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Help me with my loop! Too much heat! - Page 4

post #31 of 62
The tubing size has less than 1 degree affect on temps, Cathar did an analysis: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=147767

The assumption here is your CPU water block is working correctly. And it would seem your radiator is marginal.

Any of the triples will give over 400 watts. The double is probably closer to 200-250w.

What fans are you using? Push or Pull? Are you using a shroud? Radiators are a high restriction device. As the attached specs and graphs show, there is a trade-off between pressure drop and flow. with higher restrictions, less flow, 38mm have an advantage in creating a pressure drop that draws air through the radiator.

Fans create a vortex of air that conflicts with the straight fins on the radiator. That has an impact for a push fan, not a pull fan.

When the fan is mounted against the radiator, the fan's hub and frame partially block the radiator. A shroud distributes the load over the entire radiator surface. It is easy to fabricate a shroud with 1/8" ID PVC tubing, 1 3/4" or 2" 6-32 or M4 screws, a scissor, and some duct tape.

Do I have empirical data? No...however Ira did a shroud test: http://www.overclock.net/water-cooli...t-shrouds.html.

A Black Ice Extreme, Swiftech 320, and I think an XSPC are all under $70. The Panaflo fans are $15-16 each.

Hope this helps...the results of my own research.

This assumes there are no picked tubes and the pump is working correctly. You can estimate flow with Martin's spreadsheet: http://www.overclock.net/water-cooli...et-v1-4-a.html



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post #32 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnB= Gir View Post
Um what size is your tubing? I would recommend going 1/2" if you haven't already. Those tubes look small to me.

Maybe I'm just goin crazy......
3/8" is fine, the ID of 1/2" fittings is 3/8, you gain nothing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TnB= Gir View Post
No. All you have to buy are new fittings. Not that expensive at all
He already has 1/2 fittings...


At least get a bigger rad and lose the elbows.
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post #33 of 62
38mm fans in pull and shrouds, maybe spacing a little further from the chassis, may be all he needs.
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post #34 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidNJ View Post
38mm fans in pull and shrouds, maybe spacing a little further from the chassis, may be all he needs.
What do you mean by 38mm fans?

At the moment the fans are set to push through but of course theres some hot air coming out of the exhaust fans as well.

How would you recommend I get more spacing between rad and chassis?


I have my eyes on this rad.

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...be1bfe6e19d07d

I'd like to get this but its a bit pricey.

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...ducts_id=20984

I'm also considering an unlikely alternative of getting this and mounting it on the exhaust fan at the back of the case. I may have to worry about flow restrictions then though since my pump isn't all that powerful.

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...ducts_id=22449

Not looking to spend on a new pump right now. I'll probably get a new pump i few months.

A few of you have concerns about the elbows but I can't find any full cover blocks for a 2900 sub $100.
post #35 of 62
Unfortunately, you will have to build your own shroud. I bought some 1/8" ID PVC tubing, cut it to 20mm lengths with a scissor, slid the grill, fan, and tubing spacer on a 2" 6-32 screw, and mounted it on the PULL side of the radiator. then I wrapped around the pair of fans, sealing it to the radiator, with duct tape (ok, I used grip tape, much nicer, and much more expensive).

You could do that with your existing fans.

Your radiator is also very close to the computer. The top fan had a very small space to draw air from. When moving the fans you may want to create spacers (I used 1/8" ID aluminum tubing) to create spacers (1" or so) between the radbox and the radiator.

With 25mm fans on high, a sheet of paper sticks to the inlet side of the radiator.

The 25mm refers to the depth of the fan. The rated flows are against zero resistance, no pressure drop across the fan. The radiator causes a significant pressure drop. The thicker fans create more suction for a given air flow/noise level. Here are some links:
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...oducts_id=1227
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...roducts_id=477
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pa12mesp.html
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pa12hisp.html

Or if you want to really get noisy: http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pa12ulhisp.html

This is the spec sheet, look at the graph: http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/...s/i/fba12G.pdf

This is a spec sheet for the 25mm fans: http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/...s/i/4710kl.pdf

The extra flow should help. If you drove you processor at 1.5 volts with a big OC, it may be 150w. Each of your video cards has 14 power pins, so they are probably adding a total load over 300w. Your radiator is challenged by that.

However, you could do the fans tomorrow, and only be delayed on day on a radiator order, if that.
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post #36 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidNJ View Post
Unfortunately, you will have to build your own shroud. I bought some 1/8" ID PVC tubing, cut it to 20mm lengths with a scissor, slid the grill, fan, and tubing spacer on a 2" 6-32 screw, and mounted it on the PULL side of the radiator. then I wrapped around the pair of fans, sealing it to the radiator, with duct tape (ok, I used grip tape, much nicer, and much more expensive).

You could do that with your existing fans.

Your radiator is also very close to the computer. The top fan had a very small space to draw air from. When moving the fans you may want to create spacers (I used 1/8" ID aluminum tubing) to create spacers (1" or so) between the radbox and the radiator.

With 25mm fans on high, a sheet of paper sticks to the inlet side of the radiator.

The 25mm refers to the depth of the fan. The rated flows are against zero resistance, no pressure drop across the fan. The radiator causes a significant pressure drop. The thicker fans create more suction for a given air flow/noise level. Here are some links:
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...oducts_id=1227
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...roducts_id=477
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pa12mesp.html
http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pa12hisp.html

Or if you want to really get noisy: http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/pa12ulhisp.html

This is the spec sheet, look at the graph: http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/...s/i/fba12G.pdf

This is a spec sheet for the 25mm fans: http://www.panasonic.com/industrial/...s/i/4710kl.pdf

The extra flow should help. If you drove you processor at 1.5 volts with a big OC, it may be 150w. Each of your video cards has 14 power pins, so they are probably adding a total load over 300w. Your radiator is challenged by that.

However, you could do the fans tomorrow, and only be delayed on day on a radiator order, if that.
Thanks for your help. I guess I really didn't have enough appreciation for the placement or depth of my fans. The fans that are on the back now are pretty decent fans, they do 3000rpm and 100cfm fairly quietly.

I'll try to move the fans around today. I have a few older fans I may take the blades out of one of them to make a spacer. I'm interested to see how they work in a pull setup.

Gonna order this radiator today. Should be here in the morning.
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...be1bfe6e19d07d

I'm gonna need a third fan so I'll probably pickup up a few of the panaflows. Really can't deal with too more much noise!

I'll post once I finish with the fans.
post #37 of 62
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deezle98 View Post
3/8" is fine, the ID of 1/2" fittings is 3/8, you gain nothing.

At least get a bigger rad and lose the elbows.
Just what I was thinking, no flow advantage from increasing tube size.

Your radiator isn't big enough! I would either add another rad or change for a 360 or 480, with your loop currently being quite restrictive I would've said that a second rad will kill your flow even more and you might not see an improvement in temperature.

Running all that through a 240 is crazy.
I'm dubious about running my CPU, northbridge and GPU on a BIX 360! Maybe I shouldn't worry.

I think changing the gpu blocks is an expensive way to get more flow. I think your current setup would be fine with a 360, preferably a 480, and some good fans.
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post #38 of 62
Dude you need a much bigger rad for your cards. I have a 4x120mm size rad for mine.....cools well. I would say add a 3x120mm for the 2900XTs and keep the 2x120 for the CPU.
Either that or sell your 2x120 and get a HW Labs GTX480.
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post #39 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karashi View Post

Running all that through a 240 is crazy.
I'm dubious about running my CPU, northbridge and GPU on a BIX 360! Maybe I shouldn't worry.
LOL. Yeah I've gotten quite the scolding for even trying to run this on a 240. I'm getting fairly decent temps running Microsoft Word at the moment.

I'm gonna hold on to the GPU blocks and see how they do with a 360 rad.

New rad should be here in the morning.
post #40 of 62
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by binormalkilla View Post
I would say add a 3x120mm for the 2900XTs and keep the 2x120 for the CPU.
Thought about that as well. Not sure where I'd mount the 240 inside the case though. I'll have to see what I can move around.
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