, and you will have finer tonning of your bios settings.

Thanks a lot. But I have some bigger problems at the moment unfortunately. I just installed the Q9450, but my temps were really weird, so I reinstalled the cooler. These are the temps I got.

cpustockautovoltageinbi.jpg

Notice the max temps, I got those when I ran Intel Burn Test. This was with stock settings and auto vcore, with VID being 1.2375V according to Real Temp. I went into the BIOS and changed only the vcore to 1.3875V, I touched nothing else. Here are the results, using IBT to load the CPU once again.

cpustock13875vinbiosnth.jpg

So it looks like none of the temp sensors are working, right? So I don't have any kind info or reference point as to how hot I'm running frown.gif

And also, I have no idea what I'm going to do with LLC. From your first post, I tried reading the links you posted to XS where some people were arguing about the subject, but I'm still uncertain about the issue as to whether or not LLC degrades the CPU. What would you (or anyone else reading this post) suggest, enabled or disabled?
And I would like to keep this CPU for maybe 2-4 years, can't really afford a new system atm.

BTW, I just ran a short test on IBT @ 400 FSB on stock NB voltage and it seems stable. Gonna keep the multi at 6 and try finding max FSB.
Edited by Frozenclock - 4/6/12 at 2:44am
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post #2005 of 2014
Thread Starter 
It looks like you have stuck sensors. run prime 95 and see when the sensors start working. usually once the temps get above where it is stuck (in your case seems to be about 60°C), it will work accurately. As for LLC, you should be OK to use it as long as you dont have the vcore set near the absolute max. If you have a mild vcore OC, the LLC should not spike too high. And as for FSB, with the latest RF bios, I was able to push a Q9650 FSB to about 490 FSB. I had to give a lot of NB voltage, and I was WCing the NB though. You should aim for a 470 FSB.
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post #2006 of 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericeod View Post

It looks like you have stuck sensors. run prime 95 and see when the sensors start working. usually once the temps get above where it is stuck (in your case seems to be about 60°C), it will work accurately. As for LLC, you should be OK to use it as long as you dont have the vcore set near the absolute max. If you have a mild vcore OC, the LLC should not spike too high. And as for FSB, with the latest RF bios, I was able to push a Q9650 FSB to about 490 FSB. I had to give a lot of NB voltage, and I was WCing the NB though. You should aim for a 470 FSB.

In both of the screenshots I posted above I ran IBT for a while, to see if the sensors would start moving. The difference between the screenshots is that in the above one, vcore was set to auto, meaning it should be 1.2375V since that's my VID according to RT. The second screenshot however was taken when running a vcore of 1.3875V, or that's what I set it to in the BIOS anyway. And as you can see if your looking at the maximum values, core 0 shows an increase of 3 degrees, core 1 shows 8 degrees and core 2 & 3 shows 1 degree increase. That doesn't sound correct to me considering the huge increase in voltage, does it?

Regarding the FSB, I got it stable at 458 x 7 using 1.45V on the NB, 1.70V CPU PLL, 1.36V FSB Termination voltage, although I might be able to go lower. So my next plan was to try and reach that same 458 FSB using a multi of 8. Settings so far:

Aiming for 413 x 8 here...

Extreme Tweaker
Ai Overclock Tuner : Manual
CPU Ratio Control : auto
FSB Frequency : 413
FSB Strap to North Bridge : 400
PCI-E Frequency: 100
DRAM Frequency: 826
DRAM Command Rate : auto
DRAM Timing Control: auto

DRAM Static Read Control: Disabled
Ai Clock Twister : Auto
Transaction Booster : Auto

CPU Voltage : 1.375
CPU PLL Voltage : 1.70
North Bridge Voltage : 1.45
DRAM Voltage : 1.8v
FSB Termination Voltage : 1.36
South Bridge Voltage : Minimum (1.5 maybe?)
Loadline Calibration : Disabled
CPU GTL Reference : .63x
North Bridge GTL Reference : .67x
SB 1.5V Voltage : AUTO

CPU Spread Spectrum : Disabled
PCIE Spread Spectrum : Disabled

Those settings are stable. Next I tried 425 x 8, so I upped vcore to 1.3875 which gives me 1.368V @ idle according to CPU-Z. This was a no go, IBT freezed after 5 seconds. Tried different CPU and NB GTL settings including auto. Tried all different Ai Clock Twister settings, and NOTHING. Gonna try playing around with DRAM static read control and maybe LLC, although I really wouldn't want to since I found a recent thread about it on XS, and it seemed like a lot of people was against using it, saying that causes degradation.

If none of this works, I don't know what to do. Intel spec for the CPU clearly says max vcore = 1.3625 and I'm already slightly above it @ idle. Looks like the guy who sold the CPU had OC it quite a lot and has degraded as a result, even though he claimed he had never OC it before, and I asked him AFTER i bought it so I don't see the reason for him to lie.
Edited by Frozenclock - 4/6/12 at 8:48am
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post #2007 of 2014
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I bet the memory's "Common Performance Level" is not set correctly. The higher the number, the easier it is to get stable. And at the higher FSB speeds, you will need to set it from 9-11. I recommend setting it to 11 for now. Also, what is the actual vcore in windows under load as reported by CPU-Z?
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post #2008 of 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericeod View Post

I bet the memory's "Common Performance Level" is not set correctly. The higher the number, the easier it is to get stable. And at the higher FSB speeds, you will need to set it from 9-11. I recommend setting it to 11 for now. Also, what is the actual vcore in windows under load as reported by CPU-Z?

The settings I posted above were correct except vcore which I set to 1.3875V in the BIOS. And tRD which was set to auto, is actually set at 11 as you suggested. Tried this today and it seems fairly stable, altough maybe not 100%. I don't think it's the chipset or memory holding me back, I think it's the CPU. Regarding the vcore, when I set it to 1.3875 in the BIOS with LLC disabled I get 1.368 @ idle in windows according to CPU-Z. At load using IBT it drops to 1.304...that's not too good is it?

It all seems so weird, like it works sometimes with one setting, and when I try the same setting an hour later, it crashes. Anyway, considering the vdroop I get I think I'm gonna try enabling LLC and lower the vcore to something which gives me something like 1.310 under load, maybe 1.33. How does that sound?
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post #2009 of 2014
Thread Starter 
Your LLC idea sounds good. I think the real issue with the dangerous spike which the voltage drop is designed to compensate for is when people are already maxed out on their vcore, and enable LLC. If you have a lower operating vcore like 1.325v for example, LLC should be fine.
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post #2010 of 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericeod View Post

Your LLC idea sounds good. I think the real issue with the dangerous spike which the voltage drop is designed to compensate for is when people are already maxed out on their vcore, and enable LLC. If you have a lower operating vcore like 1.325v for example, LLC should be fine.

Well, I tried enabling LLC. Can't remember what voltage I set it to in the BIOS, but I was idling at 1.344 and under load it would drop to 1.312 most of the time and sometimes 1.304 so I would have to raise vcore even higher, but I don't think I will. Wanna keep this system as it is for a few years, which means I'm gonna back it down to a measly 3.2 GHz, which sucks mad.gif
If I even can get that stable that is...

Currently in windows at 458 x 7 and I'm about to start stress testing, so we'll see how it goes. Gonna try recording temps since I lapped the CPU today, even though it doesn't seem like heat is the problem.

BTW, when I switched CPU I didn't reinstall Windows or anything, and I mean I did absolutely NOTHING. Just took out the old CPU, installed the new one and that's it. It can't be as simple as a software problem, can it?
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