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post #17731 of 28692
Quote:
Originally Posted by decimate View Post
Just for fun...

Not stable in the least, but it validated...
Decimate, have you tried getting that particular overclock to run stable? How about if you drop the memory frequency below stock and re-run the tests? I wouldn't mind seeing that puppy stable at 3Ghz

Good luck
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post #17732 of 28692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hueristic View Post
I can't find the io bandwidth for the 4670 or the 3870.
AGP 8x = 2.1GB/s bandwidth

PCIe 1.x x16 bandwidth = 4 GB/s

But to answer your question bluntly, the HD3870/HD2900Xt was designed to run effectively at PCIe 1.x 8x bandwidth. Which is roughly 2GB/s. So on an AGP bus they are more than fine.

Though, because of that design in the architecture, it's believe that's what also leads to the horrible AA/AF performance of those cards.

Though, it's also believed that when ATi went for the Radeon 4000 series, they fixed that "issue," and so, when you have an ATi HD48xx card in a PCIe 2.0 x8 slot, it has appropriate bandwidth and improved AA/AF performance because it was not designed with a bottleneck in mind like the older RV600's were.
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post #17733 of 28692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
HD4670 = HD3870...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
...
But to answer your question bluntly, the HD3870/HD2900Xt was designed to run effectively at PCIe 1.x 8x bandwidth. Which is roughly 2GB/s. So on an AGP bus they are more than fine.

Though, because of that design in the architecture, it's believe that's what also leads to the horrible AA/AF performance of those cards.

Though, it's also believed that when ATi went for the Radeon 4000 series, they fixed that "issue," and so, when you have an ATi HD48xx card in a PCIe 2.0 x8 slot, it has appropriate bandwidth and improved AA/AF performance because it was not designed with a bottleneck in mind like the older RV600's were.
So IOW your saying the 4XXX will saturate the AGP bus. Which was my original observation.

which you answered with the above quote.

And "It's believed"? What is that someone's hunch? Do you have links?

So please put some facts down bluntly. Or say I don't know. It's not that hard.
post #17734 of 28692
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hueristic View Post
So IOW your saying the 4XXX will saturate the AGP bus. Which was my original observation.
again this is a Yes & No. As it hasn't been tested yet, but the HD4670 doesn't need more bandwidth than the HD3870. So it shouldn't, but it's also a possibility depending on how much data you really need to push through.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hueristic View Post
And "It's believed"? What is that someone's hunch? Do you have links?

So please put some facts down bluntly. Or say I don't know. It's not that hard.
Well the "it's believed" bit comes from the fact of nothing is quite clear about the HD4600 cards, as most people regard them as just an update to the original RV600 chips, some take then as a whole new GPU based off a scaled down RV700 chip. Though, their is no proof to back up either statement.

But as regarded in most testing, the HD4670 beats the HD3870 (both GDDR3 models) and the HD2900Xt (GDDR3 as well) when using AA & AF, though as to this being a new arcitecture or not, no one can really say, as the HD3870 handled AA & AF a bit better than the HD2900Xt, and it's known to be just an updated version of the same core.

So it's all up to speculation, unless someone at ATi states that they actually made a new chip for HD4600, or if they just updated the old design.

As for the AA & AF problems of the RV600 chips, we can't really say why they are bad at it, just that they are bad at AA & AF. ATi didn't give an explanation, and I doubt anyone has the tech to backwards engineer the architecture, nor synthesize/virtulaize it to see where the flaw actually comes from.

But to make it as blunt as possible.

HD4670 is roughly the same performance as the original HD2900Xt. Though, it has a better application of AA & AF.

But I for one, don't believe they just updated the old RV600 chips.

As the HD4670 has less ROPs and a lower Pixel fillrate, but it has a higher Texture Fillrate.
It also has lower memory bandwidth, but that's because of the Bus and not the GPU core.

Either way, if you crunch all the numbers, and look at all the data, it shouldn't perform better than the RV670 or R600 based GPU's. As it has lower clocks, a lower bus, less ROP's, and a lower Pixel Fillrate.

But who knows, they could have just taken the basic design, and really given it a work around. It's not the first time, and it definitely won't be the last, it also helps to save in R&D.
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post #17735 of 28692
Quote:
Originally Posted by thlnk3r View Post
Decimate, have you tried getting that particular overclock to run stable? How about if you drop the memory frequency below stock and re-run the tests? I wouldn't mind seeing that puppy stable at 3Ghz

Good luck
Nah, nothing I have done could get it stable. I tried 2.9 GHz again (seemed stable to me after running Prime95 before), and I got the BSOD after only a couple passes of LinX. Dropped it even further to 2.88, same thing. 2.86, same thing. Finally got frustrated and backed back down to 2.80 where it's been for the last couple of weeks...
post #17736 of 28692
I just tried to play COD4 on a NF4 SLI DR w/a all stock a64 3500+ and 6600 Gphx card w/2x1gig ram. LOL 640 x 480 and still only getting 50-60 FPS.

I think the cpu and gpu are too slow for the game.

So you may wonder why I was doing this in the first place. Well I was trying out something to see if it works. I have so far gotten to level 18 multiplayer and wanted to see if saving the Profiles folder would allow me to transfer my saved stats. I was able to transfer the saved stats but online game play was slow at best on this rig. I feel like Is all I ever really do w/the 939 rigs.
Edited by N2Gaming - 8/10/09 at 4:46pm
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post #17737 of 28692
Tator, that is some good information you posted above

Quote:
Originally Posted by decimate View Post
Nah, nothing I have done could get it stable. I tried 2.9 GHz again (seemed stable to me after running Prime95 before), and I got the BSOD after only a couple passes of LinX. Dropped it even further to 2.88, same thing. 2.86, same thing. Finally got frustrated and backed back down to 2.80 where it's been for the last couple of weeks...
Decimate, bah that stinks. Well the memory frequency speed you have right now is quite impressive. 2.8Ghz coupled with that is nothing to be ashamed of!

Quote:
Originally Posted by N2Gaming View Post
I feel like Is all I ever really do w/the 939 rigs.
N2Gaming, hey no worries bud...that's all I really do now as well. All though I did just pick up X-Plane. Alledgeldy it's a 60GB game (6 dual-layer dvd's) haha.
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post #17738 of 28692
Quote:
Originally Posted by thlnk3r View Post
I did just pick up X-Plane. Alledgeldy it's a 60GB game (6 dual-layer dvd's) haha.
60 GB holy moly Frijoles, that's a lot o beans. You going for your flight pilots license?
Edited by N2Gaming - 8/10/09 at 5:39pm
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post #17739 of 28692
Quote:
Originally Posted by thlnk3r View Post
Tator, that is some good information you posted above
Danke schön
Quote:
Originally Posted by thlnk3r View Post
N2Gaming, hey no worries bud...that's all I really do now as well. All though I did just pick up X-Plane. Alledgeldy it's a 60GB game (6 dual-layer dvd's) haha.
That's bigger than half the Microsoft Flight Sim's combined!
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post #17740 of 28692
Quote:
Originally Posted by N2Gaming View Post
60 GB holy moly Frijoles, that's a lot o beans. You going for your flight pilots license?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
That's bigger than half the Microsoft Flight Sim's combined!
It's insane. I believe the scenery is what takes up all the drive space.

I'm looking forward to flying the SR-71
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