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Numerous AMD questions

post #1 of 17
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So I just built my 1st AMD rig. I built it for my father in law because I won the mobo, so it is all based around that. It is a PCPartner RD580AKM-AA1D. No idea how the board is, doesn't seem to special but it was free. I bought a 4000+ brisbane 2.1Ghz CPU for it, and since I have only dealt with intel I have some questions.

My biggest concern is, the latest version of CPU-z reads the voltage at 1.77v. The BIOS says 1.3, but why the high voltage in CPU-Z?? That is kinda scary. Also, I want to put just a small OC on it, but I can't even come close to figuring out how to. Is there any guide to OCing one of these things?? So far nothing I have done has resulted in a higher closk at all. Thanks a lot!!

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post #2 of 17
With AMD, overclocking the CPU is fairly straight-forward. The memory can be a little tricky to fully understand, but we can help you get a good overclock without understanding all the details.

Basically, the (total CPU speed) = (reference clock)*(CPU multiplier). I'm not a big fan of half multipliers, so if I were you I'd set the CPU multiplier to 10x, then find the reference clock and start increasing it. The reference clock starts at 200MHz on all AMD systems, and is often called CPU Frequency, CPU Clock Speed, etc in the BIOS. It's probably the only thing that starts at 200MHz in your BIOS's main overclocking menu though. Probably the same screen as the CPU voltage, CPU multiplier, etc.

AMD CPU's are safe up to 1.45-1.50v without worrying, as long as you have an aftermarket cooler. On a stock cooler, I wouldn't give it more than 1.40v and I wouldn't let temps break 55-60*C on load. Anything past 1.50v on air probably isn't a good idea. The X2 4000+ should hit about 2.5-2.6GHz on stock volts. You should get 2.8GHz easily by kicking the voltage up to 1.40-1.45v, and a good X2 4000+ will break 3.0GHz with 1.45-1.50v, but not all will.

The reference clock doesn't just increase the CPU speed, it also overclocks the motherboard's HT Link. The HT multiplier is 5x by default, giving an HT Link of 1000MHz at stock speeds. As you increase the reference clock to overclock the CPU, your HT Link will rise. Every board is different in how it handles this, some like an HT Link of 1200-1400MHz, others won't post past 1080MHz. Anything past 700-800MHz on the HT Link is pointless, so just lower the HT multiplier to 4x around a reference clock of 225-230MHz to be safe, and drop it to 3x around 270MHz. You can also try bumping up the voltage on the NB to get more stability if the board is giving you trouble.

The memory references the CPU to caluclate it's speed, so an overclocked CPU = overclocked memory. It follows this equation:
(Memory speed) = (total CPU speed)/divider
You can lower the memory setting (i.e. DDR2 800, DDR2 667, etc) to increase the divder. If you hope to reach 2.8-3.0GHz, then I'd suggest lowering the memory to DDR2 667 and setting the timings to 5-5-5-15-26-2T and giving the memory 2.2v. You can always tighten the timings more once you max out the CPU. AMD tends to do better with tighter timings versus higher bandwidth, and if you hit 2.8GHz on a DDR2 667 setting and a 10x CPU multiplier, you'll have your memory running at 933MHz. Most Ballistix can be tightened to 4-4-4-12-24-2T at that speed, even the single sided ones.

If you want to do a very thorough overclock, you can isolate each part and find it's limits, then report back here and we'll help you combine the info into a final overclock. I wrote a guide on how to do that here: Socket AM2 OC-ing Guide

Good luck, and enjoy your AMD chip
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post #3 of 17
Great post durch!
post #4 of 17
Good post durch, with 1 thing, this is all based on a MoBo that can OC well and has all these options.
Some cheaper boards will only allow a change from 200 to ~230 for the FSB and no changes (up or down) for the CPU multi. Some allow no voltage changes for memory or CPU. Some allow no change in memory timings or HT multi.

As for the Voltage in CPU-z, it is not always accurate. Mine reads 0.99v all the time, no matter what I have it set at. I have a program that came with my MoBo and it reads exactly the same as BIOS.
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post #5 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by durch View Post
With AMD, overclocking the CPU is fairly straight-forward. The memory can be a little tricky to fully understand, but we can help you get a good overclock without understanding all the details.

Basically, the (total CPU speed) = (reference clock)*(CPU multiplier). I'm not a big fan of half multipliers, so if I were you I'd set the CPU multiplier to 10x, then find the reference clock and start increasing it. The reference clock starts at 200MHz on all AMD systems, and is often called CPU Frequency, CPU Clock Speed, etc in the BIOS. It's probably the only thing that starts at 200MHz in your BIOS's main overclocking menu though. Probably the same screen as the CPU voltage, CPU multiplier, etc.

AMD CPU's are safe up to 1.45-1.50v without worrying, as long as you have an aftermarket cooler. On a stock cooler, I wouldn't give it more than 1.40v and I wouldn't let temps break 55-60*C on load. Anything past 1.50v on air probably isn't a good idea. The X2 4000+ should hit about 2.5-2.6GHz on stock volts. You should get 2.8GHz easily by kicking the voltage up to 1.40-1.45v, and a good X2 4000+ will break 3.0GHz with 1.45-1.50v, but not all will.

The reference clock doesn't just increase the CPU speed, it also overclocks the motherboard's HT Link. The HT multiplier is 5x by default, giving an HT Link of 1000MHz at stock speeds. As you increase the reference clock to overclock the CPU, your HT Link will rise. Every board is different in how it handles this, some like an HT Link of 1200-1400MHz, others won't post past 1080MHz. Anything past 700-800MHz on the HT Link is pointless, so just lower the HT multiplier to 4x around a reference clock of 225-230MHz to be safe, and drop it to 3x around 270MHz. You can also try bumping up the voltage on the NB to get more stability if the board is giving you trouble.

The memory references the CPU to caluclate it's speed, so an overclocked CPU = overclocked memory. It follows this equation:
(Memory speed) = (total CPU speed)/divider
You can lower the memory setting (i.e. DDR2 800, DDR2 667, etc) to increase the divder. If you hope to reach 2.8-3.0GHz, then I'd suggest lowering the memory to DDR2 667 and setting the timings to 5-5-5-15-26-2T and giving the memory 2.2v. You can always tighten the timings more once you max out the CPU. AMD tends to do better with tighter timings versus higher bandwidth, and if you hit 2.8GHz on a DDR2 667 setting and a 10x CPU multiplier, you'll have your memory running at 933MHz. Most Ballistix can be tightened to 4-4-4-12-24-2T at that speed, even the single sided ones.

If you want to do a very thorough overclock, you can isolate each part and find it's limits, then report back here and we'll help you combine the info into a final overclock. I wrote a guide on how to do that here: Socket AM2 OC-ing Guide

Good luck, and enjoy your AMD chip
Thanks for the reply, I think this board is just weird. The first thing I did was bump the reference clock to 250, and the system booted up fine but was still set at 200 (I am using a 10x multi). However I did just try 210, and it is showing up correctly for that.

What is really annoying is my ram will not show a tRCD of 4. I set it to 4 in the BIOS, boot, check CPU-Z and I have it back to 4-6-4-12. Go back into BIOS, sure enough, it is at 6 again. It's driving me nuts

And I really want some info on the voltage if anyone has any. I don't like seeing 1.776v in CPU-Z. My temps are REALLY high with some POS coolermaster hyper TX2 CPU cooler I had lying around here. I have tried reseating it so many times I am running out of AS5. I am starting to wonder if it has anything to do with this high voltage in CPU-Z, eventhough the BIOS says otherwise. So if anyone has any ideas on that one, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
    
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post #6 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by blupupher View Post
Good post durch, with 1 thing, this is all based on a MoBo that can OC well and has all these options.
Some cheaper boards will only allow a change from 200 to ~230 for the FSB and no changes (up or down) for the CPU multi. Some allow no voltage changes for memory or CPU. Some allow no change in memory timings or HT multi.

As for the Voltage in CPU-z, it is not always accurate. Mine reads 0.99v all the time, no matter what I have it set at. I have a program that came with my MoBo and it reads exactly the same as BIOS.
Ok, well I guess that covers CPU-Z then. Now to figure out why I am idling at 60C
    
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post #7 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by sublimejhn View Post
Ok, well I guess that covers CPU-Z then. Now to figure out why I am idling at 60C
What is the BIOS reporting? Usually, if the BIOS is accurate, it reflects 80% of the full load temp.

Are you sure the HS is seated correctly... and/or did you use excessive TIM?
    
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post #8 of 17
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Duke View Post
What is the BIOS reporting? Usually, if the BIOS is accurate, it reflects 80% of the full load temp.

Are you sure the HS is seated correctly... and/or did you use excessive TIM?
Yeah, just redid it again. The BIOS is reporting 60C. I just but a small dot of AS5 on it, and it is making contact right in the center. The heatsink isn't even getting warm. I bought this thing because it was free after rebate one day so I figured I would give it a shot. Well it is clearly the single most useless heatsink known to man and the stock heatsink I am sure will be better. This thing is going straight in the trash

That sucks
    
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post #9 of 17
How is the contact surface? Rough or warped will screw you good!
    
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post #10 of 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by sublimejhn View Post
Yeah, just redid it again. The BIOS is reporting 60C. I just but a small dot of AS5 on it, and it is making contact right in the center. The heatsink isn't even getting warm. I bought this thing because it was free after rebate one day so I figured I would give it a shot. Well it is clearly the single most useless heatsink known to man and the stock heatsink I am sure will be better. This thing is going straight in the trash

That sucks
A cold heatsink fan can sometimes mean contact isn't even being made. But you've reseatted so many times... that's odd. What are you using to monitor temperatures? Brisbanes are notorious for having faulty temp sensors, I'm guessing the 60*C is way off.

As for the tRCD not "sticking", I've had that problem before on a Biostar board. Two of my timings and my CPU multiplier just would not change. That computer is now off with a family member so I can't test it further, but I've heard some people suggest that USB devices can cause this problem, and to unplug any USB device after changing a troublesome setting and reboot. Sometimes this can help make the setting change "stick". Haven't tried it out myself though.
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White Whale
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